For your situation, I believe whoever told you that was right. If you ever plan to do anything larger than what you outlined, I'd say start at 600 and go up.
As for your question, just heed my advice and you'll be fine.
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How much amp is enough for different size shows?
- Thread starter skipster619
- Start date
For your situation, I believe whoever told you that was right. If you ever plan to do anything larger than what you outlined, I'd say start at 600 and go up.
As for your question, just heed my advice and you'll be fine.
Munji, he was fairly specific in his needs as blues and jazz for smaller venues. When I saw that you had answered on this thread I expected that you were going to recommend SWR Workingman 12, as I thought that would be what you would use in the same situation.
He's asking $450, plus shipping. It's the combo with 2x10 and a matching 1x15 cab. It seems a nice set up, and he's a great guy to chat with about amps!
This is true, but it is better to have and not need than to need and not have. IMHO 300wtts is a good amount to work with, you get a good clean sound at low volume, and have the added watts if you want to do something more. If you get less than 300 wtt, you have to spend more money to get more watts. A lot of places don't have a good PA to run your sound through. Oh yeah somewhere down the road he may want to do more than just Jazz, and Blues. I play in three different bands, and they play anything from Blues, R&B, Classic Rock, funk/Rock, and Jazz anything less than 300 wtts would not get me by. Just my .02
I have "settled" on a Genz Benz Neo-Pak 3.5 and a Genz Benz Neo 212T cab. You can always not use all your power, but you can't use what isn't there.
I tried using combo's and other weight and size saving rigs, but they were always missing something. I play bass, I need to haul some gear.
I tried using combo's and other weight and size saving rigs, but they were always missing something. I play bass, I need to haul some gear.
Well, he mentioned that he may sub in some mid-sized rooms. While I like my WM-12, I would never gig anywhere with it ... it's just not loud enough, not even for practice with the band. If I were going to do his gigs, I'd go with my WT-300 and D-210XLT. Perfect.
There is really only one consideration for determining how loud you need your bass amp to be; how loud is the rest of your band on stage? You need to be able to be clearly heard at a comparable level to your band mates with your amp in its comfort zone (not straining or distorting) and this is usually determined by drummer stage level. Everything else such as guitar level, bass level, vocals level, keys/horns/other level is matched to that.
To get that final combined stage level out to the audience at louder volume (just how loud depends on how big the venue) microphones and line outs from stage are fed into a FOH (front of house) system independently of stage levels.
I know of several bands who get along perfectly well doing shows with a drummer and two guitars each with 50 watt or less amps and a bass player with a 100 to 150 w solid state amp.
To get that final combined stage level out to the audience at louder volume (just how loud depends on how big the venue) microphones and line outs from stage are fed into a FOH (front of house) system independently of stage levels.
I know of several bands who get along perfectly well doing shows with a drummer and two guitars each with 50 watt or less amps and a bass player with a 100 to 150 w solid state amp.
I used a 200W Nemesis 4x10 for several years in similar venues and it did okay up to moderately loud volumes. That said, I would get as much as you can afford - better too much than not enough. And who knows where your current gig might lead. If you get into anything louder, your rig simply won't cut it at all. And though at times, yes you will go through a PA and be fine I cannot tell you how many times I've played through just my rig on stage.
I now play a 400W head through two 12s and wish I had more...
I now play a 400W head through two 12s and wish I had more...
butchblack
Life is short. Do good. Find and do what you love.
Hi
I play blues in small to medium sized clubs and use a GK backline 600 with a single Avatar SB112 neo cab and it's plenty for what I do. As I bought an 8 ohm cab I have the option of adding a second cab if I need. I'd recommend the backline 600 with either the Avatar 112 or 212 neo cab. New the head goes for $299 and the cabs are $259 (112) and $299 (212) (spring the extra bucks for the Line-X coating, it's great) The GK head may be available used. Either set up should fit in a 4 door sedan, the 212 might be tight if you have small doors and trunk but should be doable. I used to get a 410 cab in the back seat of my Escort. So for about the same money as a combo you'll have a more flexible rig. If you do go combo I'd say 200W would be minimum to give you enough headroom and the ability to play a medium sized hall.
I play blues in small to medium sized clubs and use a GK backline 600 with a single Avatar SB112 neo cab and it's plenty for what I do. As I bought an 8 ohm cab I have the option of adding a second cab if I need. I'd recommend the backline 600 with either the Avatar 112 or 212 neo cab. New the head goes for $299 and the cabs are $259 (112) and $299 (212) (spring the extra bucks for the Line-X coating, it's great) The GK head may be available used. Either set up should fit in a 4 door sedan, the 212 might be tight if you have small doors and trunk but should be doable. I used to get a 410 cab in the back seat of my Escort. So for about the same money as a combo you'll have a more flexible rig. If you do go combo I'd say 200W would be minimum to give you enough headroom and the ability to play a medium sized hall.
I personally think that the solid advice here is, if your budget will allow, go for as much power as you can (say 450 watts), not that you will necessarily NEED it, but again, if you don't have it, you can't call on it...
As the old saying goes - I'd rather have it and not need it, rather than need it and not have it....
Just a thought!
As the old saying goes - I'd rather have it and not need it, rather than need it and not have it....
Just a thought!
Some cheaper amps around 300 watts:
GK Backline 600 is 300W@4ohm and 180W@8ohm
Ashdown Mag 300 is 307W@4ohm not sure at 8 ohm
http://www.ashdownmusic.com/bass/detail.asp?ID=112
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Some nice smaller sized but more power amps:
Mark Bass LMII is 480W@4ohm and 320W@8ohm
Invalid Link Removed
Eden WT-400 is 400W@4ohm and 235W@8ohm
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
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Some very popular more power amps:
Ampeg SVT 3 Pro is 450W@4ohm and 275W@8ohm
GK 700RB II is 480W@4ohm and 320W@8ohm
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If you search for those amps you will find more amps talked about and what they are used for talked about.
GK Backline 600 is 300W@4ohm and 180W@8ohm
Ashdown Mag 300 is 307W@4ohm not sure at 8 ohm
http://www.ashdownmusic.com/bass/detail.asp?ID=112
-------------------------------------------------------
Some nice smaller sized but more power amps:
Mark Bass LMII is 480W@4ohm and 320W@8ohm
Invalid Link Removed
Eden WT-400 is 400W@4ohm and 235W@8ohm
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
-------------------------------------------------------
Some very popular more power amps:
Ampeg SVT 3 Pro is 450W@4ohm and 275W@8ohm
GK 700RB II is 480W@4ohm and 320W@8ohm
-------------------------------------------------------
If you search for those amps you will find more amps talked about and what they are used for talked about.
So. Would the answer to the original question be that in smaller venues playing fairly quiet blues and jazz with a medium hitting drummer a simple combo amp up to 180 watts would do, and for blues and jazz with a medium hitting drummer in a medium club 200 to 300 watts would be needed, and for a louder drummer and louder music 300 to 400 watts or more would be necessary, and for rock in an outdoor venue without a pa one would need more than 600 watts?
But then many people here believe that having more watts is a good idea.
A woman walks up to a man wearing a pistol in a holster and askes him, "Isn't that dangerous?" And he answers, "Yes ma'am that's the idea." And then she asks, "Are you expecting a gun fight?" And he answers "No ma'am, if I was I would have brought a rifle."
But then many people here believe that having more watts is a good idea.
A woman walks up to a man wearing a pistol in a holster and askes him, "Isn't that dangerous?" And he answers, "Yes ma'am that's the idea." And then she asks, "Are you expecting a gun fight?" And he answers "No ma'am, if I was I would have brought a rifle."
I can only answer your question this way...I recently "downsized from a SVT5Pro (1500 watts) to a smaller (and lighter) SVT3Pro. I also got rid of a monster PR8X10 cab in favor of a "smaller" (though not by much) 6X10HLF.
Now, I can still play most any venue with the smaller rig and have power to spare. It doesn't mean that I have to turn it up all the way, by any means, but if necessary I can turn it to be heard....but that rarely ever happens, because most of the "larger" venues have house systems that I can line into....
Remember that Blues ,or at least how I have approached it for the last 25 years,calls for a ton of bottom.
You need power and alot of air movement to get gobs of bottom.
You need power and alot of air movement to get gobs of bottom.
====================
So from all of the great advice and thoughts I've read here (especially TimBass, GREAT comments man!), would the GK combo amp and matching extension cab or a similar setup be the general recommendation of you fine folks?? (It's for sale in the classifieds here on TB) And, since I'm just a working stiff, would something around $400 for the setup be a fair price?
I asked a related question last week. I'm new to this game, but thank you to those who piped in that more power and headroom are always welcome, but anemic tone and projection can kill the gig. I've been cranking my amp and plucking much lighter and more dynamically with what many would consider much more juice than I need (700 watts, 210/115), but I can say that my last rig (and Eden 112 xlt combo with 230 watts) was straining mightily to get over a moderately loud rock drummer at ptactice (no PA). I'd get the best/most powerful head you can, and start with a single cab-you can always build on this. Thinking scalability now will save you later.
alexclaber
Commercial User
=======================
Ok, my friends, I've been reading and learning like crazy here, and I think timbass's excellent summation above about covers the general idea of your thoughts. So I've been trying to choose between a head/cab set and a combo. One of the advantages I see to a combo is that as pretty much a rookie at this I'm worried that if I go amp and head I'll screw up choosing my components and waste a lot of money. So, as part of that selection process I've been scouring the local ads and craigslist. IF I go with a combo, do any of these stand out as fitting the discussions you've been sharing?
2 yr old Peavey BAM 210, good condition, $450.
1 yr old Peavey Combo115, like new, $400
2 yr old SWR Workingman 2x10, like new, asking $500
6 yr old Peavey combo300, good shape, $250
3 yr old Yorkville XM200t, like new, $300
I know, I need to decide if a combo or a head/cab will serve me best...still stuck on that one. But as timbass said, I'm reading and absorbing and trying to figure it out!
One of my concerns is respecting my fellow jammers...it occured to me that when I make jam nights, is it possible I'll upset anyone if I stroll in with a rig 3 times bigger then anyone else? That wouldn't be cool.....
Folks, I don't know the right words, so I 'll just go with THANKS VERY MUCH for all you're sharing and teaching me!!!
Skip
I still like the GK rig you were looking at . That would give you the combo for small gigs and add the ext. cab for larger places. As I said before, G-K power ratings are very conservative so it will sound louder than many other higher powered amps.
