Extremely Light Flat Wound Strings?

[Alan Wrench]

The impression is his issue is with tension. The La Bella LTF-4A-S would offer low tension, but perhaps not low enough.
Here's a comparison of tension values at 30" scale between the composite D'Addario set I suggested (3 guitar flats + 1 bass flat) and the La Bella set
[EDIT - I've gone ahead and also thrown in the below-mentioned Thomastik-Infeld JF324, and also the rarer-to-find version with the thinner E]:

D'Addario      La Bella     Thomastik-Infeld
ECG+ECB:       LTF:         JF324:    JF324H:

032 19#        042 28.2#    043 28.8
045 21#        056 26.5#    056 28.8
065 24.7#      075 23.7#    070 24.3
085 23#        100 26.6#    106 31    095 25.2

Thank you HaphAsSard for taking the time here. According to Rotosound, total tension on the LA66’s I use is 103.58 lbs. If my math is correct, the mixed D’Addario set above totals at 87.7 pounds, the Labella LTF is 105 pounds, and the TI with the 95 pound E string is 107.1 pounds. I honestly don’t know how much these different weights will translate to “feel.” But your mixed set definitely is the winner with regard to my penchant for low low tension. However, I think all of these are in the ballpark. At least I hope so. Thanks again!

 

[Alan Wrench]

As I said, not medium-scale. They're short-scale, which the OP needs (vd. his first and latest posts)


Yes, it will, on both platforms (you will have to top-load them on the U5, they're too short for thru-body, or their full-diameter section is, to be precise).

Great, thanks!

 

[HaphAsSard]

Thank you HaphAsSard for taking the time here. According to Rotosound, total tension on the LA66’s I use is 103.58 lbs. If my math is correct, the mixed D’Addario set above totals at 87.7 pounds, the Labella LTF is 105 pounds, and the TI with the 95 pound E string is 107.1 pounds. I honestly don’t know how much these different weights will translate to “feel.” But your mixed set definitely is the winner with regard to my penchant for low low tension. However, I think all of these are in the ballpark. At least I hope so. Thanks again!

The RS66LA set has 103lbs' total tension on a long-scale bass. Have you been using it on a short-scale? If so, its tension at 30" is a little over 80 pounds total, and the D'Addario does indeed get closer than the other contendenders (the 760-FD might too).

(If, instead, you've used the Rotos on a long-scale but never on either shorty, and for one of them you want the same feel only flatwound, the Chromes may prove just right - they're stiffer than rounds, and in so being they would compensate for the difference in tension to a degree - or they might be too much of a light thing.)

 

[OhDee]

dont wanna be a party pooper but if you go too thin they just won't sound like flats anymore.
at some point they just sound like bad rounds... the tension is what makes them sound the way they do, you need notes to give a "flat and clear fundemental sustain" because your frequency range is more condensed...

If you are looking for brightness from a flatwound Thomastik are amazing for that... just take their lightest gauge and get used to it... maybe put some extra heavy strings on another bass and then when you move to the bass in question they will psychologically feel light (this actually works)

 

[singlemalt]

Get in touch with FretNation.com and see what Jason can do for you.

FWIW, I did lots of experimenting with trying to find the limits of light and low tension.
I tried the TI flats A-C strings tuned down to E-C. I used a standard 34” scale four string set with a single C I bought from FretNation. Overshot the mark by quite a bit. Think touch guitar like sensitive. Any left hand mute was likely to fret a note.
I left extra silk when I fitted the set so I could go back to standard E-G. Cost me $14 for the single C TI flat to try.

I think TIJF hit the spot. Labella low tension flats are another suggestion.

With rounds. I found more latitude, but now, I stick with light sets from D’Addario (xl’s come in .035) or super light Boomers (.030), or sets from Payson strings.

Many rounds were stiff enough that the A-C strings downtuned to E-G worked ok. I used up lots of old strings doing experiments. It was kind of fun, and I found the lightest sets I can use.

In the end, I just buy Ti jazz flats and keep them forever.

 

[Bassamatic]

I was curious myself as I like lighter gauge strings and even felt the .095 I just put on my short scale stingray was not light enough I did a little search. I thought I would look into bass VI strings and found something.

Pyramid VI Flatwound String for Harley Benton.

Might not have all the gauges you are looking for but it does have a .085 E string and is a short scale flatwound...

Invalid Link Removed

or I typed in

bass vi strings flatwound pyramid harley benton into google

I hope this helps. I plan on buying the Beatle Bass TI flats for my short scale P bass because as much as I tried the imbalance on the normal set is just too much. Hopefully the .095 TI flat will work for me.

Pls be aware that most Beatle Bass strings are 32" (medium) scale because of the tailpiece,

 

[bigtone23]

The impression is his issue is with tension. The La Bella LTF-4A-S would offer low tension, but perhaps not low enough.
Here's a comparison of tension values at 30" scale between the composite D'Addario set I suggested (3 guitar flats + 1 bass flat) and the La Bella set
[EDIT - I've gone ahead and also thrown in the below-mentioned Thomastik-Infeld JF324, and also the rarer-to-find version with the thinner E]:

D'Addario      La Bella     Thomastik-Infeld
ECG+ECB:       LTF:         JF324:    JF324H:

032 19#        042 28.2#    043 28.8
045 21#        056 26.5#    056 28.8
065 24.7#      075 23.7#    070 24.3
085 23#        100 26.6#    106 31    095 25.2

Seems that any of these options would be right in the wheelhouse.
The OP's Roto RS66LA (mentioned as the "control" set of strings), have the following tensions at long/34" scale.
30 20.11 lbs
50 29.85 lbs
65 27.62 lbs
85 26.41 lbs

 

[Deleted member 271037]

For such light gauges you will probably have to put together a set of single strings. I can only think of one place and one brand with good selection of single, flatwound, SHORT scale strings at the gauges you need.

Pyramid Flatwound Short Scale Single Strings for Electric Bass, 10,20 €

Tailored for short scale: buy Pyramid Flatwound single bass strings online – ideal for precise replacement, flexible setups, and smooth playability.

www.saitenmarkt.com

Saitenmarkt sell Pyramid Golds in gauges from .020 and upwards all the way to .120 (in .005 increments except the jump from .110 to .120)

For some reason .055 has ended up in the wrong place, between .110-.120 , but it's there.

But as always with short scale strings, measure from nut to ball end and make sure the winding length will fit your instruments. Pyramid Gold were originally designed for Höfners (with a tailpiece) so they have a slightly longer winding length than SOME short scale strings, but not quite as long as say TI Jazz Flats which are more like medium scale strings from most manufacturers.

Will it sound great? Certainly not with MY playing style. Those are FAR too light gauges for me. Anything lighter than 40-100 (flats) or 45-105 (rounds) is unplayable for me. But if you could make that ultra-light set of Rotos work on a short scale bass, I can't see any reason why flats of similar gauges shouldn't work too.

Btw, with flats on a short scale bass you should definitely be looking for short scale strings. With roundwounds you can get away with using long scale strings on short scale basses, but some types of flats (especially stiffer "old school" flats like these Pyramids) can unravel if you force the fully wound part of the string around the tuning post. The same goes for through-body stringing, which is not recommended for some types of flats, because of the increased break-angle over the saddles which can damage the strings.

 

[Alan Wrench]

The RS66LA set has 103lbs' total tension on a long-scale bass. Have you been using it on a short-scale? If so, its tension at 30" is a little over 80 pounds total, and the D'Addario does indeed get closer than the other contendenders (the 760-FD might too).

(If, instead, you've used the Rotos on a long-scale but never on either shorty, and for one of them you want the same feel only flatwound, the Chromes may prove just right - they're stiffer than rounds, and in so being they would compensate for the difference in tension to a degree - or they might be too much of a light thing.)

Yes, I have been using the RS66LA on 3 of my short scale basses. I had not thought that this decreases the tension more than the advertised stats, which makes sense. This is probably, in part why I have gravitated towards short scale basses. But yeah, the D’Addarios 760-FDs look like viable options! Thanks!

 

[Alan Wrench]

Get in touch with FretNation.com and see what Jason can do for you.

FWIW, I did lots of experimenting with trying to find the limits of light and low tension.
I tried the TI flats A-C strings tuned down to E-C. I used a standard 34” scale four string set with a single C I bought from FretNation. Overshot the mark by quite a bit. Think touch guitar like sensitive. Any left hand mute was likely to fret a note.
I left extra silk when I fitted the set so I could go back to standard E-G. Cost me $14 for the single C TI flat to try.

I think TIJF hit the spot. Labella low tension flats are another suggestion.

With rounds. I found more latitude, but now, I stick with light sets from D’Addario (xl’s come in .035) or super light Boomers (.030), or sets from Payson strings.

Many rounds were stiff enough that the A-C strings downtuned to E-G worked ok. I used up lots of old strings doing experiments. It was kind of fun, and I found the lightest sets I can use.

In the end, I just buy Ti jazz flats and keep them forever.

For such light gauges you will probably have to put together a set of single strings. I can only think of one place and one brand with good selection of single, flatwound, SHORT scale strings at the gauges you need.

Pyramid Flatwound Short Scale Single Strings for Electric Bass, 10,20 €

Tailored for short scale: buy Pyramid Flatwound single bass strings online – ideal for precise replacement, flexible setups, and smooth playability.

www.saitenmarkt.com

Saitenmarkt sell Pyramid Golds in gauges from .020 and upwards all the way to .120 (in .005 increments except the jump from .110 to .120)

For some reason .055 has ended up in the wrong place, between .110-.120 , but it's there.

But as always with short scale strings, measure from nut to ball end and make sure the winding length will fit your instruments. Pyramid Gold were originally designed for Höfners (with a tailpiece) so they have a slightly longer winding length than SOME short scale strings, but not quite as long as say TI Jazz Flats which are more like medium scale strings from most manufacturers.

Will it sound great? Certainly not with MY playing style. Those are FAR too light gauges for me. Anything lighter than 40-100 (flats) or 45-105 (rounds) is unplayable for me. But if you could make that ultra-light set of Rotos work on a short scale bass, I can't see any reason why flats of similar gauges shouldn't work too.

Btw, with flats on a short scale bass you should definitely be looking for short scale strings. With roundwounds you can get away with using long scale strings on short scale basses, but some types of flats (especially stiffer "old school" flats like these Pyramids) can unravel if you force the fully wound part of the string around the tuning post. The same goes for through-body stringing, which is not recommended for some types of flats, because of the increased break-angle over the saddles which can damage the strings.

And there it is! Flats in exactly the gauges I’m comfortable with. Thank you so much. I’ve gotten so much great feedback and information from this thread, and various ways to address the tension issues with the strings I’m looking for. Thank you very much!

 

[Alan Wrench]

Get in touch with FretNation.com and see what Jason can do for you.

FWIW, I did lots of experimenting with trying to find the limits of light and low tension.
I tried the TI flats A-C strings tuned down to E-C. I used a standard 34” scale four string set with a single C I bought from FretNation. Overshot the mark by quite a bit. Think touch guitar like sensitive. Any left hand mute was likely to fret a note.
I left extra silk when I fitted the set so I could go back to standard E-G. Cost me $14 for the single C TI flat to try.

I think TIJF hit the spot. Labella low tension flats are another suggestion.

With rounds. I found more latitude, but now, I stick with light sets from D’Addario (xl’s come in .035) or super light Boomers (.030), or sets from Payson strings.

Many rounds were stiff enough that the A-C strings downtuned to E-G worked ok. I used up lots of old strings doing experiments. It was kind of fun, and I found the lightest sets I can use.

In the end, I just buy Ti jazz flats and keep them forever.

Get in touch with FretNation.com and see what Jason can do for you.

FWIW, I did lots of experimenting with trying to find the limits of light and low tension.
I tried the TI flats A-C strings tuned down to E-C. I used a standard 34” scale four string set with a single C I bought from FretNation. Overshot the mark by quite a bit. Think touch guitar like sensitive. Any left hand mute was likely to fret a note.
I left extra silk when I fitted the set so I could go back to standard E-G. Cost me $14 for the single C TI flat to try.

I think TIJF hit the spot. Labella low tension flats are another suggestion.

With rounds. I found more latitude, but now, I stick with light sets from D’Addario (xl’s come in .035) or super light Boomers (.030), or sets from Payson strings.

Many rounds were stiff enough that the A-C strings downtuned to E-G worked ok. I used up lots of old strings doing experiments. It was kind of fun, and I found the lightest sets I can use.

In the end, I just buy Ti jazz flats and keep them forever.

I’ve never tried TIs, but they are definitely on my list. Thanks for sharing your experience. As I mentioned in an earlier post in this thread, I never thought to reduce tension by down tuning. I’ve been using, pretty much exclusively round wound Roto sound RSLA66s, and I’ve been pretty happy with them. But now, I’m rethinking even that. Especially, if as you say, there is more latitude with round wounds de tuning them. Definitely going to do some experimenting. Thank you so much!

 

[OhDee]

Ah nice! Congrats, OP talkbass never fails

Btw can anyone find NOT short scale on this website? I wanted to try Pyramids but I do like some weird gauges here and there (like 45-95 so a heavier G and light E)

Wasn’t able to find the single strings there just sets

 

[Deleted member 271037]

I’ve never tried TIs, but they are definitely on my list. Thanks for sharing your experience. As I mentioned in an earlier post in this thread, I never thought to reduce tension by down tuning. I’ve been using, pretty much exclusively round wound Roto sound RSLA66s, and I’ve been pretty happy with them. But now, I’m rethinking even that. Especially, if as you say, there is more latitude with round wounds de tuning them. Definitely going to do some experimenting. Thank you so much!

Be aware that the "standard" TI Jazz Flats short scale set has a very heavy gauge, stiff .106 E-sting. The difference in tension between E and A is absolutely insane. I love the long scale TIFJs (although they are slightly light/supple for my taste) but the I find the standard short scale set unplayable. If you want light strings I don't think you will like them either.

However, TI also offer a "Höfner" version of the Jazz Flats short scale set. This set has the same gauges as the standard short scale set for A-D-G but a considerably lighter .096 E-string. This set is FAR better balanced. Not all dealers have this "Höfner" set, but you should be able to find it. The gauges aren't quite as light as what you wanted, but TIJFs are inherently VERY supple/flexible. They feel lighter than they actually are. You might like them. Lovely tone as well.

Just be aware that they have a 32" winding length, which is comparable to medium scale strings from most manufacturers. However, TIJFs are so flexible that they're probably the only flats I wouldn't worry about the fully wound part of the sting ending up around the tuning post. To be honest I haven't actually tried this myself, but I HAVE used TIJFs on a Mustang bass where many other flats would have unravelled because of the steep break angle over the saddles. The TIJFs still work fine on that bass, after several years. But proceed at your own risk, TIJFs are very expensive.