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Cliff Burton

#21
René_Julien;8070903 said:
Maybe it was in honor of their new bassist. All the other songs were created with Ron McGovney. So if it wasn't for Anesthesia Cliff would have nothing to do with Kill Em All as an artist.
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Yeah. That is a good point. He was obviously more involved with the writing during Ride The Lightning. Unfortunately it's not quite as easy to discern his lines amidst the ungodly heavy guitars on RTL (and they STILL sound ungodly heavy to me, even to this day). It sounds like he is really tearing it up in several places, particularly in The Call Of Ktulu.
 
#23
Mad Russian said:
Yeah, Search youtube for "Metallica Master Bass Tracks" - you will have a greater appreciation for what his did behind those guitars.
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Also,...
This is what many people don't know.

Who composed most of the music.
He told how the majority of the guitarparts must be played.
Nothing wrong with those distorted guitars, I'm a metalhead and I like such guitarwork too.


And how cool can a guy be if he was a respected authority over 2 d-bags like J&L?

Jason, too bad he experienced the opposite when he joined Metallica.

I like Jason too, but Jason is a rock bassist, Cliff was a metal bassist.
 
#24
René_Julien;8071792 said:
I like Jason too, but Jason is a rock bassist, Cliff was a metal bassist.
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Nonsense!!! Jason Newsted is metal to the bones and ALWAYS will be!

Jason was never allowed to write much for metallica, after Cliff's death Lars and James totally took over.

I heard in a radio interview from 84 with Cliff, somewhere on youtube, that he was not satisfied with how low the bass was mixed on RTL (kinda' obvious, but still interesting to hear it from the man himself).
 
#25
René_Julien;8071792 said:
Also,...
This is what many people don't know.

Who composed most of the music.
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James Hetfield. Unless you have some proof that this isn't the case.

René_Julien;8071792 said:
He told how the majority of the guitarparts must be played.
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Again I would like to see some proof.


EDIT: Something more...
Have you looked at the song writing credits for the Burton era songs?

1. "Hit the Lights"
James Hetfield, Lars Ulrich

2. "The Four Horsemen"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Dave Mustaine

3. "Motorbreath"
Hetfield

4. "Jump in the Fire"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Mustaine

5. "(Anesthesia) Pulling Teeth" (Instrumental)
Cliff Burton

6. "Whiplash"
Hetfield, Ulrich

7. "Phantom Lord"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Mustaine

8. "No Remorse"
Hetfield, Ulrich

9. "Seek & Destroy"
Hetfield, Ulrich

10. "Metal Militia"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Mustaine


1. "Fight Fire with Fire"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Burton

2. "Ride the Lightning"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Burton, Mustaine

3. "For Whom the Bell Tolls"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Burton

4. "Fade to Black"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Burton, Hammett

5. "Trapped Under Ice"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Hammett

6. "Escape"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Hammett

7. "Creeping Death"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Burton, Hammett

8. "The Call of Ktulu" (Instrumental)
Hetfield, Ulrich, Burton, Mustaine


1. "Battery"
Hetfield, Ulrich

2. "Master of Puppets"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Burton, Hammett

3. "The Thing That Should Not Be"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Hammett

4. "Welcome Home (Sanitarium)"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Hammett

5. "Disposable Heroes"
Hetfield, Ulrich, Hammett

6. "Leper Messiah"
Hetfield, Ulrich

7. "Orion" (Instrumental)
Hetfield, Ulrich, Burton

8. "Damage, Inc."
Hetfield, Ulrich, Burton, Hammett

Assuming Metallica has used the classical "who has had most to do with the creation of the song get's his name first"-system, you can quite clearly see who is the main songwriter/riff-creator. Also you can see that Burton's name pop's up about just as often as Hammet's.
 
#26
For the most part, metal bassist do not impress me. Probably because their limited due to the guitars. But there are 2 cats that ya'll need to add to this. But I don't know their names. One guy is the bro that plays for BLS. That short dude. I don't know what he does on the cd's, but the guy lives near me and I saw him once in a local music store and man can he play! The other guy, of which I don't even know who he plays for, but he plays a fretless in a metal band. Maybe John is his first name. Ya'll need to check out those cats. And I'm sure you crazy metal guys will know who I'm talking about.
 
#31
René_Julien;8066169 said:
And Cliff died too young (in a stupid freak accident :(), he didn't even got the chance to do so much more as a bassist, musician, composer,.....
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Sometimes dying young is the best way to be recognised. You sign-off (so to speak) when you are in your prime, and as a result become immortalised.

While he didn't get the chance to do much more as a musician due to dying young, he was fortunate enough to do what so many musicians can only dream of. To play on arguably one of the best metal albums of all time.
 
#33
Scroller said:
(Anesthesia) Pulling Teeth is a fantastic piece of music. The fact that it is soaked in distortion and wah effects and somehow manages to remain musical and interesting tells you that it was created by a very talented individual. There's more than enough there to keep the listener's interest (even non-bass fanatics), and I always thought it was a nice touch to have Lars join in at the end. A ballsy decision too, to record an extended bass solo on a debut metal album...
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+100.

That is, without a doubt, the solo that sealed my commitment to the bass. I was more of a rhythm player in my 1st few years of playing and I was pretty damn good, but once I heard that solo it answered everything I was looking to play. I always loved the feel and emotion of guitar solos and wanted to find a way to bring it to the bass and I looked for influences, and while many came close, none really sounded right. Then I heard Cliff Burton, the man got it right note by note, wah squeals, and more. And you're right about the solo being drenched in distortion because he sounded greater (IMO) without it. I also think the man was really at heart a Fusion player, the way he solo'd live brought out a new beast when he didn't just stick to the arpeggios of Pulling Teeth, he had many ideas that he could compose much more future bass solos for albums.

Here's a few of my favorite solos from him live, not totally drenched in distortion but rather in feel:

 
#38
MoBeach said:
Martin Mendez from Opeth has some of the fastest fingers I've seen. When I saw them open for Dream Theater I expected him to be a pick player because of the speed but I was wrong.

I think Burton is the pioneer for Prog Metal Bassists. He has very good musical vision.
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Mendez is a Monster, no doubt of that. I really dig Cliffs work, but I don't personally consider him the best. There are tons of relatively unknown incredible bassists in the obscure euro/uk/scandanavian world that get no props. I think he did the most for bringing bass out into the metalhead music world and getting some love for the bass player in metal. Due to this and his high profile life/death he has had such an influence that he can't be discounted. But on sheer technique there are better. Steve Harris does a lot for me, and again, listen to Opeth. Once you find the bass in there its all you'll focus on. God Forbid has some pretty sick bass licks going too (can't recall the guys name, but he is pretty nasty)
 
#40
bobba66 said:
That Steve Harris guy is pretty good, too.
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+1 for me as well. He and Geezer Butler were the one's that got me into bass. Not to take anythng away from Cliff, it's just that I hadn't discovered Metallica yet.

What I find interesting about players like Cliff Burton and Jamerson is that even though they're very good, if you watch their technique, almost any 'bass teacher' would tell you they are playing completely wrong. Because Jamerson started off on the Double Bass he tended to use just one finger on his right hand and Cliff's left and right had techniques would anger most purists. I've watched live videos of Butler and some times he just smacks the crap out of his bass.
I guess technique isn't everything.
 

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