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Help me decide...

kissmybASS01

kissmybASS01

Mar 7, 2008
645
667
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
#1
Hey all,

Help me decide between Epifani UL2-310 or Markbass Standard 104HF. It will be my companion to my Genz Benz 212 neo with a Peavey VB2 head. How will either of these mesh with the 212s and/or this head. I'm thinking that for my smaller gigs, I'll use one of these cabs, and then for our larger gigs, I'll be stacking one of these on top of my GB.

Any other suggestions?
 
#6
RickenBoogie said:
A good 212 like yours deserves another just like it. Think about it, 4 12's. Yummy. Mixing in 10's, may or may not create issues like phase cancellation, and 2 matching cabs is always a good idea.
Click to expand...

+2 on the preservation of tonal consistency & focus via well-chosen duplicate speaker configurations.

It's bad enough having to EQ in compensation for crummy room acoustics and noisy guitars without adding the futility of trying to knob-twist one's way through a sonic mis-match emanating from dissimilar bass cabs.
 
#9
Put it this way...there are some people who mix cabs and like it. Some of them are among the world's greatest bass players. So if you like the sound you're getting with a mixed cab rig, rock on. But audio science says that mixing driver and cab sizes to reproduce the same frequency range can cause phasing issues. Sometimes they're not much, sometimes they're totally obnoxious. But they're almost always there to some degree IMHO, and that's why I don't like to do it.
 
#10
kissmybASS01 said:
When I combined my 212 with my Marshall 410 on top, I didn't notice anything out of the norm, with the exception of having to poop standing in front of my wall of sound :hiding:

Is driver mis-match REALLY a very serious concern?
Click to expand...

No, its not a serious concern per se...

Plenty of electric bassists use mis-matched rigs and enjoy the resulting sound in spite of the minor degree of sonic smearing caused by a varying (depending upon the drivers & cabs which are being combined) combination of time alignment (smaller, lighter woofers reacting more quickly than larger, heavier ones) and dissimilar speakers whose combined frequency response characteristics reinforce some frequencies while canceling others (I believe this is called comb-filtering).

But, when matching speaker cabs (with matching drivers of course) are used, the drivers react at once in unison (no more time alignment problems--as long as the cabs are evenly positioned side-by-side or stacked) + they all have the same frequency response characteristics = a more 'focused' bass sound.

I discovered this for myself years ago after I abandoned, what was in hindsight, a bone-headed bi-amped rig attempt (Yamaha PB-1-->Yamaha P2200-->2 X Bose 802 for highs + an 18" in a big TL box) for an old SVT + an 8X10" cab.

In comparison to the hi-fi rig, the SVT/8X10" proved to be about as refined and subtle as a battering ram (even more so after I added a 2nd 8X10), but it was focused!

I've been a fan of same-sized speaker combinations (in bass amps anyway) ever since.

IMO/IME, if one cab type nails the tone one wants, then two cabs of the same type (backed with more wattage) will scale it up while preserving its character/focus.

DISCLAIMER: I am not an acoustician.
 
#11
MIJ-VI said:
No, its not a serious concern per se...

Plenty of electric bassists use mis-matched rigs and enjoy the resulting sound in spite of the minor degree of sonic smearing caused by a varying (depending upon the drivers & cabs which are being combined) combination of time alignment (smaller, lighter woofers reacting more quickly than larger, heavier ones) and dissimilar speakers whose combined frequency response characteristics reinforce some frequencies while canceling others (I believe this is called comb-filtering).
Click to expand...
Good reply. This what you're talking about here is called "phasing," though. Comb filtering is where you use speakers in more than one array that aren't spaced more than one wavelength apart for the lowest frequency they reproduce, and they end up bouncing into each other and creating null zones within the listening area. At least that's the "it's late and I'm in a hotel room and can't quite remember the exact explanation" version.
 
#12
JimmyM said:
Good reply. This what you're talking about here is called "phasing," though. Comb filtering is where you use speakers in more than one array that aren't spaced more than one wavelength apart for the lowest frequency they reproduce, and they end up bouncing into each other and creating null zones within the listening area.
Click to expand...

Now I know. Thanks. :)
 
#13
Yeah, that's the ticket. I have a rig in each catagory, though the mixed bag is a classic 115/210 combination, and never leaves the house. (big practice amp) When gigging, I'm using a single 215 99% of the time. Sometimes the phasing is barely, if at all, noticeable, like I'm sure it is with KissmyBass's 410/212 rig. Other times, it becomes quite the mess. Just knowing the game, will make putting a rig together much easier.
 
#14
Taken to school again!:( Here was my reasoning: For approx. 90% of the gigs/venues I play throughout the year, I would not need to take both cabs. I was just hoping to have a variety regarding a specific sound, and or portability.

In my limited experiences I have categorized speakers into three piles. 10s provide excellent mids and good punchy bass, while 15s provide that low rounded, full bottomed sound. I think 12s are the best of both worlds, and the versatility.

I know many manufacturers make/sell many varieties of 12s including GB like my cab and the 112 versions. My local shops don't carry these, and I would most likely have to shop MF and buy untried.:(
 

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