So - you're talking about what he did 30 years ago!!
It's pretty clear that today, he only plays EUB and gets plenty of gigs!!
It's pretty clear that today, he only plays EUB and gets plenty of gigs!!
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Double Bass Gigging with an EUB
- Thread starter bobbykokinos
- Start date
Bruce Lindfield said:Well - all these details are "interesting" - but actually irrelevant to the point I was making!!
So,my point was that I doubt anybody is saying to Eberhard Weber - .."you need to be more versatile - you need to play a "proper" DB as well!! That way you'll get more gigs!!
I don't suppose they are, but then again he is Eberhard Weber. I've also no doubt that the likes of Christian McBride, Ron Carter, Stanley Clarke, Dave Holland, Rufus Reid etc etc get calls because of who they are and the qualities they'll bring to a gig or a session - not because they happen to be able to play (or not) a particular variety of bass. Probably they also get enough calls to be able to pick and choose their gigs. I guess most players don't enjoy that happy state of affairs, though.
So the point I was making when I raised the question of "versatility" a few posts ago was merely that for those of us in a less exalted position in the bass firmament it can be helpful to be able to offer electric or upright, and maybe have a stab at trying to play it in more than one style.
Of course, that might be counterproductive if you can only half play in six styles. So it might be more helpful to be known for doing one thing excellently rather then loads of things not very well.
FWIW I am a seasoned UB and BG player. (22 years on both) I am building my own EUB because the UB does not cut it with the loud jazz band I play with. After several pickups and a ton of feed back. It was better after putting a K+K bassmax and preamp on it, though, it never produced the sound I wanted it to. I changed strings several times and took it to a local luthier MANY times for adjustments. Could not get it dialed in. So, I am going to build my own EUB that really kicks ass.
Plus, the EUB can be put in a custom made flight case for ease of travel and no oversized shipping or transport charges.
As I am sure many of you know, airlines make you pay for an extra seat. That is if they let you bring a UB on at all.
If the EUB I build sucks, I'll likely buy an Eminence also.
Take a listen to the Messenger http://www.messengerbass.com/sounds.html
Sounds great to me! I believe it has the Barbera bridge in it.
Tis is how UB should sound. At least to my ear.
Plus, the EUB can be put in a custom made flight case for ease of travel and no oversized shipping or transport charges.
As I am sure many of you know, airlines make you pay for an extra seat. That is if they let you bring a UB on at all.
If the EUB I build sucks, I'll likely buy an Eminence also.
Take a listen to the Messenger http://www.messengerbass.com/sounds.html
Sounds great to me! I believe it has the Barbera bridge in it.
Tis is how UB should sound. At least to my ear.
I got a call for an intimate outdoor jazz trio gig - vocal, guitar and bass. I found out that the club owner specifically requested an upright bass. In the past, I rented a double bass for a couple of years and gigged with it extensively, but I do not have a double bass at this time. So I pulled out my older BSX Series 2000 which has piezo and magnetic pickups and went to the gig.
I generally agree that the louder the gig is, the more useful the EUB is, tonewise. But I have to say that last night, on a very quiet, intimate gig with no percussion, my EUB sounded FANTASTIC. Things came together with minimal tweaking, and the response on the instrument was so good, that it really brought out the best in my playing. I had plenty of bottom end, but with nice midrange growl and a clarity that was not "guitar-like." I also had a nice "thump" working; the sustain was not excessive at that volume. I was using spirocore solo strings tuned down to orchestra pitch. It was really neat how great the EUB sounded in that setting. The crowd was very receptive to the trio.
In the end, the club owner was thrilled with the performance and definitely wants the group back for more dates. So in this instance, the EUB was "upright-ish enough." I think the best thing to do is to find an instrument and tone that works for you, and then really commit to it. Then your real personality will come through in your playing. Ultimately, that is what people will respond to.
I generally agree that the louder the gig is, the more useful the EUB is, tonewise. But I have to say that last night, on a very quiet, intimate gig with no percussion, my EUB sounded FANTASTIC. Things came together with minimal tweaking, and the response on the instrument was so good, that it really brought out the best in my playing. I had plenty of bottom end, but with nice midrange growl and a clarity that was not "guitar-like." I also had a nice "thump" working; the sustain was not excessive at that volume. I was using spirocore solo strings tuned down to orchestra pitch. It was really neat how great the EUB sounded in that setting. The crowd was very receptive to the trio.
In the end, the club owner was thrilled with the performance and definitely wants the group back for more dates. So in this instance, the EUB was "upright-ish enough." I think the best thing to do is to find an instrument and tone that works for you, and then really commit to it. Then your real personality will come through in your playing. Ultimately, that is what people will respond to.
The more I gig with my BugBass through Clarus/Wizzy, the more I think I'll avoid bringing the URB to another gig.
Besides the portability factor and compact footprint, the sound is more focused in most gig settings where I'd be fighting at least a bit of ringing from the URB at gig volume in proximity to the amp in tight quarters.
Besides the portability factor and compact footprint, the sound is more focused in most gig settings where I'd be fighting at least a bit of ringing from the URB at gig volume in proximity to the amp in tight quarters.
This is a very interesting discussion.
Several years ago I ordered a BSX Allegro. I worked with it pretty seriously for about a year, using it as a substitute for URB at venues with poor acoustics or with dreadful load-ins.
I chose the BSX because it had a very URB-like look and feel. Dino does make some incredible instruments from right here in Pgh.
Bottom line was...I could never get a tone that I liked (and I own some nice amps) and I could never get comfortable with it...especially considering the odd angled "tummy rest". I even had one custom made and it still felt wrong.
To answer the initial question of this post...did certain established jazz musicians in town poo poo the instrument...yes indeed. Did I lose gigs? Mmm...probably not, but I was encouraged by several trusted mentors to bring the "real" bass whenever possible.
There is an apples/oranges factor. Often times a pianist will have to bring a keyboard because there's no piano on location. Does a "real" piano sound better than the keyboard? Absolutely. One exception is when the piano is horribly out of tune!
A big problem I had with my EUB was what to do with it when on break. It didn't lie down nicely...so I had to lug the heavy tripod stand along as well. This meant bringing an EXTRA thing just to set the bass down...and I bought the darn thing to try and make things easier on myself!
All this being said...I'm still hoping to find an EUB that fits me. I would love to have one for travel, I'd love to have one for small stages, I'd love to use one on pop & variety gigs, I'd love to have one when the weather is bad, and I'd love to have serious volume power in rock/concert/dance situations.
Good luck...until I find the right one, I'll keep shedding my tunes so I don't have to lug my "Real" Books around anymore!
Several years ago I ordered a BSX Allegro. I worked with it pretty seriously for about a year, using it as a substitute for URB at venues with poor acoustics or with dreadful load-ins.
I chose the BSX because it had a very URB-like look and feel. Dino does make some incredible instruments from right here in Pgh.
Bottom line was...I could never get a tone that I liked (and I own some nice amps) and I could never get comfortable with it...especially considering the odd angled "tummy rest". I even had one custom made and it still felt wrong.
To answer the initial question of this post...did certain established jazz musicians in town poo poo the instrument...yes indeed. Did I lose gigs? Mmm...probably not, but I was encouraged by several trusted mentors to bring the "real" bass whenever possible.
There is an apples/oranges factor. Often times a pianist will have to bring a keyboard because there's no piano on location. Does a "real" piano sound better than the keyboard? Absolutely. One exception is when the piano is horribly out of tune!
A big problem I had with my EUB was what to do with it when on break. It didn't lie down nicely...so I had to lug the heavy tripod stand along as well. This meant bringing an EXTRA thing just to set the bass down...and I bought the darn thing to try and make things easier on myself!
All this being said...I'm still hoping to find an EUB that fits me. I would love to have one for travel, I'd love to have one for small stages, I'd love to use one on pop & variety gigs, I'd love to have one when the weather is bad, and I'd love to have serious volume power in rock/concert/dance situations.
Good luck...until I find the right one, I'll keep shedding my tunes so I don't have to lug my "Real" Books around anymore!
I saw Reginald Veal playing an EUB the other night at an outdoor concert with Cassandra Wilson. Couldn't really tell but it looked like the Yamaha silent bass - a stick bass with the simulated bouts. The bass wasn't in the mix that well but what I did hear sounded nice- the playing was great obviously. It fit in with Cassandra's world/jazz vibe nicely.
My Ergo 7 string is working out well for me. I use it on loud gigs, nobody seems to complain. The only bad feedback I have had is from a clarinetist who hates me anyway.
I find I am actually getting requests for it. Two of my gigs this month the leaders specifically asked for it.
It has a beautiful tone, it is fun to play I still love to play my acoustic bass more but it is not a bummer when I use the Ergo instead - and the high F is a blast!
I find I am actually getting requests for it. Two of my gigs this month the leaders specifically asked for it.
It has a beautiful tone, it is fun to play I still love to play my acoustic bass more but it is not a bummer when I use the Ergo instead - and the high F is a blast!
I play a 5 string KYDD and it only gave me more gigs. People seem to be amazed by the sound of it, but particularly by the way it looks.
I play afro-cuban music and jazz with it and the tone seems to fit in both styles of music really well.
I play afro-cuban music and jazz with it and the tone seems to fit in both styles of music really well.
I wonder about this. I have a Kydd, and people ALWAYS ask about it curiously when I play it. It definitely gets peoples' attention.
As bandleaders go, I suspect that there are a few who are not entirely convinced. That was part of the reason I bought a real upright. I then discovered that I was wrong about those bandleaders not being crazy about the EUB. In fact, they weren't crazy about my mediocre playing, on either instrument.
I will probably get rid of my EUB. When I travel, it's always to play electric, anyway (for now). I am not completely comfortable on the Kydd, either, so a different make may suit me better. The fingerboard is flat as a pancake, which is probably nice if you are an electric player who wants an easy transition to EUB.
As bandleaders go, I suspect that there are a few who are not entirely convinced. That was part of the reason I bought a real upright. I then discovered that I was wrong about those bandleaders not being crazy about the EUB. In fact, they weren't crazy about my mediocre playing, on either instrument.
I will probably get rid of my EUB. When I travel, it's always to play electric, anyway (for now). I am not completely comfortable on the Kydd, either, so a different make may suit me better. The fingerboard is flat as a pancake, which is probably nice if you are an electric player who wants an easy transition to EUB.
