Double Bass Ehrlund and EBD-2 Pre-amp

[DB Slidefunk]

Hi everyone,
Does anyone have experience using an Ehrlund with this pre amp?

I already blend a mic and pick up with the EDB-2 but I want to improve my sound by blending the Ehrlund with another source and would rather use one unit to do the job.

Also, compared to a more regular mic is it a little more feedback resistant?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Ric Vice]

Hi everyone,
Does anyone have experience using an Ehrlund with this pre amp?

I already blend a mic and pick up with the EDB-2 but I want to improve my sound by blending the Ehrlund with another source and would rather use one unit to do the job.

Also, compared to a more regular mic is it a little more feedback resistant?

Thanks in advance.

DB,
I use the EDB-2 and Ehrlund EAP for all my gigs. It works great, however it sounds even better with the Ehrlund Pre Amp in the signal chain. The Ehrlund EAP has better feedback resistance than either the DPA 4099 or The AMT SB25. A word of caution here, try it before you purchase it, as it works beautifully on my bass, but that's not always
The case.

Ric

 

[DB Slidefunk]

Hi Ric,
Thanks for the tip. I'm not sure where I can try one in the UK, are there any Ehrlund users in Southern England that would do me the favour?

 

[Ric Vice]

Hi Ric,
Thanks for the tip. I'm not sure where I can try one in the UK, are there any Ehrlund users in Southern England that would do me the favour?

DB,
I use the EDB-2 and Ehrlund EAP for all my gigs. It works great, however it sounds even better with the Ehrlund Pre Amp in the signal chain. The Ehrlund EAP has better feedback resistance than either the DPA 4099 or The AMT SB25. A word of caution here, try it before you purchase it, as it works beautifully on my bass, but that's not always
The case.

Ric

DB Slidefunk,
Well, you're best bet would be to contact Goran Ehrlund through his website, to see if you can arrange a trial with him. If you lived in the states Gollihur music offers a 7 day trial,
but the logistics of getting it back and forth to the UK would be problematic at best.

Ric

 

[DB Slidefunk]

Thanks Ric,
I am really tempted by the Ehrlund but a trial would be a good idea. Out of interest, how much difference does the Ehrlud Pre amp make vs the Headway? I was hoping to save some money and have simple set up but I'd hate to be missing out on a better sound.

 

[Ric Vice]

Thanks Ric,
I am really tempted by the Ehrlund but a trial would be a good idea. Out of interest, how much difference does the Ehrlud Pre amp make vs the Headway? I was hoping to save some money and have simple set up but I'd hate to be missing out on a better sound.

DB,
For me, it makes all the difference in the world, especially if you intend to use a powered speaker, but you can start with the Ehrlund EAP and the EDB-2 and get a great sound. If your funds are limited, that's the combination I'd recommend to go with first, then you can add the Ehrlund Pre later on. The Ehrlund Pre gives you full frequency spectrum enhancement.

Ric

 

[DB Slidefunk]

Thanks Ric,
Just for the interest of anyone in the UK in the same position, Erhlund gave me the details of a UK dealer and they are happy to do a trial period as long as I cover the return shipping. I'm ordering the pick up and pre amp and will have a play with it next week.

If anyone needs the detail let me know.

 

[Ric Vice]

Thanks Ric,
Just for the interest of anyone in the UK in the same position, Erhlund gave me the details of a UK dealer and they are happy to do a trial period as long as I cover the return shipping. I'm ordering the pick up and pre amp and will have a play with it next week.

If anyone needs the detail let me know.

DB,
Good news indeed, I used that combination for rehearsals yesterday into a little Acoustic 30 Combo amp. It
sounded quite good, amazingly good considering the amp. When the Ehrlund is compatible with an instrument
it's a revelation. The EDB-2's tone palate allows you to bypass the front end of any amp and get the EQ you're after.

Ric

 

[DB Slidefunk]

Got the Ehrlund and pre amp for trial today and I think its a keeper. I put it in the recommended spot and right away it sounded great and I love it. It really does a good job amplifying the thunk and thump of my gut strings and is very articulate from bass to treble. The next test will be feedback levels at rehearsal on Monday in a small sealed room with a fair amount of volume but it's very promising so far.

 

[Ric Vice]

Got the Ehrlund and pre amp for trial today and I think its a keeper. I put it in the recommended spot and right away it sounded great and I love it. It really does a good job amplifying the thunk and thump of my gut strings and is very articulate from bass to treble. The next test will be feedback levels at rehearsal on Monday in a small sealed room with a fair amount of volume but it's very promising so far.

+1 Sounds like it might work for you, the EAP, is a linear device, so it doesn't have the same midrange "bump" that a piezo, like a Realist or Full Circle has. It's sound is more full range, transparent, and it blends with the other instruments in your ensemble, much like you're bass naturally would, if everyone were playing acoustically. As you increase it's volume, it will still blend, rather than stick out, like a piezo does. I love that sound on my bass. Hopefully it will work for you, in the ensembles you perform with. Provided it does, you should think about purchasing the Ehrlund Pre Amp as soon as you can swing it, it does make a difference in the pickups output. From your texts above, I'm assuming that you purchased a Headway EDB-2 as the pre amp for the Ehrlund EAP.

Ric

 

[DB Slidefunk]

Hi Ric,
I already had the EBD2 but I also got the Ehrlund pre amp for a trial and it does make it sound better so I'm keeping it. The best sound I had on the living room test was the Erhlund and its pre amp going into the EBD2 and the troll mic on the other channel with all the lows rolled off to avoid feedback. I've never had such a good sound and hope it translates into live playing.

 

[drurb]

...the EAP, is a linear device, so it doesn't have the same midrange "bump" that a piezo, ...As you increase it's volume, it will still blend, rather than stick out, like a piezo does.

As a fellow Ehrlund user, I just want to point out that it is a piezo transducer. The trick, as with all good piezo pickups (and there are precious few), is in the mechanical and electrical loading of the element.

 

[MrSidecar]

Hi Ric,
I already had the EBD2 but I also got the Ehrlund pre amp for a trial and it does make it sound better

DB Slidefunk,

I've heard others say the same, and I'm curious if you can put your finger on what precisely is "better" with the Ehrlund Preamp. I' not arguing or doubting, I'm just curious. Here's why:

Measurements by drurb showed that the Ehrlund Preamp does absolutely nothing except provide 9dB gain and the right input impedance (the frequency response is ruler-flat over the entire range), and that either means the Ehrlund can't cope with the Headway's 10MOhm input impedance (which would surprise me, as "higher than necessary" usually doesn't do harm), or that the Headway is not flat, and I can't really imagine that being the case. But maybe there are other factors that I am not aware of.

Best
Sidecar

 

[DB Slidefunk]

Hi Sidecar,
I can't really explain it in technical terms, it just sounds warmer and the tone is better. The EBD2 on its own still sounds good but there is a slightly distanced quality without the Erluhd pre. I was hoping to get away without the extra pre amp but for me it's worth the money.

DB

 

[DB Slidefunk]

The other thing I like bout the Ehrulnd is no pick up wedged between the bridge and adjuster. I'm sure the bass sounds a but deeper and richer at the low end now that the realist lifeline has been removed. Next step, a solid wooden bridge.

 

[drurb]

DB Slidefunk,

I've heard others say the same, and I'm curious if you can put your finger on what precisely is "better" with the Ehrlund Preamp. I' not arguing or doubting, I'm just curious. Here's why:

Measurements by drurb showed that the Ehrlund Preamp does absolutely nothing except provide 9dB gain and the right input impedance (the frequency response is ruler-flat over the entire range), and that either means the Ehrlund can't cope with the Headway's 10MOhm input impedance (which would surprise me, as "higher than necessary" usually doesn't do harm), or that the Headway is not flat, and I can't really imagine that being the case. But maybe there are other factors that I am not aware of.

Best
Sidecar

FWIW-- I've been puzzling over the same thing. Hmmm... do we know that the EDB2 is flat? I suspect that it is, but I'd really like to measure one.

 

[DB Slidefunk]

I guess that they both maybe flat but due to the inner workings, the tone of the Erhlund is somehow a little warmer?

 

[Ric Vice]

FWIW-- I've been puzzling over the same thing. Hmmm... do we know that the EDB2 is flat? I suspect that it is, but I'd really like to measure one.

Les,
Well, short of sending you mine, all I can offer is the EQ section's spec's from the EDB-2's owner manual. Here's the whole manual as a PDF. You can see what you're able to glean from the document. Below, is a illustration of the EDB-2's control panel,
since there is a 0 detent for all the 5 EQ bands, my assumption is that the preamp is flat with all the control knobs set at 12:00. It's quite a box, I use mine into a powered speaker or FOH, provided the venue has enough monitor sends, to isolate the bass on it's own individual channel.


Ric

 

[Ric Vice]

DB Slidefunk,

I've heard others say the same, and I'm curious if you can put your finger on what precisely is "better" with the Ehrlund Preamp. I' not arguing or doubting, I'm just curious. Here's why:

Measurements by drurb showed that the Ehrlund Preamp does absolutely nothing except provide 9dB gain and the right input impedance (the frequency response is ruler-flat over the entire range), and that either means the Ehrlund can't cope with the Headway's 10MOhm input impedance (which would surprise me, as "higher than necessary" usually doesn't do harm), or that the Headway is not flat, and I can't really imagine that being the case. But maybe there are other factors that I am not aware of.

Best
Sidecar

Mr. Sidecar,
Well, just as DB Slide Funk mentioned, the Ehrlund Pre just gives you a warmer and fuller sound, into any pre amp, including the Headway EDB-2 . Whether or not you actually need one, would be a matter of choice, and of course money.
With all the controls on the EDB-2, set to the 0 detent, I'm assuming that the Headway is flat. I rarely use those settings however. In most situations, I lower the bass response, raise the low midrange, cut the upper midrange, and set the presence, and treble
a little past 12:00. The Ehrlund is certainly capable of handling the EDB-2's variable input impedances of 1,5, and 20 Meg Ohm., but it sounds better with the Ehrlund Pre IMHO. Since I'm using it with a QSC K8, I actually need more than just the EDB-2 to
give me enough signal from the EAP, so the Ehrlund Pre Amp provides that added gain. When I'm using my bigger 400 and 600 watt Walter Woods amplifiers I bypass their front end EQ sections, running the EDB-2 into the effects send. Adding the Ehrlund
Pre Amp in that signal chain isn't always necessary, but it does sound warmer and fuller.

Ric

 

[MrSidecar]

Let me clarify why I ask:

I have been using Ehrlunds Pickup and Preamp for years now, but recently my preamp died in transit from uncareful handling by me. The preamp itself costs serious money, and seeing that it seemingly does not do anything but provide gain and the "right" input impedance, I am researching all I can to find alternatives. Now, the Headway is no alternative if you don't have it beforehand (I don't). But it's comparisons like the one in this thread that give me an idea about what to aim for when trying to find something to replace the original Ehrlund Preamp.

I guess that they both maybe flat but due to the inner workings, the tone of the Erhlund is somehow a little warmer?

Well, I suppose whatever "warm" sound is, it should, just like "fat", "thin", "nasal" sound etc., somehow be visible in the frequency response curve. Since drurbs measurements show a flat response, this warmth is difficult to specify.

Best
Sidecar