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Demonator vs Thunderbird vs Phoenix

Gwardar

Gwardar

May 24, 2009
408
22
Australia
#1
Hi,

I'm GASing for a new bass and these are the ones I was thinking about:

Thunderbird Goth (Epiphone, Gibson doesn't make them AFAIK)
ESP Phoenix II (I think it'll be LTD, the real ESP is a bit out my budget ~$2000 or so).
Dean Demonator 4 (neck though, Bartollini pup, looks cool).

If you had these choices which one would you pick? Or perhaps somebody had a similar dillema and solved it :)

Please note that I have already figured out myself that the best thing to do would be to go to the shop and try them all. Obviously the reason I am asking for help is because above is not possible. If you ever tried to shop for anything in Australia you'll know why :)

I'm particularly interested in the Dean one. It ticks all the boxes: looks, got neck through body and decent pickups. My issue is I'll be buying online, so bascially stabbing the dark.

Has anybody got any experience with these basses? Am I likely to get a dud? Or perhaps they are consistently junk? The prices are between $700-$1000. The USA ones are around $1800, so I assume I was looking at Asian-built versions. So are the LTDs and Epiphones.

Any help and opinions are appreciated. Cheers

MP
 
#3
Of those, the espltd or dean. But like bassplayer8953 suggests, the epi pro thunderbird would be worth concidering to. One thing to keep in mind if you havent played a bass with the type of curve to its rear. BC Rich mockingbird also shares that trait and might be worth concidering to if body shape is large part of the attraction to these basses. Anyway, with that type of rear body curve & the placement of front strap button further back. I find myself feeling like the reach to nut is farther then with other 34 scale basses. And if you like to rest the rear of body against upper leg, its also a bit awkward. They look nice and Ive owned tbirds and mockingbirds and while I like their appearance, I found them to be more awkward then most other basses and guitars. One can get used to it. But is diff a try them or similiar first to see if you can find it as enjoyable to play as it is to look at.

Of the three, Id prob be a bit partial to the dean or esp because pup replacement options are going to be greater then it will be with the epi tbird with its gibson type pups. The deans longer top horn would also be a plus regards the reach to nut thing and less likely to neck dive since front strap button is further forward.
 
#4
darkstorm said:
(...). Anyway, with that type of rear body curve & the placement of front strap button further back. I find myself feeling like the reach to nut is farther then with other 34 scale basses. (...)
Click to expand...

Thanks for the thoughts. Interesting - I didn't know that the nut felt farther. That would be of importance because I haven't got huge hands. Used to have a few 35"-scale basses and they didn't feel as comfortable as 34".

I could probably find the Epi TB in a local shop and check it out. No such chance with LTD or Dean.

Re: BC Rich
This stuff almost constantly gets bad press. The main message usually sugessts to stay away from it unless it's a US version. I don't think you can get a US Mockingbird now and it would be probably ca $2000.

Re: Looks
Yeah, there is some attraction there :) My other basses are rather vanilla shaped, so I thought I could get one with a bit more zing this time.
 
#5
O allmost forgot, tbirds are one of the most neck divey basses ever invented. Lots of gibson tbirds got their headstocks broken or cracked cause of that. The cause of this is largely due to the lack of a top horn for strap button. This in itself tend to put the bass neck further away from you as it hangs on strap to. The bass is pushed out away from you to the side which just further exasperates that long reach to nut feeling. Tbirds are a shape for bass & guitar I want to love, but their awkwardness makes that impossible.

The dean would suffer the least from these design problems. I had a used midline neck thru demonator bass many yrs ago. Was decent bass. But moved on to ones whose sound worked better for me. There pups where not as good back then as now imo. It did have good balance on strap. Something neither tbird I had could do, it also suffered the least from nut reach with its upper horn putting strap more where it need to be so can hug bass in rather then it wanting to scamper away from you sideways. Lol.
 
#6
I'd go the Tbird myself. I don't find the neck dive to be too bad on my Gibson with a thick leather strap (and on the Epi you could always move the strap nut to the neck bolt). Also I cannot stand Dean and don't really like ESP either. Go with the one you like the look of most though I think, you said this is because you want something a bit more out there and they will all probably be of a pretty similar quality (Epi is Samick, cheap ESP is Cort, Dean is probably one of those also).
 
#7
Funny, I found myself in this exact quandary today. I opted for the thunderbird classic pro. I'll tell you why: unlike the standard epiphone T-bird, the classic pro has actual GIBSON USA TB plus pickups. Not epiphone pups. It has a 9 ply mahogany, walnut neckthru body just like its Gibson cousin, it has the strap lock on the back, which eliminates the "neck dive" problem (I always hated people who complain about this. Be a man and hold the f$&@ing bass!). It is in every way a gibson (with improvements) with the name epiphone on it. About the phoenix: great bass. The Tbird is what it is. It has decades of legendary service under its belt and doesn't have to prove anything to anyone anymore. It seems that ESP really went hard to try to one up the Tbird and in some ways, it worked! However, don't think you're gonna cut corners and walk away on top with an LTD. This only applies to the ESP and if you're like most of us, you can't afford one. The LTD makes a solid effort with the deluxe. You get the look and an ebony fingerboard, insures you get the feel of a high end luxury bass. the pickups are EMG 35DC soap bars on the bridge and neck as with the ESP which is why I really can't tell you why the LTD sounds so nasal where the ESP not so much but that is exactly the case. All told the LTD phoenix is still a great bass and if they still have the used one I played today at $449, you better believe papa will be back next week for it. However you just can't go wrong with the epiphone pro (epiphone USA pickups but active with 4 tone controls! 7 ply neck)or classic pro (Gibson USA TB pickups 9 ply neck).
 
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#8
Jay F. said:
Funny, I found myself in this exact quandary today. I opted for the thunderbird classic pro. (...)
Click to expand...
I think you made a good choice. I ended up with a different LTD (F-414FM); the Phoenix was nearly impossible to get, so I gave up on the shape and got this one instead. This purchase was an absolute fail. This bass is nothing more than a snow shovel and sadly we get no snow here. I bought it online without trying; common issue here - there is no local stock to try.

Yes, it has the EMGs 35DC, EMS preamp, neck through body, ebony fingerboard (apparently), so it should be half-decent. It isn't. Funny you say the Phoenix LTD sounds nasal, because mine also sounds like it has a cold. Oh, also lifeless and boring.

It's going to be a project bass, so when I decide to try my own luthier skills (i.e. try to lean how to level the frets) - this one will get off the wall hook, otherwise it's purely ornamental. Tried to gig with it - fail. Any other bass I had crapped all over it.

Should've bought the T-bird pro. Never mind, not the first mistake and probably not the last one either :-)
 

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