Fretless bass sounds dull

[miner]

I'm confused - are the Black Beauties not round enough?

I have similar issues with my fretlesses. One has crappy electronics and both could really benefit from a lacquered fingerboard. I don't expect them to sound like fretteds, but I do want livelier tone. I'm curious how the steel plate idea would work...

I got a flat steel bar and bent it to match the radius of my fingerboard. It made a small difference, but not enough to be worth it sadly. I put new strings and raised the action a little and it is definitely better, but not 100%. I think a preamp is probably my next plan.

Some Roundwounds...
and honestly...For Dimarzio pickups...I found Carey, preampts match to them nicely...(Better then Audere in that situation).

Thank you! I don't know much about commercially available preamps, I usually build my own stuff when it comes to low power stuff.

 

[dkelley]

Lower the action.... Don't raise it. IMHO

Also your fingerboard is rigidly hard already so steel bars wont help... As you found.... Not to mention people get bright tone from fretless all the time with wood boards.... Like my music man fretless. Zing like crazy.

It's your setup, string choice, and pickups.

Those pups are scooped iirc which isn't the most versatile fretless tone starting point.

A vari mid control add on like an emg vmc is my electronics recommendation. Amazing thing to add to any active or passive fretless bass to give you the control needed.

 

[dkelley]

Oh.... And fretted basses sound more metallic in the attack and there's nothing you can do about it. After playing fretless exclusively for a decade that's why i started buying and embracing fretted basses again as well..... The tone is much different and better for many things than fretless no matter how great and sizzly your fretless is.

 

[miner]

Lower the action.... Don't raise it. IMHO

Also your fingerboard is rigidly hard already so steel bars wont help... As you found.... Not to mention people get bright tone from fretless all the time with wood boards.... Like my music man fretless. Zing like crazy.

It's your setup, string choice, and pickups.

Those pups are scooped iirc which isn't the most versatile fretless tone starting point.

A vari mid control add on like an emg vmc is my electronics recommendation. Amazing thing to add to any active or passive fretless bass to give you the control needed.

I'll look into that EMG VMC! Thanks!

If I lowered the action any more than it already was the strings would be flat on the fingerboard lol. Raising it got rid of some of that note "bloom" or "wah" and it sounds more "solid" to me. I'll look into that mid control and maybe someday I'll switch out the pickups for some EMG's, but it isn't bad now!

 

[AlexanderB]

IME, voicing of a fretless is much harder as the initial "clank" from the fret is missing. Voicing too high up in the treble is pointless and only brings out things you do not want. IMHO, rich and complex mids is the key to an "open" and interesting fretless tone. Active EMGs would be a good choise in my book, vintage style P/Us not so much. Def. rounds, but nickel over stainless. Low setup, right hand position and attack will do the rest.
Nice bass, by the way.

 

[Chef]

Put some RotoSound stainless rounds on it, and a 500K pot, and maybe a different cap value.

 

[SGT. BAKER]

It sounds good when other people play it, but I don't like how it sounds when I play it hahaha.

Sometimes it´s too difficult to guess something from the distance. But if you like how it sounds when other people play, maybe the secret of your dull sound could be in your fingering technique.

I suggest you that try to emulate the same fingering technique that the other people, when they are playing your fretless. If they can get a good sound I think that you can get it too.

 

[Jim Carr]

Assuming your amp and cab are not the issue, I'd try these reversible changes one at a time—I've done them all with various fretless basses.

1. Stainless steel round wounds with a hex core (DR, Sadowsky) or Ken Smith slick round Lights ([Invalid or Expired Link Removed])
2. external preamp with the above (Sadowsky, Aquilar, Tech21 ParaDI)
3. fretted neck with all the above

 

[kodiakblair]

Regards the steel plate.

Something rings a bell about a fretless bass from the 80's that had a brass plate inlaid at the end of the fingerboard.
If I recall correctly it was for added zing when slapping. Think the bass was built by Doug Wikes.

 

[maestrovert]

Strings 1st, then pot(s) & cap values (the cheapest, tonally effective 'mod' you can do)....you might try a 1meg vol & 500k tone pot, & a .022 cap ...

 

[Jeff Scott]

Changing parts and strings won't make a difference (well they will, but that's not the issue here). The OP has already said that bass sounds great, like he wants it to sound, when someone else plays it; it just doesn't sound like that when he plays it. Sounds like technique issues here, doesn't it?

Miner, try and analyze what it is you do differently vs. others and figure it out. You can do it, really.

 

[pnchad]

switch to LaBellas black or even the new white tapes (whites are supposed to be brighter) but either string is a BIG upgrade

rounds underneath for the attack & sustain and tape to reduce noise & smooth out the harshness

LaBellas on ALL my high-end fretlesses (all 18 of them)

 

[miner]

Changing parts and strings won't make a difference (well they will, but that's not the issue here). The OP has already said that bass sounds great, like he wants it to sound, when someone else plays it; it just doesn't sound like that when he plays it. Sounds like technique issues here, doesn't it?

Miner, try and analyze what it is you do differently vs. others and figure it out. You can do it, really.

I think I worded that badly because everyone seems like they misunderstand what I meant by it lol.

I mean someone else plays it, and it sounds pretty good. In a band it sounds basically like a p bass but a little mellower. When I play a bass I'm always using something really bright and aggressive sounding, so when I play it, it sounds completely different from my other basses and I don't like it. It doesn't sound "bad" but it doesn't sound how I want it to. I don't want it to sound the way it did when other people played it, because that's basically how it sounds when I play it.

Just like if I played a hofner with flats, I wouldn't be happy with how it sounds. It might sound amazing for other people, but it wouldn't sound too great with anything that I do.

I don't know if that makes more sense, or if it's more confusing lol.

 

[miner]

switch to LaBellas black or even the new white tapes (whites are supposed to be brighter) but either string is a BIG upgrade

rounds underneath for the attack & sustain and tape to reduce noise & smooth out the harshness

LaBellas on ALL my high-end fretlesses (all 18 of them)

I think tapes would put me further in the direction away from where I would want to go! I started with coated rounds which were too dull, now I've got nickel rounds which are much better! Raising the action made it a little better, so I think EMG's and or a preamp will be the last 15% to get it where I want it!

 

[Jeff Scott]

That makes perfect sense. In that case, I would just find a different bass, most of the suggestions to change out bits and pieces is just a band-aid and probably will not truly solve the issues at hand.

 

[sonicnuance]

First of all, really nice instrument!

When I read the title of your post I was expecting to see an instrument with a neck pickup only. I was surprised to see an instrument with not only a bridge pickup but an epoxy coating. Those two things should help tremendously in getting the instrument to cut through a mix. I say "cut through a mix" as that is my goal along with blending with the other instruments. You mentioned you want it to sound like a fretted bass. Quite frankly, this might not be possible but the suggestion of round wounds (I'd try a light gauge btw) is a good one.

Since you said you like the sound when someone else plays it, I would focus on technique, the pickup blend knob and where you are plucking the string.

Also, I have always been surprised how good a fretless sounds when playing aggressively with a pick - you might try that.

Best of luck

 

[miner]

That makes perfect sense. In that case, I would just find a different bass, most of the suggestions to change out bits and pieces is just a band-aid and probably will not truly solve the issues at hand.

The big problem is that the bass I want doesn't really exist! That's why I put this bass together in the first place lol. I don't know if I would consider changing a couple parts a band-aid. It's just getting it set up to sound the way I want. And even if it is, if a band-aid is enough, then I'm happy! I don't think I've ever owned a bass where I haven't swapped at least a couple of things out to get it how I want it. Thanks for the suggestion!

This is my only passive bass, and this first one I've really had in 5 years, so that's part of why I think I'm not happy with it. All of my other basses I own are active. So that's one of the reasons I think I'm not happy with it. Like I said before though, different strings and setting it up a little differently made a big difference and it's getting close.

 

[Jeff Scott]

Passive basses can and do sound great, and erm , many times even better than an active bass. Many guys have thought my passive Martin Keiths have a preamp in them, one of them is fretless. Is fretless what you really want? If so, I am sure with time and some experimenting (plus some $$$) you will find the tone you are seeking. The first thing i would do is bypass the wiring harness altogether and listen to how the pickups sound without any loading (other than the amp) on them. The physical location and interaction between the two pickups will be a major influence on the tone, to start with, for starters.

 

[seansv]

Capacitor?

I hardly know her!

 

[Nic.]

I got a flat steel bar and bent it to match the radius of my fingerboard. It made a small difference, but not enough to be worth it sadly. I put new strings and raised the action a little and it is definitely better, but not 100%. I think a preamp is probably my next plan.



Thank you! I don't know much about commercially available preamps, I usually build my own stuff when it comes to low power stuff.

I'd be very interested to hear how that sounds!

Anyway, I think I had a similar situation to you some time back, I was using this DIY-defretted jazz and wanted a more aggressive tone. So I epoxied it, and I got closer.. but still not quite there. After spending a lot of time, I realize that there's nothing that quite makes a fretless sound like a fretted (well, I haven't tried a metal fingerboard but I don't think that'll work, I think it's more of the kind of attack rather than what frequencies are emphasized). But even though I didn't have the fret clank, I decided I can get really aggressive and punchy with a fretless in a different way that I'm happy with, so I stuck with fretless since I just prefer the feeling of fretless overall.