Equipment Ownership problems with member who left. How would U handle?

[comatosedragon]

The guy left the band, and formed another band, and you want to reward him?
Gotta be fair to everyone.

No, not trying to reward anyone - I was asked what I would do in this situation, and what I would do is let the guy take what he wants to avoid pointless drama and bickering. It's only money. It's not like it's a new house or anything . . . As far as the whole "fair to everyone" thing, well, in my experience the universe does not work that way. It's a nice thought though.

 

[KillerEddie]

ALWAYS have a contract., theee issues never end well without them, tell him he buys you out or you buy him out. And next time write out a contract

 

[Stevorebob]

A band is effectively a partnership. When a partner leaves, they are bought out and retain no ownership of partnership assets.

 

[TuneIn]

Have a grown up conversation about it including all parties. Majority rules, he'll probably get mad anyway and everyone will go on with life. if all else fails fire his drummer!

 

[electracoyote]

Who stores the lights? That lends itself to ownership.

Who put the money or credit card down to purchase the lights? That lends itself to ownership.

Short of a contract, isn't possession the main criteria?

If four guys own a bicycle, and one guy leaves the group, how is it he gets to take the bicycle or use it against the will of the other three?

How in the hell are you going to share lights if both bands are booked the same night?

One way or the other, I'd weasel a way to buy this rogue member out. He's got crazy ideas.

 

[Downunderwonder]

I would be saying no way sharing is going to work out so we'll keep the lights and you can buy new ones since you're the one leaving to do your own thing, hit up your new band for the ping.

 

[OldFunBass]

The problem with the joint purchase agreement is enforcement. You could all sign the best, most airtight legal contract ever written before the equipment is purchased, but if at the other end someone does not go along with what the contract says, or "disputes" it, then enforcement comes down to a legal matter. If the dispute qualifies for small claims court, then it might be able to get legally enforced without too much cost, just some time. If it does not, then you are left with having to get lawyers involved and filing. Now you are looking at some bigger money up front for the legal support. Would only be worth it if you are talking about one heck of a lighting or PA system! IMO, agreements are usually only worth anything if all parties are in agreement at the end. Otherwise, it is still an argument. I am a big believer in each piece of equipment being owned outright by someone. If it is a new band starting out with nothing, then usually the equipment needed to be bought can be split up fairly evenly as far as dollar value between members. If it is a band of more experienced players, they probably have random pieces from past bands already that can be pooled together to reduce the amount needed. If no one has money to buy at the beginning, then rent (as someone pointed out earlier). Then as members start buying equipment, you will have to rent less and less until eventually everything is owned.
I earned my living in bands from the late 70's through the late 80's, and this is my opinion based on that experience. Each person comes in with the equipment they own (or purchase during the time in the band) and when they leave it is theirs to take with them. As someone mentioned, most bands do not last forever.

 

[jaco944]

If I wasn't to attached to the lighting rig I would let him/his new band buy your current rig. If you are the band leader or have the money just buy a new set up. Sharing purchases never ends well. I currently have enough gear for a four piece band (bass, drums, guitar and keys), sound reinforcement and lighting, not by choice or design, but far easier to take my toys and go home if the need arises lol.

 

[Oddly]

My band bought lights 2 years ago. 4 members. One member left band. We want to buy him out. He wants to keep using the lights for his new band. Doesn't want to be bought out. (We have to tread carefully because he is a business partner to one of the band members.) Other members want to buy him out and not let him borrow lights.

We currently share a room with his other band. This coming October, we are getting our own practice room. We want to take control of the lights when we move. What would you do?

What would I do?
I'd let the band member that's his business partner decide. He's clearly the one most at risk here.
If that wasn't an issue, I'd just give the guy leaving a check for 1/4 the lights value and tell him take it or leave it.

 

[Nev375]

Offer him two options. You are going to auction the lights in 30 days at which time he will recieve 25% of the proceeds, or he can come up with the 75% to buy you out.

 

[jive1]

I'm curious, what kind of lights are these? If it's just 4 cans on a stand, it's not that much money so you should be able to come up with something where one party buys out the other and the other buys a replacement without hard feelings. But, if it's a more substantial light system costing thousands, then it might make things more complicated because it will be harder for either party to replace.

 

[EdO.]

A band is effectively a partnership. When a partner leaves, they are bought out and retain no ownership of partnership assets.

I don't get all the hand wringing going on with this subject. Four people put up equal funds to purchase lights and all 4 own equal shares, right? Majority rule, 75% still control ownership. The 4th guy gets bought out or he buys out the majority owners. That's the only fair way to do it. What's so difficult to understand about that?

 

[LowNloud1]

It's a pair of Chavel DJ LED cans. We paid about $650 for them new.

I took tghese ideas to the band and the bottom line ends up that the band member who is his partner does not want to stir the waters. So, essentially we are stuck with having to let him borrow them.

The rest of us are not happy about it. I personally don't like being obligated to let him use them. It doesn't feel right to me but I am not willing to push the issue because of the bigger issue of the parnership.

The moral here is I think everyone in the band realizes the need to have this all figured out from the get go instead of dealing with it down the road.

Thank you to everyone who chimed in. As usual, my TalkBass brothers and sisters came through for me.

 

[Oddly]

I took tghese ideas to the band and the bottom line ends up that the band member who is his partner does not want to stir the waters.

The moral here is I think everyone in the band realizes the need to have this all figured out from the get go instead of dealing with it down the road.

Thank you to everyone who chimed in. As usual, my TalkBass brothers and sisters came through for me.

I had a feeling that'd be the case.
A lousy position to be in, especially for the band member who now has to feel indebted to the rest of you for saving the business relationship (which makes me wonder what sort of business partnership he's involved in - sure doesn't seem an equal one - but that's another issue entirely).
Lesson learned, I guess.
Best of luck in the future!

 

[JimmyThunder]

I took tghese ideas to the band and the bottom line ends up that the band member who is his partner does not want to stir the waters. So, essentially we are stuck with having to let him borrow them.

The rest of us are not happy about it. I personally don't like being obligated to let him use them. It doesn't feel right to me but I am not willing to push the issue because of the bigger issue of the parnership.

Well then I'd have THAT dude buy out your share and the other guy's share. Now each band has one guy with a stake in the lights and they're free to work out any partnerships between the two of them, which they obviously have a history of doing just fine. And neither of you two dudes feel the resentment of having no say in these decisions.

 

[Muttleybass]

I learned early on to NEVER go in on equipment. I have been ripped off way too many times. Once, early in my career, the guitarist who owned this cool light show sol it to me because he was broke, then when the band split I went to go get it and he'd sold it to someone else. When I threatened to un-pretty his stupid face (I was young and more violent back then), he gave me the last of his PA gear. A couple o old PA bins. Nothing I could do... Couldn't get blood from a stone. He still owed money on gear he'd sold to make the payments.

From then on, it was always a "What do we need" situation. I bought monitors, the singer bought the board, guitarist bought the PA FOH... Marked all our gear with coloured tape and etched with our driver's license number. Anything we couldn't afford we'd split the rent on.

Now it doesn't matter 'cuz I own everything. Sure stung when I was 22, tho'.

 

[sqlb3rn]

All my gear is mine... I don't leave anything at the rehearsal spot, not even cables. After 25+ years, I'm tired of "losing" things.

 

[jive1]

It's a pair of Chavel DJ LED cans. We paid about $650 for them new.

How about each party keeps a tree? If both bands are booked for the same night, at least you have one tree available. If the other band is not booked, then one band can use both trees. After a while, it'll probably be a pain in the butt for one of the bands, and someone will want to purchase a second tree for itself. It'll be much cheaper to replace one tree than two, so there will be a little less resistance to replace.

 

[Downunderwonder]

How about each party keeps a tree? If both bands are booked for the same night, at least you have one tree available. If the other band is not booked, then one band can use both trees. After a while, it'll probably be a pain in the butt for one of the bands, and someone will want to purchase a second tree for itself. It'll be much cheaper to replace one tree than two, so there will be a little less resistance to replace.

nice out of box thinking but what about the controller?

 

[jive1]

nice out of box thinking but what about the controller?

For par cans? A chase controller or simple DMX controller will cost around $50. And if it's the Chauvet 4 Bar, then each will come with it's own controller.