Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Swiss Frank, Oct 25, 2019.

  1. Swiss Frank

    Swiss Frank

    Dec 29, 2016
    There's one available local to me for stupid-cheap for about FIVE HOURS. (It may just be relisted once the auction is over so still please give me a response even if it's more than 5 hours since I posted this.)

    Is there any reason people decide they don't like this amp? Bad reliability, bad tone, etc?

    Are the replacement models--I think the WT900??--substantially better?

    My main interests are:

    -- probably sounds better than class D, though class D is very good these days

    -- I ***think*** it probably sounds equally great at volume 0.1 as 5, unlike my PF-50T

    -- I plan on running 115 and 410 cabs off it, whereby the 410's sensitivity is like twice the 115. (twice is 6dB, in my case 5dB difference) So, it looks like the World Tour 800 has a balance for two outputs, so I can give more juice to the 115 if I want. Also, just the easiest way to A/B two cabs is to spin a balance knob. A distant second is that it also has a crossover frequency; I might possibly want to cross over between two cabs but I doubt it given that 210's can be flat down to 30Hz these days.

    -- I've heard that at least a decade ago, Eden World Tours were super reliable as well as great sound: "if you showed up at a festival and saw the back line had Eden bass gear you'd know the show would be fine" etc.

    -- I plan on using my Ampeg PF-50T as a pre-amp when I want the warming (or even distortion) and compression of POWER tubes working hard, plus transformer and rectifier nearly maxed out and on the point of sagging. I'd take it's aux out into the WT800's poweramp in or some such. Anyone have bad experience or know from the voltage ranges or something that this wouldn't work well?

    -- but when I don't need the tube sound I hope to just use it as is. Can anyone confirm it sounds fine even when turned down to conversational volume, e.g. late night goofing around when the baby's asleep? In a way even a 50W tube amp probably doesn't?

    -- I like the sweepable EQ

    If it matters, my current cab is an Eden D210XST. I'm getting a Glockenklang Uno Rock Art and Take Five Neo, I think. Eventually an Ampeg 810 for that 70s tone.
    Hachimitsu Pie likes this.
  2. Stan_da_man


    Aug 29, 2006
    Did nobody tell you about the fire thing?
    Corbusier and Swiss Frank like this.
  3. Grapevine921

    Grapevine921 Supporting Member

    Feb 8, 2011
    Lafayette, Indiana
    Personally my favorite bass amps are Eden. I have a wt-330 and a wt-1205 and would trade the 1205 for an 800 in a heart beat. Also I don't think the newer generations hold up to the Eden standard at all. I'd try to stay with late 90s/early 2000s when David was running the show.
    mlowe and ddnidd1 like this.
  4. Grapevine921

    Grapevine921 Supporting Member

    Feb 8, 2011
    Lafayette, Indiana
    And noting your cabs, I've played my Eden heads through a d410xlt and the ampeg 810e. They pair nicely. Only combination I haven't liked was an Eden head into a GK cabinet. I think they cancel out each other's strengths.
  5. Swiss Frank

    Swiss Frank

    Dec 29, 2016
    OK, my investigations tell me there were A B and C models. The later C models were made in China and there are two guys saying they had each had three 800C's start smoking on them. And they're not the only ones complaining about the 800C's not working. It seems like the firm's reputation was built on the made-in-Melrose MN models, and that's what we should look for. It says lower-right front if its made in Melrose, as well as upper-right back.

    Can anyone outline the pros and cons of the A and B models?

    The $475 C model relisted here, so I can still buy it. I'm thinking, if it was going to catch fire, it probably would have done so in the first ten years...

    Also, a $525 made-in-Melrose making "scratching noises" (when the pot is turned? Unclear, it's not sold by a music store who'd understand that stuff but a general-purpose reseller).

    But there's also a $650 made-in-Melrose model, a bit more wear, but no contra-indications. I never worried about spending an extra $175 on a bass, so I guess I shouldn't worry about paying that for the amp.

    The one big reservation I have is that the Quilter 800's are 4lbs, have an XLR in that would match my PF-50T's XLR out. But those are nearly the same money used as the WT800's are, and despite microscopic size they obviously don't have the flexibility and as class-D amps might not ultimately have quite the sound quality.
  6. Jazz Ad

    Jazz Ad Mi la ré sol

    There are a lot of assumptions, many of which unjustified in all of this.
    I don't really have time to get into them, others will.
  7. dfp


    Sep 28, 2004
    WT800 is a great, modern classic of a pro bass amp, but your decision should not be an emergency, please take some time, save up some money, keep researching, and buy something great. Maybe that will be WT800, or maybe something else. Avoid pocket amps with limited functionality until u already have your main rig together.
    Swiss Frank likes this.
  8. FRoss6788

    FRoss6788 Gold Supporting Member

    Mar 25, 2012
    Olympic Peninsula
    ....Montrose :rolleyes:

    Just sayin":D
    popgadget and Swiss Frank like this.
  9. PaulCISSA

    PaulCISSA Unsweetened, highly-caffeinated Supporting Member

    Jul 10, 2014
    Northest New Jersey
    Bought a 800B in the late 90's and played the snot out of it for 3 years. I was gigging 3 nights a week at that time and never needed a backup (but always had one in the trunk of the car). Loved the tone, hated the weight of a 4U rack and it had way more headroom than I ever needed. It's one amp that I really miss, weight aside.

    The Montrose shop is where the magic was, the stuff from China is crap. I didn't dump mine, I got offered a fair price for it and moved on.
    Swiss Frank likes this.
  10. Wasnex


    Dec 25, 2011

    I inherited a WT800 and a D210XLT and a D410XLT when one of our bass players moved to another military band. I know it will be taken as heretical, but I always had a hard time dialing in the high mids to my liking. The problem was partly with the voicing of the cabs, and partly with the voicing of the amp.

    When the amp went down and needed to be repaired, I moved on to an Ashley MX508 rack mixer and a QSC power amp because I needed the flexibility. I sometimes switch between three instruments, so it's nice to have mute, gain, and tone controls for each axe. The tone with the MX508 wasn't perfect, but I liked it better; I was able to dial in a bit smoother high mids. This was very important since part of my job was playing bowed string bass.

    The previous custodian of the rig had to put the WT800 in the shop a couple of time as well. I don't remember if it was an A, B, or C model. I continued to use the Eden speakers for several years.

    I wouldn't necessarily consider $475 for a WT800 and incredible bargain. YMMV.
    Swiss Frank likes this.
  11. Jerry Ziarko

    Jerry Ziarko Supporting Member

    Feb 23, 2003
    Rochester, NY
    I owned one when they first came out. Plenty of power and a flexible EQ section. The thing I HATED about it was the DI was post. I called Eden once on a Fri afternoon and actually got David on the phone. He told me they would gladly switch my DI to pre if I sent them $150. I voiced my displeasure with the cost and asked if there was any way to lessen the price of the switch. Let's just say his answer to me had me post it for sale that evening.
    I've been around this site for years, and have seen and had personal experience with absolutely AMAZING customer service by some of the best builders and owners in the business. Many are here on TB daily interacting with the consumer community not only problem solving, but looking for help and suggestions from actual users to make their products the best and most sought after they can be. I've talked with several on the phone and almost every single one could not have been more friendly and accommodating. Let's face it, there are some great products on the market and continue to be even better ones through innovation, but mainly it often comes down to personal choice. IMO what separates the good from the great is customer service!
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2019
  12. I have a WT800B that I still use for outdoor shows without FOH support when I have to move a lot of air. I use it with my Mesa Powerhouse 4x10 and it sounds really good. Once I added a 2nd 2x10 cab for a 4 ohm load and that was crazy loud.

    Main difference between the A and B models is that the B can bridge mono 4ohms. It will produce something like 1200 watts in this mode. As I say it was crazy loud with a 4x10 and a 2x10. The WT800A can only bridge mono 8 ohms.

    I've had mine over 10 years, works great. I think I bought it from someone here on TB.
    Swiss Frank likes this.
  13. bikeplate

    bikeplate Supporting Member

    Jun 7, 2001
    Upstate NY
    Because it sucked and fell apart
    S-Bigbottom likes this.
  14. Swiss Frank

    Swiss Frank

    Dec 29, 2016
    Thanks all for your feedback, as mysterious as it was in a few cases :)

    OK, so the $475 amp was a made-in-China WT-800C. Based on the horror stories of these made-in-China C-series I decided to pass. (There are multiple guys claiming they had three catch fire in a row, and so on.)

    There is a $550 or so WT-800B on the local auction site that is making "crackling noises" and "no return." Could just be dirty pots. I'm not a gambling man. I decided to pass.

    Now this is probably starting to sound like I'm paying too much but I settled on a $625 or so used WT-800B that is autovolt. All the WT-800's I see of any generation are just one voltage: 120, 100, or 240. This one is the only one I've seen that can take any of them. Now maybe it's not that rare in the great scheme of things, but as an American, living in 100V Japan, but potentially moving to 120V US or 240V Europe in the next couple years, this was kind of a deciding factor.
  15. 12bass


    Jan 2, 2003
    Victoria, Canada
    WT800C may be worth checking out, IMO. The Chinese made models had the circuit optimized and have less idle noise/hiss than earlier US units, plus they bridge into 4 ohms, or 2 ohms per side, which comes in handy for many folks.

    From what I gather, many people stopped using them because they prefer the convenience of lighter class D models.
    mlowe and Swiss Frank like this.
  16. okcrum

    okcrum in your chest

    Oct 5, 2009
    Verde Valley, AZ
    RIP Dark Horse strings
    WT800A is banana plug/TS outputs. Amp channels are 4 ohm capable and will do 8 ohms bridged.
    WT800B is a factory-modified 800A upgraded to 2 ohms/channel, 4 ohms bridged, and has Speakon connectors.
    WT800C is an 800B built from scratch.

    I sold my WT800A because I didn't need that much power anymore. I use a WT405 (among others) now.

    EDIT: The crackling noise in WT800s, if not just the pots, tends to be fractured solder joints on the power transistor emitter resistors (the large power resistors on the PA board). Resoldering usually takes care of that.
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2019
    Swiss Frank likes this.
  17. 12bass


    Jan 2, 2003
    Victoria, Canada
    Additionally, earlier US-made units commonly have problems with the solder joints failing on the power resistors which are on the preamp board. The imported units have a redesigned circuit which uses proper voltage regulators instead of zener diodes and power resistors to drop the main supply voltage for the preamp section, which means that they are immune to the bad solder joint problem.
    pocket_groover likes this.
  18. Best answer. :thumbsup:
  19. Swiss Frank

    Swiss Frank

    Dec 29, 2016
    I agree it was powerfult and pity, but is it generally applicable to all WT-800s? Or just the WT-800C's?
  20. Swiss Frank

    Swiss Frank

    Dec 29, 2016
    If this manual is correct, the 800B definitely 1) can run each half into 2 ohms and 2) can bridge into 4 ohms (both on page 7)

    Eden WT800 Operation Manual (Page 7 of 21)