Considering Taking up Keyboards

[Flatwoundround]

I love playing bass and have played the last several years in a band (although currently not in a band).

However, I am considering quitting bass and taking up keyboards for the following reasons:

1. I want to be able to play an instrument by itself and have it sound full and complete. For example, if we have guests in our home I would love to be able to play some music for them and in my opinion the bass just does not sound good when played alone. Keyboards can play basslines and layer on harmony and melody at the same time but the bass is much more difficult to achieve this (even two hand tapping does not do it for me). I know there are some bass players that can sound great playing alone (wooten, manring, etc.) but I am not one of them and have doubts I ever would be.

2. Want the option to not only play alone but play in band. I notice that keyboards is the instrument that is the least common (per my bandmix analysis). I sampled lots of instruments on band mix and the short story is keys are the least common, then bass, then drums and vocals, and guitars are in excess abundance. Bottom line is that I think it would be easy to find a band playing keys (bass also)

3. Tone issues. Fret buzz, finger noise, darker murkier sounding notes, pick click. For me I have yet to overcome these tonal issues completely playing bass. In fact I think I just got so used to a lot of this but the other night I played some keys and the tone was so clean, and no fret buzz of course or pick click or finger noise.

4 Playing solos - I just think the bass is at a disadvantage here compared to guitar or keys. I would get one or two solos in the band I was in but it just did not do it for me. Part of that is the tone and lack of high end register and some of it is because the low end drops out and that makes the solo sound weaker.


Not sure I am going to switch to keys completly but sure am considering it. I sure do love ghost notes and slides and do not see how the keys could play these but maybe I am wrong on this.


I have 2 to 3 hours every day to practice music so I think within a year or so I could be OK on keys. Having knowledge of rhythm and harmony already so seems like just transfering over to keys should be helpful. The keys are non-symmetrical unlike the bass so that aspect will seem much harder for sure.

Playing both bass and keys is not something I would want to do since my personality is sort of the all or nothing type and I would rather put all my energy into just one instrument and work on getting good on just one rather than sloppier on two instruments.

Sorry if this is sort of an incoherent littany but curious about what others think.

Thanks.

 

[MalcolmAmos]

Sounds like you would like to play keys. OK here is my input.

• Keyboard are easy to find and you can get started for as little or as much money as you want to spend.
• In less than a year you will be able to play "chord piano" (do a Google) in a band setting using lead sheets or fake chord sheet music.
• Playing piano, as most people think of playing piano, is going to take a lot longer. But, you have the rest of your life so get started.
• All kind of videos and lessons on the Internet. I like Yoke Wong's stuff. And recommend Alfred's 1, 2 & 3 books.

Have fun. Here is a little more on Yoke Wong's lessons:



A live teacher right at first is really necessary, and yes running your scales and how to do them correctly needs to be in your bag of tricks. That live teacher will give you all that and save you a lot of time.

Good luck.

 

[repoman]

Your reasons for taking up piano/keyboard are solid!
I was given an inexpensive Casio keyboard a little over a year ago and just started messing around with it. Within the first month I knew I wanted to really play it so I picked up the book "How to Play Piano Despite Years of Lessons..." best piano instruction book I have seen so far.Now I never had "years of lessons" but this book cuts right to the chase and starts teaching chords- not scales or "studies"- just three, four and five note chords (...which went hand in hand with my bass playing very nicely). After three month on the cheapo Casio I broke down and purchases a used Roland digital piano (FP 5 stage piano) Love it, that's all I want to play now!
I have a couple dozen songs under my belt playing basically chords on my right hand and a bass line on my left.
I'm currently looking to join a band (I just quit my last one, too much drama, blah, blah, blah...) where I hope to play both bass and keyboard. Something like this...lol Link Removed
(This was taken at my summer picnic last month )If you want to switch to straight keyboard I think you will be just as much in demand as a bass player.
Good luck man!

 

[Big Hoss]

I am NOT going to tell anyone not to grow as a musician, but I will urge you to grow, and not simply transition from one instrument to the other. Bass has its place, and is a wonderful instrument. If you are creative enough you CAN and I do make music that is solely using bass, and admittedly my vocals, and aside from my aging vocal cords, it sounds good, and is a fun jam for everyone... (Learn to play Suicide is Painless, the MASH fans around you will love it!).

My bass teacher now, and many music teachers I had as a kid oh so many years ago gave, and continue to give me a great piece of encouragement.

Don't learn to be a (insert the instrument of your choice here) player, learn to be a musician that plays (insert the instrument of your choice here).

There is a huge difference...

My practice time as of late has been broken up into 3 segments. Segment #1. Bass. Education, practice, and free play. Segment #2. Electric, and / or acoustic Guitar education, and practice. (I am not good enough yet to free play guitar), and lastly, Segment #3. Percussion free play. I have a cheap set of bongos, one of those shaker egg moraccas, and a desktop (no joke) that depending on how you drum it, produces some warm, deep tone... The only time I will say this, but in this case, Thank God for particle board!

We have a beach party weekend coming up toward the end of the month with family, my nephew will be dragging his strat along, another nephew plays nothing but bass, and 2 of the brothers in law play acoustic / spanish style guitar, I guess I am going to be doing some percussion for that jam...

Long winded story wrapped up, if you pidgeon hole yourself into one instrument, you are severely limited in your opportunities for musical expression. Kind of like a painter that insists on using only one brush. While it can be done, you are limited to what you can do...

 

[ksm]

Glad to hear that i'm not alone with this. I recently bought a $50 keyboard off CL and have really enjoyed learning on it. Right now I spend about 15-30 minutes per day with lessons from easypiano.com (no affiliation) and have noticed significant improvement. This last Saturday I took the plunge and ordered a full size yamaha p-115 as part of a labor day sale. Should be arriving tomorrow and I am excited to get my hands on it.

Bass is first but I really like how easy it is to visualize the keyboard and the note relationships on the keyboard. I feel that my bass playing has already benefited because of this.

 

[Chad Michael]

Although bass is my first love, it wasn't my first instrument. I had expressed interest in piano as a little kid, folks started me on piano lessons around age 10. At that time, my heart just wasn't in to it. Quit after less than a year of lessons.

Fast forward - age 15, fell in love with playing electric bass. Then out of nowhere (or so it seemed), there was an itch to learn piano / keyboards... I later realized why. A substitiute teacher in our high school jazz band absolutely captivated us students with his desire to teach, and make learning / performing fun.

I asked this teacher if he gave private lessons, he said yes. Took keyboard lessons and went from 'zero' to 'good enough to play a few songs with a cover band' in about 6-9 months... In recent years, I've had the good fortune of being in a band that I played keys on half the songs, and bass on the other half.

Moral of the story: Do both. Don't get hung up on expensive, complicated gear - just move forward on both fronts and have fun. I will say that there is an element of playing bass on stage that I love, same can be said for the keys.

Best of luck to you.... finding the right teacher can make a huge difference.

p.s. Do yourself a huge favor and start on a keyboard instrument that has full size keys and is touch - sensitive.

 

[Flatwoundround]

Thanks everyone for the replies and lots of good points.

I just got back from GC on my lunch break to check out some keys. One thing the sales guy said that kind of turned me off is how he does not play much keys but he can "fool" people into thinking he is a great player by turning on the arppegiator and sequencer.

So I realize my real desire is not so much to play keys as it is to play an instrument that sounds good all by itself. So i am pondering staying with bass and adding the acoustic guitar with the idea that the bass is to play with other musicians and the guitar is to be played as an unacompanied instrument. Not sure if I will do this or just take the plunge and transition over to the keys full time. Pros and cons to both for sure like I used to play acoustic guitar long time ago and they are pretty lightweight and mobil (for example like outdoor types of social events that my wife might drag me to at least I can bring the guitar and get some practice and try to entertain people). But the keys sound so good with the funky clav sound. On the other hand playing some fingerstyle chet atkins or classical type stuff on acoustic can really sound great too.

So for me it is either one of two options:

1. Continue playing bass as I am but add acoustic guitar where the guitar is for playing unaccompanied music and the bass is traditional type of support role in band.
2. Take on keys full time which covers both needs - playing in a band and playing by itself and sounding complete.

But no way will I play all 3 instruments cause then I am sure my wife will give me the you know what.

 

[Big Hoss]

Thanks everyone for the replies and lots of good points.

I just got back from GC on my lunch break to check out some keys. One thing the sales guy said that kind of turned me off is how he does not play much keys but he can "fool" people into thinking he is a great player by turning on the arppegiator and sequencer.

So I realize my real desire is not so much to play keys as it is to play an instrument that sounds good all by itself. So i am pondering staying with bass and adding the acoustic guitar with the idea that the bass is to play with other musicians and the guitar is to be played as an unacompanied instrument. Not sure if I will do this or just take the plunge and transition over to the keys full time. Pros and cons to both for sure like I used to play acoustic guitar long time ago and they are pretty lightweight and mobil (for example like outdoor types of social events that my wife might drag me to at least I can bring the guitar and get some practice and try to entertain people). But the keys sound so good with the funky clav sound. On the other hand playing some fingerstyle chet atkins or classical type stuff on acoustic can really sound great too.

So for me it is either one of two options:

1. Continue playing bass as I am but add acoustic guitar where the guitar is for playing unaccompanied music and the bass is traditional type of support role in band.
2. Take on keys full time which covers both needs - playing in a band and playing by itself and sounding complete.

But no way will I play all 3 instruments cause then I am sure my wife will give me the you know what.

On the wife issue. Involve her if you can... You'd be amazed how supportive women can be when they are involved in your interests...

 

[Flatwoundround]

Your reasons for taking up piano/keyboard are solid!
I was given an inexpensive Casio keyboard a little over a year ago and just started messing around with it. Within the first month I knew I wanted to really play it so I picked up the book "How to Play Piano Despite Years of Lessons..." best piano instruction book I have seen so far.Now I never had "years of lessons" but this book cuts right to the chase and starts teaching chords- not scales or "studies"- just three, four and five note chords (...which went hand in hand with my bass playing very nicely). After three month on the cheapo Casio I broke down and purchases a used Roland digital piano (FP 5 stage piano) Love it, that's all I want to play now!
I have a couple dozen songs under my belt playing basically chords on my right hand and a bass line on my left.
I'm currently looking to join a band (I just quit my last one, too much drama, blah, blah, blah...) where I hope to play both bass and keyboard. Something like this...lol Link Removed
(This was taken at my summer picnic last month )If you want to switch to straight keyboard I think you will be just as much in demand as a bass player.
Good luck man!

 

[Flatwoundround]

Thanks Repoman.

I think I feel exactly the same as you about keyboards. I was considering going back to classical guitar training in conjunction with the bass UNTIL I just saw a youtube video today where I guy was playing a KORG with nylon string setting and it sounded absolutely divine. So clean and beautiful sounding, like a sound you would hear in heaven. The steel string setting sounded really really good too.

Good luck in your musical journey.

 

[ryco]

Started learning keyboards and guitar for pretty much the same reason you site of wanting to play instruments that sound good solo.
Highly encourage you to learn keys! It is such a good instrument to know on so many levels.

I'm almost 60 and really wish I would have sat down and seriously taken up keyboards decades ago. Had a piano in my house around jr hi as my mom was learning to play. The piano store offered her lessons and she wanted to know if I wanted to take. At that time wasn't interested. Basic piano skills would have made college theory courses so much easier! Married a keyboard player (and guitar, violin, flute, singer) in my twenties, so there were always keys around. She also has been teaching piano for years. There were plenty of beginner books lying around. Wasn't 'til about 3 years ago I sat down and started learning. Pretty slow for me even though I'm spending two one hour sessions a day -- it's just now starting to get fluid. Not saying that to discourage - I'm doing the beginner way an a bove poster said would take a longer time. I'm doing the old John Thompkins Adult lessons. I did go thru Alfred 1 & 2 and they were OK. JT is a little more advanced. But if you can find a faster method GO FOR IT! lol I'm in no super hurry anymore as I'm not going on the road or seeking fame & fortune. Just want to play keys. I have no idea how long it will take before I'll be comfortable playing keys with others as a competent player. No hurries - no worries!

A friend passed away a couple of years ago and left a tele copy guitar to me, so have been learning through chord books. It comes a lot faster, but not putting a lot of time into it. About 40 minutes a day. Stil, learning chords and little lead licks/patterns comes pretty quick. Probably because it's a string instrument, so more familiar.

 

[markjsmithbass]

I played keys as a kid way before I played bass and I think it was a huge help in getting my head around learning 'music' (as opposed to learning just 'bass). You sound like the kind of person that's willing to venture into music as a whole. Try not to get hung up on one particular instrument. Every brilliant musician I've ever known or met can play a wide variety of instruments. One thing's for sure, if you devote some time to learning piano I can guarantee that when you try going back to playing bass, in whatever capacity, you'll see it from a completely different perspective and possibly find it more of a joy to play.

One bandleader that I used to play with a lot was grade 8 piano and grade 8 sax and I always found it confusing because I didn't know whether to call him a pianist or a sax player. He usually played piano when leading a band but also played sax usually as a sideman. We taught together at a music college and I soon found that he could also play guitar to a high standard and drums to a fairly OK standard. One day I was reading through a grade 8 level piece for an upcoming set of student exams and I was explaining to him how I couldn't tell whether the piece was too difficult. He had a look, took my bass and sight read through the whole thing with just minor hesitations on some high double stops. I'd never even seen him play bass before. I asked him how he could do that on all these instruments and he explained how learning piano was perfect for developing multi instrumentalist skills because he knows how to read bass and treble clef and also has to be able to play melodies, chords and basslines all the time. So it stands to reason that he simply knows the notes. If you know the notes you need or want to play then it's just a matter of learning the notes and basic techniques of each instrument. Because he could also play sax to a high level it meant he could play most woodwind instruments quite well. He enjoyed messing on guitar so he knew the notes on the neck which transposed easily to bass and he also spent a lot of time arranging so he spent many hours transcribing and writing drum parts which helped him get by on drums. The key part of this story is that it mainly stemmed from learning piano. I would advise any bass player to learn piano alongside bass. It makes a MASSIVE difference to your bass playing.

Mark

 

[Flatwoundround]

I played keys as a kid way before I played bass and I think it was a huge help in getting my head around learning 'music' (as opposed to learning just 'bass). You sound like the kind of person that's willing to venture into music as a whole. Try not to get hung up on one particular instrument. Every brilliant musician I've ever known or met can play a wide variety of instruments. One thing's for sure, if you devote some time to learning piano I can guarantee that when you try going back to playing bass, in whatever capacity, you'll see it from a completely different perspective and possibly find it more of a joy to play.

One bandleader that I used to play with a lot was grade 8 piano and grade 8 sax and I always found it confusing because I didn't know whether to call him a pianist or a sax player. He usually played piano when leading a band but also played sax usually as a sideman. We taught together at a music college and I soon found that he could also play guitar to a high standard and drums to a fairly OK standard. One day I was reading through a grade 8 level piece for an upcoming set of student exams and I was explaining to him how I couldn't tell whether the piece was too difficult. He had a look, took my bass and sight read through the whole thing with just minor hesitations on some high double stops. I'd never even seen him play bass before. I asked him how he could do that on all these instruments and he explained how learning piano was perfect for developing multi instrumentalist skills because he knows how to read bass and treble clef and also has to be able to play melodies, chords and basslines all the time. So it stands to reason that he simply knows the notes. If you know the notes you need or want to play then it's just a matter of learning the notes and basic techniques of each instrument. Because he could also play sax to a high level it meant he could play most woodwind instruments quite well. He enjoyed messing on guitar so he knew the notes on the neck which transposed easily to bass and he also spent a lot of time arranging so he spent many hours transcribing and writing drum parts which helped him get by on drums. The key part of this story is that it mainly stemmed from learning piano. I would advise any bass player to learn piano alongside bass. It makes a MASSIVE difference to your bass playing.

Mark

Thanks Mark. You are an awesome player and teacher.

I realize I just have a strong desire to play unacompanied and the vehicle is either classical guitar or keys. To me, bass is great for playing with other musicians but by itself to entertain folks seems challenging for me. I practice everyday for 2 hours on bass so perhaps doing 1 hour on bass and one hour on either classical guitar or keys might be the way to go. I was thinking classical guitar would be easier for me since I used to play guitar many years ago and given the similarity between the bass and the guitar in terms of mechanics (Ryco made a good point about that above).

Thanks much and I sure do appreciate your lessons online (they come through very clear and with good energy).

 

[LeoFromPortland]

I started on keyboards. This was my instrument, practicing piano as a kid, getting lessons which ended up, to the chagrin of my classical-music family, leading me to techno and prog rock on synthesizers.
It looks deceptively easy. My uncles could pound out Chopsticks on the piano -- a piece forbidden in my house growing up -- but there are a lot of things you have to learn before you can play as you describe.
Piano students take years before they can play keyboard parts successfully. That doesn't mean you will, of course. But you will have to get used to learning such things as fingerings for every scale pattern and every chord pattern. In every key. There are some fundamental rules that help you with this, but it's very different from bass in this way.

Keyboard instrumensts have a very long history. A lot of old-world tradition, if you learn classical foundations. But even those who claim they have never had a lesson still express a lot of these old-world foundations. I think as a kid, I really didn't appreciate that we who play keyboards really do stand on the shoulders of giants.

The thing I imagine would probably frustrate a guitarist / bassist / horn player when switching to piano is that the tone you strive to work on is mainly the attack of the note. That and pedal technique. You have no vibrato, and glissandos -- slides -- are less common on keys by far than other instruments.

The exception is if you get real keyboard synthesizers. And you'll need an expression pedal for this also. Then you learn how to phrase and use the pitch bend and modulation wheel properly. I don't know what that would be like all at once when new, because I was given piano lessons for a good number of years as a kid, and didn't start on keyboards until my teen years.

If you have a problem with the "nerdy" reputation of playing keys, I find keyboardists who sing are less "nerdy". I was the nerdy gearhead who played multiple keyboards at the same time in the late 80s early 90s, never sang unless pressed to do a minor vocals backup line.

But let me say this: If you understand the layout and the fingering, and work at your scales / arpeggios, keyboard solos are in fact wicked awesomeness! If you learn how to patch ont the fly and adjust parameters on the fly --- the latter more common with analog synthesizers -- your solos become even more wicked awesome!

But being able to play pieces on the piano -- any piano -- unplugged, in a living room or elsewhere, is very very nice. I spent a few years in the 90s doing classical-ish new-age atmospheric piano here in the Pacific Northwest at wineries and other rich people places. It's something that's forever. An experience no amount of drinkin' and thinkin' would let you forget.

It's my opinion more people should try it, but I'm very biased. I know many keyboardists who never were into writing their own patches or just basic on electronics, but played piano.

Hell, I auditioned with a guy last year who played that sweet, timeless, Fats Domino type piano *and* sang. I didn't think I was a fit at all. But I'd go sit and listen to him anytime. He wasn't exactly a gearhead either, even though he used a nice Nord. Just one of those timeless, kinda old-timey players.
Lot of ways to do keyboards, everything from organ to piano to synthesizers. Welcome to the club; generations of people before us have had the same desires to make music for people in their home. And a great many used keyboard instruments, from harpsichord through all the evolutions of the piano, to keyboard synthesizers, to do it.

 

[Tyco666]

I know zero about playing piano but I have seen many a great bass player who can also smash it on the keys (John Paul Jones comes to mind). Having both disciplines surely would make you a very accomplished musician.