How do I get this tone?

[Murf]

Funny thing is I had to get a fretless for an upcoming session a few months ago and because I needed it in a hurry I had no choice put purchase the first fretless I came across (which is a pretty limited choice if you live in Ireland.."fretless?? what the feck dye want a fretless bass for?") needless to say I nearly went round the bend trying to get the mwah and the "farty jaco sound" (lol) until I bought a set of roundwounds (medium guage)...and lo and behold there it was.

I found with the roundwounds (Rotosound) if I play near the neck I get the "classic" Pino Palladino" sound and if I play near the bridge (with the bridge pickup full on) I get the "Jaco" sound...not bad considering the fretless itself cost about £300.

(Although apparently roundwonds are fairly hard on the neck of the instrument)

 

[XavierG]

My MIM fretted Jazz (which I used to achive 'mwao') is strung with light roundwounds, but my fretless has flatwonds on them. I also wonder if the 'sound' might not have to do with a combination of things - strings - amp - pickups. Which is why I am eager to get my fretless assembled again so that I can try it out on my daughters amp (I had tried on my bassman to no avail). My fretless is a P-bass, but I did add an American Deluxe Jazz bridge pickup, so, we shall see.

 

[Jeff Bonny]

Do you guys really think Caron or Pastorius' sound has that much to do with amps, instruments or setup?
NEWSFLASH: it's all in their hands and hours of practice is the only way to get there. Equipment may be part of the equation but y'all are going about things assbackward addressing that part first.

 

[XavierG]

Originally posted by jeffbonny
Do you guys really think Caron or Pastorius' sound has that much to do with amps, instruments or setup?
NEWSFLASH: it's all in their hands and hours of practice is the only way to get there. Equipment may be part of the equation but y'all are going about things assbackward addressing that part first.

That's a bit too simplistic there, jeffbonny. But, in response to your question, I, for one, do think it has a lot to do with their setup. But nowhere in my posts did I suggest that equipment was the entire equation. That's a little too obvious to me (that it isn't) . Furthermore, when I started out the thread, I couldn't seem to get that 'sound' I was referring to, and as I experimented with equipment, I finally did. Technique is a horse of a different color.

 

[gweimer]

Try rubbing some chicken fat on the strings!

 

[lump]

What Xavier said.

On my Carvin, which BP bag sez, "Nails that Jaco staccato tone with the bridge pickup soloed," I can, uh, nail that Jaco staccato tone with the bridge pickup soloed (for you non-readers, staccato is Italian for "farty" ) . And I'm no Jaco.

On my POS Washburn, which BP Mag sez has a "narrow range of usable tones," I can't get anything anywhere close (although I can nail that classic Gene Simmons tone ).

It ain't ALL gear/setup, but IMO it's a big part of the equation.

 

[Jeff Bonny]

Originally posted by XavierG


That's a bit too simplistic there, jeffbonny. But, in response to your question, I, for one, do think it has a lot to do with their setup. But nowhere in my posts did I suggest that equipment was the entire equation. That's a little too obvious to me (that it isn't) . Furthermore, when I started out the thread, I couldn't seem to get that 'sound' I was referring to, and as I experimented with equipment, I finally did. Technique is a horse of a different color.

As I read through the thread it seemed noone was saying anything about the touch involved in how a player sounds. Sorry I was abrasive but if I need to sound like another player I'm gonna try and play like him waaaaay before I bother to find out what his gear is. Just seemed to me the conversation was about the paint rather than what's under the hood if ya know what I mean?
But hey, if it works fer you it's not my place to knock it.
Just throwing out another perspective. No offence intended.
Well, not too much anyway...

 

[XavierG]

Sorry I was abrasive

I didn't think you were abrasive.

but if I need to sound like another player I'm gonna try and play like him waaaaay before I bother to find out what his gear is.

You misunderstood. I was trying to duplicate that particular 'mwah' sound, not their playing (although I would love to be as accomplished).

Just throwing out another perspective. No offence intended.
Well, not too much anyway...

None taken. Well, not too much anyway...

 

[XavierG]

Originally posted by Bruce Lindfield

I suppose what I'm saying is that after many years of searching I think it is down to the bass as well as the way you play and some basses I have tried or owned just would not get anywhere near this sound, while others were frustratingly close. I know people say that tone is in the hands, but I think the bass itself does have a big influence over the tone and also influences the way you play, which also has an effect on the tone you produce.

Bruce, I agree with your observations. The "in the hands" part of the equation is a question of technique. If you don't have the plucking technique "in the pocket", you'll go nowhere with this. It is apparent from reading your reply that you have that technique. I feel I have the "in the hands" part of it down pat. I too can come awfully close to that sound on many basses. After experimenting with my basses for a week, I seem to have arrived at the conclusion that, equipment- wise, one of the more crucial factors is strings. Invariably, the basses I have managed to coax that elusive sound from have all been strung with roundwounds (comments?). The lighter gauges don't replicate that sound as well as the heavier gauges. It appears that the slight finger slide (just sharp or flat of a note) produces a "zipping" sound which, when combined with a slight vibrato, and proper plucking technique, produces the correct "mwah". My fretless was strung with flatwounds, so I couldn't get the "zipping" sound. When I strung my MIM Jazz (fretted) with the same flatwounds, I lost the ability to produce that sound.

X

 

[Steve Cat]

That probably explains why I got at least a partially successful mwah sound (alittle plasticky sounding but at least it mwahs)when I went from flats to black nylon tapewounds. There was a little of that zip sound. I want that sound real bad. So I suppose I'll have to try roundwounds on my MIM frettless. For experiemntal purposes do you think it matters about the quality of the strings, or can I go cheap, just to test it.

 

[XavierG]

Originally posted by Steve Cat
So I suppose I'll have to try roundwounds on my MIM frettless. For experiemntal purposes do you think it matters about the quality of the strings, or can I go cheap, just to test it.

SteveCat...
I'd say (as long as you've got the "in the hands" part right) it isn't going to matter that the strings are cheap. Go for it and let us know. But, don't forget, if you go the roundwound route, get some fingerboard protection. Always wear protection!