Carvin: The Neverending Suckfest

[Jheake]

oh i listened to mountains of mars, and I could be wrong but im almost certain that the sound i was hearing was from a tube amp, it almost sounded SVTish, like i said i could be wrong but there is def a warm tubey tone there. If thats what hes going for its going to be hard to achieve with just a SS amp alone. Good luck

 

[theAntihero]

No all good bass players can play a variety of different styles be it with a pick or what ever, i wasnt exactly sure if you guys were in the "im primarily a guitar player but i can play bass for you guys" kind of situation ir not. I just cant understand why he would be so picky about the equipment he uses. I mean i can take any amp for the most part and find a decent tone on it. at least something playable.

im honestly out of suggestions and i think others might be too. just have him shop around, sorry about your experience with carvin and i hope you guys have better luck in the future.

He's being picky because he can at this point, he's using a behringer 4x10 combo now, and he makes it sound good except for the lack of headroom. He'd like to find "the" setup for him now.

I just realized i never really posted links to our music to give you an idea of playing style and such.

If you can get myspace's music player to work,and sometimes i cant, go to Link Removed and listen to Fine By Me for an idea of his octaved tone and Catch As Catch Can for a good idea of his normal tone. Or go on ITunes and search for the album ...And Then It Rains and both songs on it as well.

We did have to do some low end cutting from his live tone to make sure that we wouldnt kill some cheaper systems but its close to what he goes for.

 

[lbwdog]

Hmm, forgive me if im wrong, but isnt bass(or at least bass unlike my bassist tone) pretty full range? And isnt that cab fairly close to the whole fEarful thing ive read about?

Well bass guitar has a lot less upper freqs than actual "full range" sources, but it does contain upper harmonics. My point to Bart was that the LS cab was properly sized and ported for bass use, and the 15" driver was the same as used in their 1x15 bass cab, so where's the problem? Then I was dumbfounded when he claims under powering when we all know there is no such condition that would cause the cab to distort as it did.

And yes, the LS1503 was an inspiration for Greenboy's fEarful build, where he optimized the cabinet volume, port, and components to get the best 2/3-way design for us bassists who enjoy a clean, full-range tone with more than enough power handling.

Judging by your guy's tone goals, I would recommend a 1515/6 fearful. The Eminence 3015LF is said to be the best woofer you can buy without getting into the stratospheric price range. I have it in my Carvin cab, and I concur with that fact. Two would be totally KILLER!

My bassist likes his tone to be as clean as possible without much if any growl.
Hmm so in hybrid amps im guessing the tube is always in the input like the carvin? So basically, pun not intended, the input is being constantly overdriven?

No, the tube in most preamps is not intended exclusively for overdrive, but for those who seem to prefer the way a tube pre sounds.

Ya know, as I think about it, he might like the MarkBass LMTube 800 paired with a cab such as I described above.
Some of the guys around here don't like this amp's huge low end, but I've been able to tame it on mine, and it might be right up his alley. MarkBass also makes some non tube 800 watters as well. I do know this.....a rig like that would knock down walls!!!

 

[theAntihero]

Ya know, as I think about it, he might like the MarkBass LMTube 800 paired with a cab such as I described above.
Some of the guys around here don't like this amp's huge low end, but I've been able to tame it on mine, and it might be right up his alley. MarkBass also makes some non tube 800 watters as well. I do know this.....a rig like that would knock down walls!!!

Knocking down wall sounds like something that could describe his tone wants, ill pass it on,thanks.

oh i listened to mountains of mars, and I could be wrong but im almost certain that the sound i was hearing was from a tube amp, it almost sounded SVTish, like i said i could be wrong but there is def a warm tubey tone there. If thats what hes going for its going to be hard to achieve with just a SS amp alone. Good luck

Interesting, ill pass the info on. The only thing that worries him about tube amps is the afore mentioned grind. Any super high headroom tube amps out there besides the 400+?

Also i assume that the difference in power in SS vs Tube is similiar in bass amps as it is in guitar amps? I.E 400 tube powered watts is louder than 400 SS powered watts?

Did you by chance listen to the tracks i mentioned? Maybe that'll give you and others a better idea of what he's going for?

 

[BassmanPaul]

Honestly ive always wondered the same thing, wouldnt a true 4000w need 220 to work?

He was eq-ing sort of like an active control amp, start at noon and cut from there, which is what i assume you mean by leaving the bass control flat.

The EB-0 puts out enough lowend that he really doesnt have to push the bass contol, or even sub-bass control very high at all.

To get a true 4KW output you'd need a 220/240V 20A circuit.

An amplifier is flat when the unit neither boosts nor cuts frequencies. Amps with active controls tend to be at noon. Passives can be all over the place.

I agree fully about the EB0. I owned both an EB0F, had a fuzz built into it, and an EB2. The EB2, at least, had a choke (tone coil) wired across the signal that effectively shunted all the treble frequencies to ground. I redesigned the electrics with a three way and a two way toggle switches that reconfigured how the choke was used in the circuit and gave the bass a wide range of tonalities. Both these instruments were eventually stolen from me.

Paul

 

[theAntihero]

I agree fully about the EB0. I owned both an EB0F, had a fuzz built into it, and an EB2. The EB2, at least, had a choke (tone coil) wired across the signal that effectively shunted all the treble frequencies to ground. I redesigned the electrics with a three way and a two way toggle switches that reconfigured how the choke was used in the circuit and gave the bass a wide range of tonalities. Both these instruments were eventually stolen from me.

Yeah he's not really going for full range or more range so the EB-0 works well for him.

Its funny with cabs that have a switchable tweeter, turning it on doesnt do anything because there isnt anything in his tone that a tweeter can handle.

 

[BassmanPaul]

Its funny with cabs that have a switchable tweeter, turning it on doesnt do anything because there isnt anything in his tone that a tweeter can handle.

Precisely. When my EB0F was lost, I had just installed black nylon wound flats. With those you couldn't get any "twang". With the EB2 that replaced it, I started looking for more treble. Did the changes to the electrics and that got me more of what I was looking for. I then installed a new set of black nylon string. It then got stolen too. That made three basses that I had lost all sporting black nylon strings. I got the EB2 back and installed new Rotosound roundwounds on it. They had just hit the market. This was back in I guess '67.

Paul

 

[Sammy_L_D]

OR you could just buy him a SS guitar head give him a guitar and get a bass player who knows what hes doing? also a possibilty. We arent just guitar players who arent as good that play with a pick. There is a science behind bass amplification as well as being bass players. Get a bass player to play bass.

Annnd I just remembered why bassists are notorious for being snobs.

 

[Jheake]

Annnd I just remembered why bassists are notorious for being snobs.

Your two posts in this thread have both been trolling, at least im trying to help in anyway......

go back under your bridge troll. your more welcome there.

 

[1kinal]

If you can get myspace's music player to work,and sometimes i cant, go to Link Removed and listen to Fine By Me for an idea of his octaved tone and Catch As Catch Can for a good idea of his normal tone. Or go on ITunes and search for the album ...And Then It Rains and both songs on it as well.

We did have to do some low end cutting from his live tone to make sure that we wouldnt kill some cheaper systems but its close to what he goes for.

Wow, totally not what I expected. From what you say, he seems to play so loud and with so much low end that I was expecting heavy metal, down-tuned, fast tempo songs, etc...

From listening to "Cath as cath can", I don't really understand why he wants such a big setup as 1x18+4x10 and +1000 watts. If I'd be called to do your gig, I'd bring a 4x10 or 2x12 with my Shuttle 9.0 with a P-bass with flats and be perfectly happy (I'm not kidding or making fun of you, that's really what I would bring).

The way you describe his sound, my guess is he's probably a soundmen's worst nightmare on a gig who probably ends up not even putting the bass in the FOH mix. Am I wrong?

 

[Lackey]

Does anybody else think his tone sounds really gated/clipped?! I'm starting to think this isn't the amps fault at all.... I bet his input gain is clipping constantly and he's completely oblivious to it.

Honestly judging from the tone the amp sounds like it's being pushed waay too hard to me. But what do I know.

 

[theAntihero]

Does anybody else think his tone sounds really gated/clipped?! I'm starting to think this isn't the amps fault at all.... I bet his input gain is clipping constantly and he's completely oblivious to it.

Honestly judging from the tone the amp sounds like it's being pushed waay too hard to me. But what do I know.

The tone on our album is direct to the board, no amp at all.

We didnt really have any problems with clipping into the input, but it is compressed more than he usually does,which isnt at all, live.

The way you describe his sound, my guess is he's probably a soundmen's worst nightmare on a gig who probably ends up not even putting the bass in the FOH mix. Am I wrong?

No, he is usually put thru the sound system. He really cant play that loud with his 450w behringer before his limiter engages. His live tone is deeper than the studio sound, mostly because his live tone would destroy a small cd player with not the greatest speakers and we want the cd to be playable for everyone.

I don't really understand why he wants such a big setup as 1x18+4x10 and +1000 watts. If I'd be called to do your gig, I'd bring a 4x10 or 2x12 with my Shuttle 9.0 with a P-bass with flats and be perfectly happy (I'm not kidding or making fun of you, that's really what I would bring).

Its a headroom thing rather than a volume thing, he doesnt usually play that loud( im regreting mentioning the 126db now, but i was trying to say something nice about the Carvin).

With a very deep tone, a felt pick and a hard attack he eats up headroom quite fast, so thats why he needs a lot of it.

 

[Sammy_L_D]

Your two posts in this thread have both been trolling, at least im trying to help in anyway......

go back under your bridge troll. your more welcome there.

Stereotyping and insulting ones musician friend is hardly a helpful gesture. OBVIOUSLY this fellow must be some dullard of a guitar player...

There was an issue at hand, and it's great that Carvin is living up to their reputation of great customer service to rectify it.

 

[Bass_Pounder]

Wow, totally not what I expected. From what you say, he seems to play so loud and with so much low end that I was expecting heavy metal, down-tuned, fast tempo songs, etc...

From listening to "Cath as cath can", I don't really understand why he wants such a big setup as 1x18+4x10 and +1000 watts. If I'd be called to do your gig, I'd bring a 4x10 or 2x12 with my Shuttle 9.0 with a P-bass with flats and be perfectly happy (I'm not kidding or making fun of you, that's really what I would bring).

The way you describe his sound, my guess is he's probably a soundmen's worst nightmare on a gig who probably ends up not even putting the bass in the FOH mix. Am I wrong?

+1

Based on all the interactions (and the OP's screen name) I expected down tuned doom/stoner - pleasantly surprised.

However, I must say that although tone is a personal thing, to me it just sounds so out of place and not the kind of tone I would lay down on songs like that.

The bass player has some nice riffs, but because of how he EQ's, goes basically unnoticed because of the mud.

Nice Vox by the way - reminds me of Al Stewart (Year Of The Cat).

 

[bass4worship]

I guess we are the quality control unit for Carvin. I guessing I'm lucky never have a problem with them.

 

[Mark Olson]

All of the Carvin gear I've played or heard sounded horrible. Sorry Carvin, not a fan.

 

[STARKEY97]

I had a carvin 5 string go bad on me, when the neck just couldnt get right. It was out of warranty but i sent it in to be fixed. They took the electronics out of the body and put them in a new body ---no charge--- I quit using their amps as they always seemed underpowered but the customer service was always spot on with me. Take your issue to the next guy up the chain and good luck.

 

[Munjibunga]

All of the Carvin gear I've played or heard sounded horrible. Sorry Carvin, not a fan.

I don't care for the sound of Carvin, either, but I wouldn't say horrible. Just not that good. Their basses are nice, though.

 

[mulchor]

I was recently searching for a prev post regarding Carvin, and Google confirmed my memory -- we have a large number of posts regarding failure to perform by Carvin amp gear. Not so much their basses, but the amps get a lot of "problem with my..." threads.

Happily, none of them have such an inflammatory title.

 

[gastric]

I can hear where he's trying to get that Electric Wizard tone via EQ. But Electric Wizard sounds to me like a smooth tube overdrive, not just a clean sound heavily EQ'ed towards bass. And played towards the neck, not the bridge. Helps bring out that smooth low end.