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Double Bass IEM Question

FretlessOwl

FretlessOwl

Apr 9, 2021
162
297
#1
I have a mild dilemma: when I play upright gigs, sometimes I have a hard time hearing myself (even amplified) among the noise of the other musicians. I came up with the brilliant idea of using a personal IEM system, so I did research and got a Behringer P2. I've now tried it on 2 gigs, one running direct from bass to P2 via ¼-inch and the other from bass to Zoom B3, then out of output 2 to P2. In both cases (and also electric at home with all volume 100%), it's simply not even close to being loud enough. If this is enough info, am I doing something wrong? Is XLR a whole different experience?
 
#2
Maybe your headphones are not the right ones for the job. IEM headphones for bass have bass-specific drivers, and seal the ears so the bass frequencies do not leak. What kind are you using?

If you plug the bass into the Zoom input, and connect your headphones directly to the Phones Out, does it sound loud enough?
 
#3
didgeribass said:
Maybe your headphones are not the right ones for the job. IEM headphones for bass have bass-specific drivers, and seal the ears so the bass frequencies do not leak. What kind are you using?

If you plug the bass into the Zoom input, and connect your headphones directly to the Phones Out, does it sound loud enough?
Click to expand...
I'm using MEE Audio M6 Pros, mainly because Adam Neely recommended them, and they've been perfect for every other application.
The B3 doesn't really have anything labeled as Phones Out, but I do have the signal running through one of the outputs. My research leads me to the conclusion that I'm trying to do something that apparently no one else does, so I'm probably wrong somehow. Other IEM amps only have XLR outs, so maybe that has something to do with it?
 
#4
The B3 does have a headphone output. Look on the back at the L/Mono output. Below it, it is labeled Phones. Plug your IEMs into that and try it.

Have you confirmed the P2 is functioning properly? In other words, used a known good source.

IMG_3423.jpeg
 
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#5
JKos said:
The B3 does have a headphone output. Look on the back at the L/Mono output. Below it, it is labeled Phones. Plug your IEMs into that and try it.

Have you confirmed the P2 is functioning properly? In other words, used a known good source.

View attachment 5290635
Click to expand...
Duh, I was looking from above and couldn't see the phones out behind the cable. So I just tried and that's equally quiet. I guess I can't be certain the P2 is functioning properly, but it seems to be. I seriously think I'm just asking too much, because as options to be used as headphone amps, both the P2 and B3 are fine in quiet rooms but not for loudish orchestra pits. I was thinking I should at least have the option of too much volume, but at full volume things are just audible.
 
#6
Then maybe you’re just not boosting the level enough in the B3. Turn up any input and output levels. Maybe add a clean boost in the B3 (perhaps D.I Plus, BB Bass, DI5, etc.). Check the global master level.

What type of pickup do you have on your bass? Are you using an appropriate preamp?
 
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#8
FretlessOwl said:
And I thought the Zoom WAS the preamp......?
Click to expand...
Piezo pickups typically have an output level lower than magnetic pickups. And typically benefit from an input impedance higher than the typical 1 MΩ of devices such as the B3.

If you hearing similar (low) levels from both your electric and upright, then perhaps disregard the above.

Do you have the Active/Passive switch in the Passive position?
 
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#9
You are not doing anything super-extraordinary - Zoom B3 should work with headphones just fine without any additional equipment.

When you connect your headphones to the Zoom (via L/Phones out),
  • Are you using a headphone 1/4'' to 1/8'' stereo adapter?
  • Are you connecting anything (e.g. an amp) to the R/out at the same time? If yes, you might be disabling the headphones out (Zoom now outputs a stereo line signal). Try if the headphones work better without connecting anything to the R/out.
  • Connect the bass to the Zoom Input, and use an XLR cable from the XLR-Out to connect to P2 (and set the P2 switch to "mono"). In this scenario, you should be able to connect the L/Phones to your amp at the same time.
Hope this helps!
 
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#10
Here's one of the main things I tried, because this is how I'd like to do it regularly: upright bass in to Zoom, L out to Rumble 100, R out to IEM, XLR out to FOH. This worked, it just wasn't loud enough in my ears even at max volume. This is definitely starting to sound like more of a me problem than anything else! Btw, thanks to both you and JKos for the help.
 
#11
I think the headphone out is designed for silent practicing with effects (using a BG or EUB).
Too loud and your ears get damaged.

With highly isolated earplugs and a mix in your IEMs, a lower volume level might be enough and doesn‘t risk a hearing damage.

If the stage sound is too loud, others need to reduce volume. If you try to compete with them you will damage your hearing. With or without IEMs.
 
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#12
I would say trying to do this at any stage volume is definitely putting your hearing at risk. You don't want to try and have your self solo in your IEM monitors while listening to the rest of the band acoustically.

I love the times when I could use IEM monitors but I was getting a feed from the FOH board. It was a mix with everyone in it. It was super expensive for whoever was paying for it & I would not do this with an engineer I didn't know and trust.

This sounds like I am making this up but I really know what I sound like even if I can't hear myself acoustically on stage.
 
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#14
JKos said:
Do your IEMs have sufficient/expected level from other devices? Like your phone. How about the headphones out of the Rumble 100?
Click to expand...
Yes. I use shure 535 earbuds. They are actually a little too sensitive to gain. They cut out most outside ambient sound. I love them and have had then for maybe ten plus years at this point. I have't used a Rumble 100 but like others have said, that is a headphone out for silent practice and not really what you want to use on stage.

I have a feeling you may want to focus on getting a good acoustic sound, then a good sound with a traditional amp and then maybe think about as a band whether or not to invest in an in ear monitor set-up.
 
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#16
I use IEMs for the same reason as the OP, but use a Rolls PM59 to make my own local monitor mix of my vocal mic, line (monitor feed) and instrument. I send the output to my Behringer PM2 to have access to volume on my belt and have 3 types of in-ears, each with different tone outputs, depending on the room. I play electric and EUB, and send both to a Radial Tonebone V2 2-channel that lets me balance the two bass send levels. This has been working for me for a few years, now. Hope this helps.
 
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#18
crd said:
I would say trying to do this at any stage volume is definitely putting your hearing at risk. You don't want to try and have your self solo in your IEM monitors while listening to the rest of the band acoustically.

I love the times when I could use IEM monitors but I was getting a feed from the FOH board. It was a mix with everyone in it. It was super expensive for whoever was paying for it & I would not do this with an engineer I didn't know and trust.

This sounds like I am making this up but I really know what I sound like even if I can't hear myself acoustically on stage.
Click to expand...
Your first paragraph nails it, because that's EXACTLY what I'm trying to do. It seemed logical to simply try to be self-contained and make ME louder to ME. My logic has failed!
 

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