My point exactly. 'Cuz you're just an amazing typer and have never typed one mistake in your life, right?
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Double Bass Engelhardt EM1
- Thread starter powellmacaque
- Start date
My point exactly. 'Cuz you're just an amazing typer and have never typed one mistake in your life, right?
Mr. Paul, I did not say you had no right to say what you said. What I was saying was that "IMO" did not make your statement any less arrogant.
Furthermore, I do not post with my full name because I have been a member of TB since I was 15 and I did not feel safe putting my name on the world wide web at the time.
I do not feel any of my postings were in the least bit disrespectful, but on the contrary, I do believe that Paul's comments were of the utmost in snobbery and completely unnecessary. Am I offended? Not really. I have lurked on this side of the forum for a few years, and I was always afraid to post because nobody is overly friendly nor do they take kindly to newbies. This is in contrast to how many members of the BG forum treat each other; which is, for the most part, respectfully. You're an unhelpful scrooge who gets his jollies out of picking apart newbies, and that's not IMO, that's according to your posting history.
Once again in regards to my teacher's comments, this was UPON FIRST INSPECTION. Questioning both mine and my teacher's intelligence is not courteous, and to be honest, what he said was "IHO" and IHO he felt my bass was worth a lot more than what I paid for it. And isn't worth subjective? Or is philosophy not your strong suit?
Furthermore, not that I really need to defend my teacher any further, there is a bit of a language barrier, so I could have very easily misinterpreted what he said to me. I know that he said "are you sure you only paid $1000 for it?" and I also know that he said something about it being as nice as some $4000 basses. I admit, my first posting wasn't the best way to word what he said, and I apologize for that. The point of the story wasn't what he thought I should've paid, but the fact that he thought it was built better than many $1000 basses he's seen. Was he exaggerating? Maybe.
And for those of you treating me like a little kid, I can assure you I am not the average ill-tempered teenaged YouTuber who curses out every opposing idea. I have been playing music professionally for five years, and while that is fractional to some of you, that still puts me in the same level of play as many of you. A 5-year professional basketball player is no worse than a 20-year basketball player.
If becoming "seasoned" on an upright bass evolves me into a pretentious person who uses his credentials to demean others instead of uplifting them, I don't want anything to do with upright bass or the community.
But unfortunately for you, Mr. Warburton, my teacher is well informed in how to treat other musicians, so you'll be seeing whippersnappers like me around here for a while.
While you were having your tantrum, this was going on in another thread. Another way to look at things.....
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=592894
I'm an amazing typer, but I'm a better basser.
Tryin' to help you, here, dude. (post 17)
Good lord.
I do, Marcus. All the time. It's a lot of fun for an old person. I even get involved every once in a while.
If anybody wants to post about the bass, please do so. If anybody wants to engage in a distance urination contest about who is and isn't a snob, please take it to PM, or start a new thread.
Let's try to keep this thread a Knotless Knicker Zone. Congrats on the bass, and try not to worry too much what strangers on the internet think. I personally find the regulars around here very knowledgeable as well as a little crusty. IME, the crust is a small price to pay for the access to the knowledge and experience. YMMV, but if it does, it doesn't necessarily make it a bad road.
Let's try to keep this thread a Knotless Knicker Zone. Congrats on the bass, and try not to worry too much what strangers on the internet think. I personally find the regulars around here very knowledgeable as well as a little crusty. IME, the crust is a small price to pay for the access to the knowledge and experience. YMMV, but if it does, it doesn't necessarily make it a bad road.
THE ENGELHARDT EM-1 DOUBLE BASS IS A FINE INSTRUMENT...bzzzt..... IT WILL SERVE YOUR EVERY NEED FOR THE RESTT....fizzle.....OF ALL OF YOUR .......bzzzttt....LIVESSS... BE... HAAAAPPPYYYYYY......
(tiny puff of smoke, strong aroma of electrical fire)
(tiny puff of smoke, strong aroma of electrical fire)
I like my EM1... bought it slightly used and already tweaked (shaved neck, adjustable bridge, etc etc etc). It plays better than my abilities for now.
I do apologize for being a bit uneasy, especially to Marcus.
I used to work at Ace Hardware, maybe that's why I demand friendliness from peers. I shouldn't have to be afraid to post on a forum.
I'm happy with my bass, that's all that really matters when you boil it down.
I used to work at Ace Hardware, maybe that's why I demand friendliness from peers. I shouldn't have to be afraid to post on a forum.
I'm happy with my bass, that's all that really matters when you boil it down.
No worries, dude. I like Engelhardts. Neck's a little thin for my tastes, but they sound good and they're tanks.
BTW... Ace has always been the friendliest of places in my experience. We have a couple here on Maui that are fantastic.
My teacher did say that if I wanted to use the bass more professionally, he would install ebony in the fingerboard and tailpiece. Is that really necessary, or is it just a plus? I do like the look of the rosewood, but am not attached to it. Is rosewood too unrefined for professional playing?
I guess I just have a problem with spending tons of money on a DB since I am a BG player first and foremost. For carved instruments, how are Strunals? I was thinking of maybe having two rather inexpensive basses, one for classical playing, and one for jazz style. I'm really just doing DB because I couldn't afford to attend Miami where they have a bass guitar program, and every other university in my state only does DB.
I guess I just have a problem with spending tons of money on a DB since I am a BG player first and foremost. For carved instruments, how are Strunals? I was thinking of maybe having two rather inexpensive basses, one for classical playing, and one for jazz style. I'm really just doing DB because I couldn't afford to attend Miami where they have a bass guitar program, and every other university in my state only does DB.
Uhhh... I'm a little reluctant to speak any further regarding your instructor's recommendations. He may know stuff that I don't know. Probably does.
THAT SAID;
I think that considering installing ebony fittings on a new EM-1 is not the way to go. I'd much rather see you play the bass as is for awhile, until you surpass its limitations. Then you can upgrade to a carved bass that will meet your needs at that time. Big deep breath, I think.
I wouldn't devote the time and energy to DB if you don't enjoy it more than that. Find some other things while in school that you might be interested in. You can study BG with a good teacher while in school if you want, or just keep working with it on your own. You don't have to be a music major to be a musician!
And, what Marcus said above.
Wow panties in bunch. Assuming you'd get recognition by posting under a new nick I think is a little bit foolhardy.
Anyways...
I find that teachers are just like anybody else. I'm not saying your bass is bad, but as they say, a broken clock is still right twice a day. By that I mean, he may say something different the next time you seem him cuz his ears are hearing something else another day, and the weather is different enough to change your sound. Honest to god, Ron Carter paid me a compliment on my Christopher hybrid (currently for sale - shameless plug) saying that he liked the tone I was getting during a workshop. I think he was surprised that it was a student bass. By no means do I expect him to say the same thing should I ever meet him again with the same bass in hand.
Still, what matters is that the bass fulfills your desires, until you get the point where you desire more than it can give. As long as you are happy, we are all happy.
No, I don't do hugs.
Anyways...
I find that teachers are just like anybody else. I'm not saying your bass is bad, but as they say, a broken clock is still right twice a day. By that I mean, he may say something different the next time you seem him cuz his ears are hearing something else another day, and the weather is different enough to change your sound. Honest to god, Ron Carter paid me a compliment on my Christopher hybrid (currently for sale - shameless plug) saying that he liked the tone I was getting during a workshop. I think he was surprised that it was a student bass. By no means do I expect him to say the same thing should I ever meet him again with the same bass in hand.
Still, what matters is that the bass fulfills your desires, until you get the point where you desire more than it can give. As long as you are happy, we are all happy.
No, I don't do hugs.
I want to major in music, and I could learn a lot from the classes (Jazz Improv, Fundamentals, Structure and Style, History) and I think many things on DB are applicable to BG, so I don't see it as a total waste. I also was a non-music major my first year of school and hated not being in music classes.
I was just wondering about the ebony. He told me he that he could do it if I wanted to, I brought it up. I'm not really sure what the advantage of having a carved bass is.
Excuse me if this sounds a bit apathetic, but to me music is meant to be heard, so naturally as musicians we are here to entertain, so there's a certain point where I think instrumentalists care too much about their tone. While I understand that playing a better instrument adds better tonality to music, I can play a song just as beautifully on a Squier as I can on a Lakland. Additionally, most people, in my limited experience, really can't tell the difference outside of the bass-playing community. So why do I need to upgrade basses? How would a bass limit me?
I was just wondering about the ebony. He told me he that he could do it if I wanted to, I brought it up. I'm not really sure what the advantage of having a carved bass is.
Excuse me if this sounds a bit apathetic, but to me music is meant to be heard, so naturally as musicians we are here to entertain, so there's a certain point where I think instrumentalists care too much about their tone. While I understand that playing a better instrument adds better tonality to music, I can play a song just as beautifully on a Squier as I can on a Lakland. Additionally, most people, in my limited experience, really can't tell the difference outside of the bass-playing community. So why do I need to upgrade basses? How would a bass limit me?
And additionally, although I'm certain many of you think I am not exactly the coolest cat in the freezer, my teacher is a good guy and I may be misinterpreting a lot of what he says due to not only the language, but due to my lack of understanding of the instrument.
I've only worked with him a few times and I am starting to play German bow and read music (both things I could not do before the school year) and he expects a lot of me, which is really pushing me.
I've only worked with him a few times and I am starting to play German bow and read music (both things I could not do before the school year) and he expects a lot of me, which is really pushing me.
I've had that perspective in the past, and in some sense it's still very valid. But there are several points here to consider:
1) Art is a highly psychological thing. If you feel like a piece of equipment has "mojo" and is likely going to inspire you to play better, well guess what? You probably will. If playing a better instrument is going to inspire you to win a seat at a prestigious orchestra, if that's what it takes, then you'll have to go the distance.
2) Double Basses are not Electric basses, in the sense that they're just a hunk of wood with strings on them. They're almost living breathing animals and though the wood has been cut out of the tree, everything about it is still alive. Weather, humidity, temperature, etc. affect it. This doesn't happen to porkchops remotely on the same level. So your comparison between Squiers vs. Laklands is meaningless: akin to Apples to Oranges. The only thing they have in common are strings, a fingerboard, and tuning machines. Ignoring these elements, there is still a huge difference between the instruments. Even your "fingerstyle" technique has to change. Unlike before, you now have to develop a real physical approach to the instrument. If you didn't care about the instrument, why bother with DB in the first place? EB is so much easier play, maintain, own, and carry around.
3) Only until recently did I learn that owning a quality bass is like drinking wine. Even Gallo is still wine, but they're not very good. Good basses have their own character, personality, feel, and sound. The differences can be as stark as night and day, even if the basses of the same quality. I just spent several hours this weekend hanging out with my teacher as he compared my bass with a couple of his. They're all good basses, but each has it's own thing, it's own flavor, it's own bag of tricks that it's good at. This isn't a thing like comparing a Zon to a Lakland.... things are so different when you use pickups and rely heavily on amplification. You can always take a Precision pickup, put it in two different EBs, regardless of style, and get a sort of similar sound. Not so with DBs. Every bass responds differently, even those coming from the same maker and of the same exact style.
4) For years, my teacher told me that a lesser instrument fights the player, makes it harder to pull out a good tone, makes you work harder to get the sound you want. I didn't really believe him until now. Often, the lesser priced instruments have much more of a choked up sound. Better instruments will allow you to play easier, with less effort/force/energy, and be able to hear yourself better.
It's not to say student basses don't have their place. If you can't pull a note out of a bass to save your life, the difference between $1K and $10K won't mean anything. And this doesn't mean you can't make "good" music with your Engle. You certainly can. A better instrument just makes the effort a bit more enjoyable and probably with less various distractions so you can focus on your noisemaking.
Still, I think your Engle is a great purchase. Those are quality basses, and maybe even if you should decide to get yourself a better bass in the future, you still might want to keep it around for various reasons. As I like to say, you'll understand more once you dig deeper into playing these darn things.
EDIT: Next time you get a lesson with your teacher, ask him if you can play his bass and tell us what you find different between yours and his. If you can, have him play your bass and then play his to A/B them. What can you tell on your own?
