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Double Bass Intonation....still

M

menoluv

Jun 24, 2009
33
0
#1
Hey guys,

I've been playing the double bass for about 9 years now, of which the latest 2 years I'll consider my serious ones, years I'm truly into bass.

For 7 years, I've started out as a school player and I'm not introduced on intonation and whatsoever. It is in the later two years that I've started learning about these.

Until now, I've realised my intonation has not greatly improved, or what my teacher would say: "You do not have a firm stand in your intonation." My intonation has its 'ups and downs' - sometimes their on the dot, while others get out of their place.

I do feel guilty about my intonation problems and would like to take chances to improve my intonation.

I've been trying to do so with the use of a tuner. And it seems that the notes are somewhat a quarter tone away from the more accurate sound. For eg, if I try to play a C on the G string
I would often get a 'just into' the range of C, or I would get a "just into" range of B note displayed on the tuner.

So I would like to ask fellow bassists,
Is there any method to cut away this problem of my intonation? Or are there ways of improving my intonation?

:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(
 
#2
Probably, what may help or just a siggestion when you play

play with a metronome very slowing at first so your ear can listen very strictly to you intonation and also work with a electronic tuner that can if you have one and can get one.

Also what every method you use, I use the simandle and it very appropiatly is designed so you can listen to your intonation.
Kirk
 
#3
playing along with drones can help. Also being very picky with yourself. when you make a shift, listen to the note, and ask yourself if it is in tune. if it's not, or you look at your tuner and you see it's not (which, spend time doing this with and without the tuner to help your ear), then return to your previous note, ensure it's in tune, attempt the shift again.

another hint is to sing the note you're going to be playing next along with the preceding note, then make the shift.

hope these help,

Eerbrev
 
#7
Scales and arpeggios every day, in all positions. Give yourself enough time and go slow enough so you know that every note in the scale is spot on. Tuners aren't always that great, and are easily off. It's better to tune with your ear and learn the note that way.

And arco practice. I practice EVERYTHING arco, even all of my pizz pieces.
 
#8
besides playing along with drones may I add playing along with practice/play along cd's or piano accompaniments will improve your intonation.
I hardly ever use a tuner to check my intonation instead I use drones or open strings to check if I am in tune or not. And of course my ears.
 
#9
A few things help me.

The first is to play to a drone to sharpen your ear. Tuners may be helpful if you plan only to play with piano but I find working on just intonation is more helpful than the equal temperament that tuners are calibrated to.

Second thing, know where your other fingers lie so that you can shrink the finger board. For example if my pinky is on the d on the g string then I know that my middle finger is on c# and my first finger is on c. That way when I need to shift back I know where I'm going. The same for going forward. If I need to make a shift from that d to an e then I know that my 1st finger is going to replace my pinky and then the middle will be on eb and my pinky is on E. So I think in terms of the intervallic distance from where my hand lies at the moment and this makes shifts less daunting. This is basic Simandl methodology. It works well for me anyway.

Third work on shifts! Slowly, glissing first then progressively speeding up and removing the gliss. This way you train your hand to stop at the end of the shift rather than guessing.

Learn all your harmonics and devise an exercise that floats you around them. You're never farther than a perfect fourth away from a harmonic. (D to G or A to D or... in thumb position)

Use Galamian practice rhythms when practicing passages and scales that are difficult to get in tune. That way you can practice each part of the passage slowly and at speed but broken down.

Of course scale and arpeggio practice against a drone is essential. When doing that, slowly and purposefully go sharp and bring it back into tune then go flat and bring it back into tune.

There are other things I use and have used. In the end slow practice and ear training are the keys to intonation I think.

Intonation is a life long practice. No one plays perfectly in tune 100% of the time. The difference between pros and non pros is the ability to hear and adjust incorrect intonation. Good luck and enjoy the ride.
 
#12
My latest intonation "thing" for the past couple years: Whenever I am playing out of tune, I analyze exactly what's going wrong with my technique. What I figure is that consistent technique will lead to consistent intonation -- hopefully both will improve together. Also, developing my technique has led to less fatigue on the bandstand, which I know to affect my intonation.
 
#14
I went through an nebulous intonation period as well. I can only tell you what I did/do so this may help you or it may not.

I sang in a good church choir and a university choir for about 3 years to improve my intonation. I sing tenor so we often got to be the third or the fifth of the chord at the cadences. It provided a real tactile feeling of the various intervals and I could feel inside when I was out of tune.

My intonation improved significantly because of this.

I also use a tuner to get my strings perfectly in tune then there is no one to blame for intonation except me. I found pizzing the notes creates less overtones so the tuner can focus in on the fundamental better. I found trying to play arco closed notes with a tuner frustrating as it would pick up the high harmonics (which are mathematically out of tune).

I also got a keyboard. I explored it until I found a patch that was a pure sound with no vibrato or chorus effect (an chapel organ sound). I used a stick of wood or a piece of tape to hold down a note to create a drone. Sometimes this drone would be a low note at the bottom of whatever scale I working on. Sometimes it was higher note to imitate playing with a melodic instrument. I turn it up pretty loud so I can really dig in and feel the way the intervals create the beat tones.

With the keyboard I could also record passages and play along with them. There is also a built in metronome which comes in handy as well.

Hope this helps.
 
#15
I was glad to read this thread and its posts. I always thought I had a really good ear- I'm a piano tuner - but recently rehearsed for a recital with an accompanist for the first time in many years and was surprised how difficult it was to match my pitch with the unforgiving piano.
 
#16
So, one thing that helped me a lot, working on thumb position intonation particularly, was a STROBE tuner. Reason being, it responds so fast you can play a lot of music at speed and still see the tuner register, and you can read the display out of the corner of your eye without looking at it, so you can read the tuner and the music both at once. I use the Petersen app on my iPhone, but I'm sure their hardware units would work as well. An iPod Touch plus the app is still cheaper than their hardware units though.
 
#17
Try singing the music. Put the bass away and sing your part away from your instrument. If you can sing it, you can play it. Try to avoid using a piano to check your pitch because they are tempered and if not tuned regularly they are not always accurate. It sounds silly, but singing has really helped my intonation and all around musicianship.
 
#18
clclark said:
If you can sing it, you can play it.
Click to expand...

although singing is great and hearing the melody you want to play in your head is a must. It is not necessarily true that when you can sing it you can also play it.
There can also be a technical problems or limitations resulting in a bad intonation. Hearing the melody is the way to solve this though.
So it is a combination of hearing it and a good hand position.
 
#19
+1 on alot of the advice already given in particular from korciancowboy. There is no quick fix to weak intonation. Sometimes it is good to take a step backwards. All Scales and arpeggios very slow with the bow listening critically and never accepting an 'out of tune ' note. Two octave scales on each string. Vomit exercises. Always refer to open strings or harmonics where possible. Scales in thirds and fourths . Again slow slow slow. If you practice it will come... Slow slow slow
 
#20
Some daily double stops, in all registers, on all two-string combinations.

Shifting and stationary double stops, shifting at least up to a P4th. Holding my left hand in thirds (m and M) as well as P5ths help.

Singing what I am playing also helps, so that my voice directs my movement when I shift.

None of this is original; I was told to do it by my teacher. It works, so I continue to do it...
 

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