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Firewire Vs USB audio interface?
- Thread starter GazzBass
- Start date
the benefits are just data bandwidth so that you can have more tracks or higher sampling rates and bit depths or a combination with FW. If you are using a USB interface that you like, stick with it.
Yes quite a lot of laptops/PCs have firewire still. Look at Macs for example - the industry standard for DAW, all models come with firewire as standard.
I use ProTools MPowered with my Delta66 card hooked up to an omni I/O but I have 2 friends, one using the usb MBox for Protools and the other using firewire.
The usb Mbox actually had some noticable latency and the firewire did not. Just a thought.
But anyway, imo I'd always go firewire, even if it costs a little more.
Ash.
I use ProTools MPowered with my Delta66 card hooked up to an omni I/O but I have 2 friends, one using the usb MBox for Protools and the other using firewire.
The usb Mbox actually had some noticable latency and the firewire did not. Just a thought.
But anyway, imo I'd always go firewire, even if it costs a little more.
Ash.
- Jun 25, 2007
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- Artist:TC Electronic RH450 bass system (original test-pilot)
Just looking at the audio interface issue:
Firewire: Much better selection and overall higher quality of interfaces with better preamps more inputs.
USB: more universal from a plug and play perspective. Starting to see some bigger interfaces (MOTU 828USB, Marian UCON, Alesis MixUSB...)
If your laptop or PC doesn't have firewire built in you probably have an expansion solution available via PCI, PCMCIA, ExpressCard....
Go do the homework on this, but my research and personal experience show that USB2 can't handle the sustained throughput, especially if it involves any bidirectional transfer, to manage more than uncompressed stereo without dropout issues. I use a NI AK1 that has been a great solution for light duty portable work, or driving a PA while still having a dedicated cue out, and it is fine as a 2 channel box.
The reason that Firewire gets the win for me is that I rarely/never have ONLY the audio interface on the bus. It has to play nice with storage and sometimes that storage is the source/destination for the audio data in question. USB falls apart like a wet tissue once you start doing that.
Firewire: Much better selection and overall higher quality of interfaces with better preamps more inputs.
USB: more universal from a plug and play perspective. Starting to see some bigger interfaces (MOTU 828USB, Marian UCON, Alesis MixUSB...)
If your laptop or PC doesn't have firewire built in you probably have an expansion solution available via PCI, PCMCIA, ExpressCard....
Go do the homework on this, but my research and personal experience show that USB2 can't handle the sustained throughput, especially if it involves any bidirectional transfer, to manage more than uncompressed stereo without dropout issues. I use a NI AK1 that has been a great solution for light duty portable work, or driving a PA while still having a dedicated cue out, and it is fine as a 2 channel box.
The reason that Firewire gets the win for me is that I rarely/never have ONLY the audio interface on the bus. It has to play nice with storage and sometimes that storage is the source/destination for the audio data in question. USB falls apart like a wet tissue once you start doing that.
My memory is a bit hazy on this but I researched when I bought my Alesis interface.
From what I recall- transfer speeds are pretty similar- both probably quicker than the speed of the drive. The deciding factor for me was that USB requires CPU processing power where FW is a bit smarter- looks after its own business.
From what I recall- transfer speeds are pretty similar- both probably quicker than the speed of the drive. The deciding factor for me was that USB requires CPU processing power where FW is a bit smarter- looks after its own business.
While many computers still have firewire, all Macs do not. The current Macbook does not have firewire.
That said, I would pick a firewire interface over a USB every day.
Two things to look at Burst vs. Sustained transfer rates, and One Way vs. BiDirectional data transfer.
Here's the way the Wikipedia entry describes it: 'Although high-speed USB 2.0 nominally runs at a higher signaling rate (480 Mbit/s) than FireWire 400, data transfers over S400 FireWire interfaces generally outperform similar transfers over USB 2.0 interfaces. Typical USB PC-hosts rarely exceed sustained transfers of 280 Mbit/s, with 240 Mbit/s being more typical. This is likely due to USB's reliance on the host-processor to manage low-level USB protocol, whereas FireWire delegates the same tasks to the interface hardware. For example, the FireWire host interface supports memory-mapped devices, which allows high-level protocols to run without loading the host CPU with interrupts and buffer-copy operations.[4] Besides throughput, other differences are that it uses simpler bus networking, provides more power over the chain, more reliable data transfer, and uses less CPU resources.[23]
FireWire 800 is substantially faster than Hi-Speed USB, both in theory and in practice"
Truth. The Mac Book Pro's are the only one's with firewire 800/400 now.
Let's not even get into them going cheap on the firewire chipsets they use now...
It definitely seems like Apple is phasing out the Firewire connections on their computers - starting with the lower end laptops (which I just bought...)
I've noticed a similar trend in available audio products - Firewire seems to be on its way out.
Apparently Apple seems to be pretty up on technological trends. Back in the day, they were the first to make a computer with only a CD drive and no floppy disk drive. It caused a stink, but before long, floppy drives were a thing of the past.
Bye, bye Firewire!
I've noticed a similar trend in available audio products - Firewire seems to be on its way out.
Apparently Apple seems to be pretty up on technological trends. Back in the day, they were the first to make a computer with only a CD drive and no floppy disk drive. It caused a stink, but before long, floppy drives were a thing of the past.
Bye, bye Firewire!
I use a lot of drum VSTs with an electronic drum kit. There is a huge difference in latency there between USB and FW interfaces. I've tried several firewire interfaces and can get around 3 - 4 ms latency with a 128 buffer (as reported by Cubase). With USB I had to set the buffer to at least 512 and my latency jumped to around 12 - 13ms and I would still get pops and cracks sometimes.
The thing you have to be careful about with firewire is that not any old firewire chipset will do. For example if you are using windows some manufactuers strongly suggest you use a Ti chipset. MOTU and M-Audio come to mind.
Adam
The thing you have to be careful about with firewire is that not any old firewire chipset will do. For example if you are using windows some manufactuers strongly suggest you use a Ti chipset. MOTU and M-Audio come to mind.
Adam
Not that this would happen to anybody else, but I had a major USB failure last night. None of the USB ports would work. I couldn't use any external controllers. I think the essentially all the ports go through the same on board controller.
I won't have time to check it out but I suspect it's a software problem. I bet an automatic update got me. (I had the system on the internet to update some licenses, I got lazy and just left it on there.)
Good thing I use a PCI audio interface as it worked fine. When it comes time to upgrade my system I will probably look for a PCI express bus solution. Unless I have assurance that ports use separate internal controllers for redundancy.
I've only seen Directwire on PCI like boards and some firewire interface - and it's too handy to live without.
I won't have time to check it out but I suspect it's a software problem. I bet an automatic update got me. (I had the system on the internet to update some licenses, I got lazy and just left it on there.)
Good thing I use a PCI audio interface as it worked fine. When it comes time to upgrade my system I will probably look for a PCI express bus solution. Unless I have assurance that ports use separate internal controllers for redundancy.
I've only seen Directwire on PCI like boards and some firewire interface - and it's too handy to live without.
This is 100% true. I wouldn't invest in a piece of pricey firewire gear at this point.
IMO, that's kinda premature since there isn't an alternative external device standard with the specs to handle big chunks of streaming data, or one that has device-device data handling, and USB3 looks to have the same shortcomings as USB2. On top of that, external hardware makers haven't switched away from FW. Aside from the mac laptops, and a few pc laptops, everyone else runs FW with some piece of FW interface hardware. Apple taking FW off of one machine is bad news for people who need FW and didn't want to spring for the Pro (or buy the non-unibody macbook that is still available new and refurb), but it really didn't change anything in the device market.
What you are really saying is: if you want 8 channels+ of external interface, choose from maybe three or four available USB2 units, or suck a lemon. Meanwhile there are hundreds of thousands of FW audio interfaces out there in use every day, loads being sold every day, getting a lot of work done.
And this is particularly important when you start relying on your CPU to render filters and plugins on the fly during playback. My antiquated 1.6ghz G5 needs all the help it can get.
well, most chipsets will do if you're not too worried about latency, but yeah, TI chipset is certainly the best.
for those of you suggesting that firewire is a dead horse... um, saddle up.
one of the main reasons to go firewire is that USB interfaces only get so far with respect to A/D converters. almost all of the higher quality A/D converters show up in firewire (and PCI - far more ancient than firewire!), not USB, interfaces. USB typically appears on cheaper gear.
I personally have both FW and USB interfaces. I prefer the FW by far. (Even though FW400 has a TERRIBLE jack that is VERY easy to disconnect by jostling, sometimes forcing you to restart your computer!)
But it's not imaginary - Apple IS phasing out FW, and I would bet that within 3 years none of their production models have FW inputs of any kind. If you don't plan on replacing your computer in the next 5-6 years, then by all means start collecting FW interfaces!
Without apple, FW dies. Simple as that.
Yeah, it's popular with Sony (and other) digital camcorders. FW makes a big difference with digital video.
I'll take that bet. I would bet that you'll find a firewire interface on their Pro machines for quite some time.
