Ernie Ball may as well be boutique now.

[FunkHead]

The price seems to be in line with Fender custom shop and Warwick masteebuilt.

Uh, What? Fender custom Shop basses are way more than street price of Ernie Ball.

With many imports getting up to the $2000 range, Music Man basses are pretty reasonable.

A new Boutique bass is going to be $3k & up generally speaking.

Best bang for the Buck is Rickenbacker at around $1500 for a USA Neck-Thru masterpiece.

 

[Luigir]

Uh, What? Fender custom Shop basses are way more than street price of Ernie Ball.

With many imports getting up to the $2000 range, Music Man basses are pretty reasonable.

A new Boutique bass is going to be $3k & up generally speaking.

Best bang for the Buck is Rickenbacker at around $1500 for a USA Neck-Thru masterpiece.

Take a look at Thomann. Fender Custom shop for about 3.5k like the Music Man in discussion (Bass Family Reserve):
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Rickenbacker is good but as everything somebody likes it and somebody doesn't. There are a lot of really really good basses between 800 and 2000 bucks.

 

[Dr. Cheese]

Do you think there should be cheaper models, or that current models should be cheaper?

I don't know what EBMM should do. I am just noting their prices.

 

[MoeTown1986]

It should also be noted that Musicman changed all their hardware to aluminum. Last I checked, aluminum cost more than steel. Maybe that has something to do with the increase. People complained for years that MM basses were heavy. MM made them lighter, at a cost.

 

[metron]

I don't know what EBMM should do. I am just noting their prices.

Yeah I heard they went up. Unless it's something unique, used EBMM basses I see locally still need to drop to $1k or below to sell so used prices are still not bad.

I'll tell ya though Cheese, if my name was Moneybags McCashindough, I would buy a Caprice!

 

[InternetAlias]

It should also be noted that musician changed all their hardware to aluminum. Last I checked, aluminum cost more than steel. Maybe that has something to do with the increase. People complained for years that MM basses were heavy. MM made them lighter, at a cost.

How much do you think a few hundred grams of the aluminum alloy they are using costs? Because it can't be much. Also it's likely softer than steel, and thus easier to machine. There's so little of it that it can't amount to any sensible effect on a price if we're talking about $2000 instruments. If the instrument was $100 new then the price of specific steel vs specific aluminum alloy would really matter.

 

[MoeTown1986]

How much do you think a few hundred grams of the aluminum alloy they are using costs? Because it can't be much. Also it's likely softer than steel, and thus easier to machine. There's so little of it that it can't amount to any sensible effect on a price if we're talking about $2000 instruments. If the instrument was $100 new then the price of specific steel vs specific aluminum alloy would really matter.

I understand what you're saying. I was just pointing out one possible reason for the change. I don't think Musicman basses are at all over priced. I thought they were a great deal at their old prices. The price now, to me, matches their quality. To the OP, I don't think anything under $3,000 is a boutique price. If he wasn't a "cheaper" option, he should by a Sterling by Musicman.

 

[Knavery]

And THIS is why you buy used.

 

[bkbirge]

I think the comparison with cell phones is a little off. Cell phones can be made pretty close to 100% with robots and generally are. The market is worldwide, people in huts in Africa have cellphones. Billions of people. Margins can be small and still generate a fortune that would boggle our minds.

EB and other bass guitar makers sell what, maybe a few hundred to a few thousand basses a year (I'm guessing, have no idea actually)? And the build process is labor intensive, lots of *skilled* humans involved, and each of those humans needs a salary. Labor would seem to me to be much more of a driving factor than the price of raw materials.

Also, you should go price electronics parts. You will be surprised at how costly something as simple as volume potentiometers (and the knobs!) are when matched against a single cell phone processor.

 

[MultiScaleMale]

The new Special series Stingrays are worth every bit of the $2100 price tag. Boutique basses used to cost $2k or so to start, but now, they're mostly over $3k. One builder had a Jazz 5 string that I was looking at, but it's $3600 and he's a mid priced builder. PS - Guitar Center routinely has 15% off coupons.

 

[Dr. Cheese]

The new Special series Stingrays are worth every bit of the $2100 price tag. Boutique basses used to cost $2k or so to start, but now, they're mostly over $3k. One builder had a Jazz 5 string that I was looking at, but it's $3600 and he's a mid priced builder. PS - Guitar Center routinely has 15% off coupons.

I know boutique prices are up. Sadowsky having to use an overseas factory keep at least one lines of his basses under $2K is a good example.

 

[Dr. Cheese]

And THIS is why you buy used.

True, but good used bass supply depends on folks buying them new.

 

[JRA]

bad news if you're a fan.

 

[SlimBaixo]

What's surprising to be is the fact that all Bongos are made of basswood. I would assume for the price, you'd be getting better quality wood like in the Stingray Series. $3k+ for basswood? I rather spend that on two basses, minimum.

 

[InternetAlias]

What's surprising to be is the fact that all Bongos are made of basswood. I would assume for the price, you'd be getting better quality wood like in the Stingray Series. $3k+ for basswood? I rather spend that on two basses, minimum.

Basswood IS quality wood. It's a great tonewood. It's just that it got infamous because it was very often used in cheap guitars. Basswood is an example of a wood that's cheap but good. BTW most wood is rather inexpensive (compared to how much the end product sells for) when ordered in large quantities that guitar manufacturers order them in. However, processing it to bodies and necks is a whole different thing and can be pretty resource consuming, THAT's can require a ton of machinery for numerous processes that must be undergone to convert dried wood into necks and bodies.

 

[CapnSev]

Music Man instruments are produced in the USA, of near-boutique quality, and Sterling Ball pays his workers a living wage. That's where the money goes, and that's fine by me.

..and it certainly reflects in the instrument. EBMM's have always been well made, but the last few years have been crazy good in quality. I'm amazed at the detail every time I pick one up. Plus, they do have budget lines that get good reviews (never spent a lot of time with one myself) that are available as well.

Take a look at Gibson if you want to see the opposite happening with an American-made company.

 

[SlimBaixo]

Basswood IS quality wood. It's a great tonewood. It's just that it got infamous because it was very often used in cheap guitars. Basswood is an example of a wood that's cheap but good. BTW most wood is rather inexpensive (compared to how much the end product sells for) when ordered in large quantities that guitar manufacturers order them in. However, processing it to bodies and necks is a whole different thing and can be pretty resource consuming, THAT's can require a ton of machinery for numerous processes that must be undergone to convert dried wood into necks and bodies.

I wasn't knocking the wood so much as it seems I did, but the quality of basswood is inconsistent. I've heard played basswood basses with great tone and some with sub par tone. Though, I do admit, I would have to trust Musicman is keeping the quality.

 

[BobKos]

I'm not an EBMM fanboy by any means. But I do respect how EBMM runs their company. They build a consistently high quality mass-produced instrument. They build the right blend of machine made parts with human made parts to make it just right for their audience. And they KNOW their audience. They listen to their audience. They offer products that engage the enthusiasm and pocket books of their audience. I think they're doing it right. I bought a $2400 Relex / 25th bass about 8 years ago. It was alot of money then as it is still now. I was thrilled about that purchase and still have that bass. I have 5 other EBMM basses that I also enjoy. Have sold some that I didn't like, and others I wish I had back. I can give or take SB's public persona, can live without the EBMM forum, but believe EBMM builds a good product and runs a good guitar company. I think they'll be fine.

 

[InternetAlias]

I wasn't knocking the wood so much as it seems I did, but the quality of basswood is inconsistent. I've heard played basswood basses with great tone and some with sub par tone. Though, I do admit, I would have to trust Musicman is keeping the quality.

I have some interesting theories about what's going on here, partially fed by some pretty insider information on how factories that actually use wood for products work (although instruments need to take acoustics into the account which makes them different).

One of the actual good reasons for EBMM prices actually is that they really do keep the wood consistent. The same goes for Ibanez JEMs and pretty much all high end guitars and bass guitars that use basswood. The only mass produced high end guitars I'd actually honestly doubt are Gibsons but that's another can of worms.

Then again, there's not only one type of basswood, just like there's not just one type of maple, alder or ash, so that's another thing to keep in mind.

Generally, the subar blanks (even if originally intended for higher tier models) will usually end up on lower tier models. Not sure what EBMM does with them, but I am pretty sure Ibanez uses subpar wood from higher tier models on lower tier models, just like sunburst and natural models always require a prettier grain than solid color finishes, or wood that's getting a maple top. This would explain why Ibanez makes a version of GSR200 and GSR205 with oddly expensive looking wood, maybe it just did not make the cut into their higher tier models, then Japanese efficiency took over and they decided to still use the wood but in lower tier models.

Some manufacturers also use heat treated basswood which produces some really interesting results. But the general rule is that the more expensive the guitar the greater likelihood some wood selection has been going on (except Gibson).

 

[MotorCityMinion]

The construction of a bass with a bolt on neck really hasn't changed much in the last few decades. CNC has given us higher accuracy, which most manufactures use. A bass of this nature can only be built so well. So where is the price point of a perfectly built bass, from a utilitarian stand point? Anything after that is cosmetic fluff. Personal choices, peer pressure, nostalgia drives this market when you start to exceed $700. If Ernie Ball can get away with it, good for them. It does open doors though for others to come in at a much better price point at build quality though.