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Drum Poacher on CL- Would You Consider Calling Him?

#21
Pass.

Drummers are as common as dirt. Good drummers can be found but it's like hitting the lottery. Really good drummers are as rare as a tasteful guitar solo in a Guitar Center.

If this guy was as good as he seems to think, he wouldn't need to post this on Craigslist because his phone would already be ringing off the hook.
 
#23
It's cool to see that the majority of you get it. I think the ones that have a problem with this ad are telling on themselves. You more-than-likely don't have the experience to understand what's being said. Sorry, I guess I hurt your feelings like he/she did?!?

It IS show business and there always comes a time when the cream rises and what's left has to be cut. It's not arrogant, but realistic. I don't see it as "poacher", he/she is simply saying if the band has been thinking about it, TAKE THE STEP!

And maybe you're right about posting on CL. But...It's not the old days when you could play 7 nights a week. You have to play with 2-3 bands to keep busy. Maybe that's what is going on? I know for me, it's hard to keep as busy as I would like to be.
 
#26
hudpucker said:
I don't see the problem with this ad.


If he fits your situation call; if not, don't.
Click to expand...

This sums it up. He's looking for work not to sit around a campfire and sing kumbaya and feel all fuzzy. Seems legit enough.

As to the good drummers don't need to post on craislist as they are already busy angle. Maybe he's new to the area. Maybe he went down to a single act that was consuming all his time and that act has now gone bellyup. Maybe one of a bajillion things. True, one of those things is maybe he is an untalented braggart. There are plenty of those in this business. Just saying that posting an ad doesn't mean he is immediately worthless.
 
#28
dalahorse said:
I'd never ask a band to consider replacing their drummer, though. If they're looking and I am too, we'll probably find each other. But it's not cool to suggest to a band that their drummer/keyboardist/bassist/singer/etc. sucks and you should try him instead. Not cool. Not cool at all.
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I think there's an important nuance here that you're missing, Jacob... :hmm:

The drummer who posted this announcement isn't necessarily acquainted with any of the people who might be reading what he wrote. They are strangers to one another. So under the circumstances, how could he possibly "ask" anyone to dump their drummer in order to hire him? How could he possibly "suggest" to any band that their drummer sucks, when he doesn't even know who they are? :confused:

The answer, of course, is that he can't. He's not speaking to any particular person or any particular band. He's simply making his services known - for the benefit of anyone who happens to have already reached such a conclusion - independently of Mr. Drummer himself.

If you think it through, I think you'll agree that this insight changes the perceived dynamic considerably... :hmm:

MM
 
#29
My reaction on seeing it was why would this guy word it like that? What's the point? Maybe to convince a few casual readers of CL who were not already shopping for a new drummer that they should be? It turned me off. As I said before, I would probably give him a call if I were looking and he just listed his qualifications and expectations.

Here's a twist. Replace "drummer" with "bass player" in his ad and how do you like him now? Drummers seem to have a higher rate of DB's within their ranks so this ad didn't surprise me. Bass players seem in general IME to have a tighter less competitive community spirit. I would hate to see this type of ad from a bass player and it's not because I would be afraid he might take my job. I just think it's a really negative way to promote yourself.
 
#30
I understand what you guys are saying. I just think a negative ad is tasteless. I've posted ads at the local pro shops before. They were worded to include that I...

- am a professional with a professional attitude.
- have excellent time and groove.
- have experience with writing and arranging.
- am interested in working with motivated musicians for new or existing projects.
- am seeking student drummers as well.

I think it's just better to be positive and respectful to other musicians. Yes, I was looking for similar groups as the person with the negative ad. I don't know how many replies he got. But I can definitely say that my phone was ringing off the hook. And I live in NM! Put yourself out as a professional and people notice.
 
#31
First, I have to ask...Why be on CL reading ads for drummers unless you're looking? I agree with the positive attitude thing. But I think most of us have had to deal with clueless posters on musician sites (bands and individuals). It's easy to become somewhat jaded and want to cut right through the BS! That's what I got from the ad.

Hey, if it stops the endless phone conversations and the train wreck auditions, I'm all for the seriousness & honesty. Bring it!
 
#33
I don't see the problem. He's obviously looking to join a going concern (as opposed to building a band from scratch), and is offering his services. Whether he is indeed a better player than a band's current drummer will be determined if he gets an audition. My concern if I were to call him is whether his poorly conceived ad is indicative of an ill-formed personality .. ;)
 
#34
I have mixed feeling, but he does start out with:

“**BANDS! Not happy with drummer? Call me!**”

It’s not like he’s trying to use the “power of suggestion”, or convince someone they need a new drummer if they don’t, but addressing those who are already unhappy with their drummer.

I don’t think it’s necessarily a helpful tactic, in that if someone were unhappy with their drummer, listing his qualifications would be all that were needed, but I guess it’s not completely out of line in the world of marketing.

One possible advantage is that the unhappy band might assume that he’s willing to do the behind-the-back-secret-rehearsals-using-the-old-drummer’s-kit-stringing-the-old-drummer-along-until-ready thing, which would be an assumption on my/their part, but likely a correct assumption.

As for those here who think he’s an ass, that would make anyone who auditions him an ass, so I guess they’d be fitting bandmates and deserve each other.

Many musicians are on different pages with respect to mentality or musicianship, so think of it as a way of pairing like-minded individuals, which could be a good thing for the band as well as the replaced member.

In any case, I guess it doesn’t bother me, ‘cause when it comes to the “band” thing, most otherwise-decent people turn into total douchbags anyways.

:)
 
#35
RustyAxe said:
I don't see the problem. He's obviously looking to join a going concern (as opposed to building a band from scratch), and is offering his services. Whether he is indeed a better player than a band's current drummer will be determined if he gets an audition. My concern if I were to call him is whether his poorly conceived ad is indicative of an ill-formed personality .. ;)
Click to expand...

We all know how well-adjusted drummers are, don't we? Aw, what the heck!

Caveat emptor.
 
#36
Bert Slide said:
My reaction on seeing it was why would this guy word it like that? What's the point? Maybe to convince a few casual readers of CL who were not already shopping for a new drummer that they should be? It turned me off. As I said before, I would probably give him a call if I were looking and he just listed his qualifications and expectations.

Here's a twist. Replace "drummer" with "bass player" in his ad and how do you like him now? Drummers seem to have a higher rate of DB's within their ranks so this ad didn't surprise me. Bass players seem in general IME to have a tighter less competitive community spirit. I would hate to see this type of ad from a bass player and it's not because I would be afraid he might take my job. I just think it's a really negative way to promote yourself.
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That's my thinking as well. It doesn't need to be worded that way. If someone needs a drummer, they look for one. No need to add the negativity.

IME, the guys who are cool with others who play the same instrument tend to do better than the competitive types. That's where you get recommendations and referrals from. There's plenty of gigs and bands out there that you don't need to be a snake about it.
 
#37
jive1 said:
IME, the guys who are cool with others who play the same instrument tend to do better than the competitive types. That's where you get recommendations and referrals from. There's plenty of gigs and bands out there that you don't need to be a snake about it.
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+1 ... the best gigs I've ever gotten, and my current country band gig, were from referrals by other bass players.
 
#39
Bert Slide said:
Seems a little ruthless and cutthroat to me.
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I have to agree, to those of us with a sense of morals, ethics, fair play, etc., it does sound ruthless and cutthroat.

However, to those of us pulling our hair out and losing gig potential because our only weak link is a bad drummer, it actually sounds kind of attractive.

We all know it: A good drummer makes a band. Everyone else can be mediocre, but a great timekeeper who plays tastefully and what the song requires is worth his/her weight in gold. And in the case of a "bad band," how often is it because of the drummer? IME, often. Usually.

Dude wants to work and make a band better than it was before. The only reason you'd even consider auditioning him is if you were already fed up with your drummer.

In that scenario, no harm, no foul.

If my drummer was stinking it up and embarassing me, I'd give this guy a spin.

As for "why is he posting on CL?" there are a ton of reasons. He could be new to town. He could want more work than he currently has. It's really not important why he's on CL. He has a service to offer, if you have the need, call him. Why criticize his use of CL? Seems petty.
 

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