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Jensen Mod 12-110 for bass
- Thread starter MikeSayre
- Start date
Jensen emphasizes that this is a mid-forward speaker, and I don't see it recommended for bass.
With a stated xmax of only 1mm, I wouldn't dare use that speaker for bass. Use them for guitar as originally intended.
Mod 12-110 | Jensen Loudspeakers (jensentone.com)
With a stated xmax of only 1mm, I wouldn't dare use that speaker for bass. Use them for guitar as originally intended.
Mod 12-110 | Jensen Loudspeakers (jensentone.com)
Jensen doesn't list it as a recommended bass speaker. Big clue.
Bass Speakers | Jensen Loudspeakers (jensentone.com)
Obviously you haven’t bothered to look at the Thiele-Small parameters.
But yeah, you could drop a moped engine into a dump truck.
oh it will make noise, right up to when it doesn't... honestly, mod 12's weren't very good for guitar either. I put one in a Fender Delix Reverb in a pinch. Was very happy to remove it when my Wber rolled in...
It really depends on how you use it. My tube Marshall is going strong, but I play at low volumes in a practice setting or when accompanying acoustic. In these situations the Marshall combo works beautifully.
I have a Mod 10 in a jukebox I built. It’s a decent speaker, from what I can tell in that specific situation.
Obviously you’ve never played bass through a guitar amp (ten years of experience through a guitar speaker). Or know much about music history.
Not everything is absolute.
True, I've never played bass through a guitar amp, because I'm playing bass. I believe in using the right tool for the job. I have been known to successfully improvize solutions ("MacGyver") when necessary.
The OP asked a specific question about a specific speaker for a specific application and there are specific reasons for my specific answer as to why it is specifically inadvisable.
I don't see how my knowledge of music history has any relevance, but I'm not interested in a pissing match.
Put next to a Webber A series or a Celection G or one of the classic Jensen P series. the Mod is lackluster at best. and if you take it to volume on bass it will die early.
Playing bass through a guitar amp is a recording studio thing for the most part. Generally combined with a DI line so you can capture some actual low end. Or in a TicTac setting where it is layered on top of an actual bass line.
Glad that your Marshall works for you. It wouldn't for me. I agreee there is a sound there, I prefer something with more low end in it. Acoustic settings I usually take a K12 and an acoustic bass.
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Then don’t start one by being rude...especially when you have zero experience in a real world situation on the matter or know the history of the guitar amp in relation to the bass guitar.
End of discussion.
Carol Kaye inspired me to attempt to use the guitar tube combo. Glad I did. Again, at low volumes, it’s a hell of a tone, especially for Tic-Tac. I have an Ampeg PF-50 w/PF115 for anything I need volume for.
As for the Jensens, they aren’t worth much. OP seems interested in knowing if they’d work for bass. They will. Would I recommend the Jensen Mod...no, but it’ll work. No doubt there are better options out there, but sounds like the OP is already invested in the Jensens...unless he wants to go through with selling them. I get the feeling he simply wants to know, if only out of sheer curiosity, will they function to the extent of being usable.
@AboutSweetSue Yep. I used to use a Princeton Reverb on a stool out in the middle of a recording room. Engineer put a 57 on it. This was recording a folk rock project I worked on. Princeton is long gone but there is a BF Deluxe to replace it.
This is sort of inspiring me to try my AC-15 and see what that sounds like with bass. It's way cool with Baritone guitar.
This is sort of inspiring me to try my AC-15 and see what that sounds like with bass. It's way cool with Baritone guitar.
I played through a Peavey Vintage for a vast majority of my experience with bass through a guitar amp. What I’m using now is the Marshall Origin 50w. One of the reasons why I bought it was to play a Bass VI through. Damned root canals and crowns put a hold on that pairing.
I did see the Princeton Reverb through my search for a good tube combo (new ones are $1100.00...more than I wanted to risk on my uncertain endeavor). The whole search led me down a rabbit hole where I realized that guitar amps are/were the chosen amp by quite a few more bassists than you’d expect. Given how good the Marshall sounds at low volumes, I’m not surprised. Mic’d is pure gold. Anyway, I recommend you give it a go. Worst case scenario is it doesn’t work out and you move on...or your amp and driver implode.
Hey guys! Older thread but I’ve got some experience with the Jensen Mod series and bass. Specifically the 10-35 and 12-35. I’ve played bass through them at low volume in open back guitar amps. They sound surprisingly good for bass! While not “recommended” by Jensen for bass, Jensen does include a Bassists Description for almost all the Mod speakers, excluding the tiny 5” and 6” speakers. A couple years ago Jensen did have a Bassists Description for the Vintage Ceramic series and I believe the Alnico series too, but they took it down. Maybe too many people scoffed at the idea of using the guitar speakers for bass. And maybe some bassists blew them up! It’s certainly possible if you go crazy, lol. But I’ve been playing bass through guitar cabs for over 25 years and haven’t hurt a speaker yet.
I’m a big fan of JBLs and E-120s make awesome bass drivers! So do D-130s. Of course, a Jensen Mod 12-35 is not a JBL, and as is true for ANY speaker, you have to keep them within their physical and thermal limits. I play classic rock with 4-string basses in standard tuning at moderate volumes. If I were playing a 5-string at high volume I’d probably use a more bass specific cabinet.
It really just depends on what kind of music you’re playing and how loud your playing. And one thing that makes a big difference is how much actual “bass” you’re dialing in on your tone controls. A lot of really fat and punchy bass recordings have a lot less “bass” than people think, often not much below 60hz. That might seem surprising, but it’s true! There’s actually a lot of mid-range harmonics going on and that’s where guitar speakers can really shine, often providing a rich tone character that many bass specific speakers don’t do so well. So there’s certainly a place for guitar speakers in a bass players arsenal. Looking back on classic bass recordings from the mid-60s through the mid-70s, lots of guys were using low powered Ampeg B-12 and B-15 tube amps, which are considered legendary for their bass tone and are highly sought after. The speakers were often the same Jensens used in guitar amps. But boy they sure sounded sweet!
Don’t be afraid of the 1-2mm Xmax limit on the Jensen Mod series, or any speaker for that matter. Xmax is just how far the speaker can move and still be linear. Xlim is the mechanical limit of a driver and, while not listed by Jensen, is probably 3-4mm in both directions, depending on the speaker. By the time the tight suspension of a guitar speaker is moving that far it probably won’t sound very good anyway, so pay attention and back off your volume or bass tone if it starts sounding “floppy”.
Don’t get me wrong, playing bass through guitar speakers has its limits. You simply can’t slam out super low, super loud, Korn style bass lines through them. But having actually owned and played through the Mod 10-35 and the 12-35 I can attest that they do make very nice bass speakers! They SOUND good. They are punchy and have a nice, present mid-range that’s pleasant to listen to. They won’t rattle your teeth, but I’m of the opinion that hearing a bass guitar should be priority over feeling the bass. I’ve been to plenty of concerts and shows we’re I could definitely feel the bass but could not HEAR it. (Anyone else experience that?) Get a good sound first, with whatever speakers suit your style. You can always add more power and speakers later.
I’m a big fan of JBLs and E-120s make awesome bass drivers! So do D-130s. Of course, a Jensen Mod 12-35 is not a JBL, and as is true for ANY speaker, you have to keep them within their physical and thermal limits. I play classic rock with 4-string basses in standard tuning at moderate volumes. If I were playing a 5-string at high volume I’d probably use a more bass specific cabinet.
It really just depends on what kind of music you’re playing and how loud your playing. And one thing that makes a big difference is how much actual “bass” you’re dialing in on your tone controls. A lot of really fat and punchy bass recordings have a lot less “bass” than people think, often not much below 60hz. That might seem surprising, but it’s true! There’s actually a lot of mid-range harmonics going on and that’s where guitar speakers can really shine, often providing a rich tone character that many bass specific speakers don’t do so well. So there’s certainly a place for guitar speakers in a bass players arsenal. Looking back on classic bass recordings from the mid-60s through the mid-70s, lots of guys were using low powered Ampeg B-12 and B-15 tube amps, which are considered legendary for their bass tone and are highly sought after. The speakers were often the same Jensens used in guitar amps. But boy they sure sounded sweet!
Don’t be afraid of the 1-2mm Xmax limit on the Jensen Mod series, or any speaker for that matter. Xmax is just how far the speaker can move and still be linear. Xlim is the mechanical limit of a driver and, while not listed by Jensen, is probably 3-4mm in both directions, depending on the speaker. By the time the tight suspension of a guitar speaker is moving that far it probably won’t sound very good anyway, so pay attention and back off your volume or bass tone if it starts sounding “floppy”.
Don’t get me wrong, playing bass through guitar speakers has its limits. You simply can’t slam out super low, super loud, Korn style bass lines through them. But having actually owned and played through the Mod 10-35 and the 12-35 I can attest that they do make very nice bass speakers! They SOUND good. They are punchy and have a nice, present mid-range that’s pleasant to listen to. They won’t rattle your teeth, but I’m of the opinion that hearing a bass guitar should be priority over feeling the bass. I’ve been to plenty of concerts and shows we’re I could definitely feel the bass but could not HEAR it. (Anyone else experience that?) Get a good sound first, with whatever speakers suit your style. You can always add more power and speakers later.
While there was research on speakers and enclosures well back into the early 20th century. Things didn't fully gel into the T/S parameters in use today until the early 80's.
So it seems a lot of us here (except for #2 in my case) might have come up in one or more of several possible camps. And maybe there was a bit of this in earlier days from cab builders too regarding T/S parameter use?
1) Didn't know.
2) Didn't care.
3) The math's too hard.
4) Throw a speaker in a box and see what happens.
5) Plug into the other channel on your guitarist's amp, cause you haven't bought you own bass amp yet.
6) Start with volume at minimum and increase slowly, vs the other way around.
Seems pointless for folks to get bent out of shape over this whole discussion.
It was what it was back in the day.
It is what it is now.
And likely will be Que Sera, Sera going forward.
Maybe another option is needed?
7) Chill, just play a little, re-evaluate later.
So it seems a lot of us here (except for #2 in my case) might have come up in one or more of several possible camps. And maybe there was a bit of this in earlier days from cab builders too regarding T/S parameter use?
1) Didn't know.
2) Didn't care.
3) The math's too hard.
4) Throw a speaker in a box and see what happens.
5) Plug into the other channel on your guitarist's amp, cause you haven't bought you own bass amp yet.
6) Start with volume at minimum and increase slowly, vs the other way around.
Seems pointless for folks to get bent out of shape over this whole discussion.
It was what it was back in the day.
It is what it is now.
And likely will be Que Sera, Sera going forward.
Maybe another option is needed?
7) Chill, just play a little, re-evaluate later.
I have a lot of experience playing bass through guitar amps and cabs. The first was a blackface Fender Twin Reverb Loaded with JBL 120s.
If you don't know, the E120 is rated for 150W RMS so a pair is 300W RMS. The Twin is considered an 85W amp. I could run the amp to close to it's clean limit as long as I kept the bass control at 4 or lower. I actually gigged in a cover band with this setup. I could hear because I elevated the cab and tilted it to aim at my ears...but I would not say it carried the band. We mic'ed one of the JBLs and ran it through the PA.
Keep in mind the JBLs E120s are more robust than most guitar drivers. While I was able to gig with them, I don't consider them an ideal choice in this application.
Would I recommend a guitar amp for a bassist. Yes, but with a very firm warning: Keep the power level with the limits the cab. IMHO a lot of people will not be able to do this.
As a low volume practice amp or recording amp, most guitar cabs will be fine with bass...and can even sound great.
Another thing to consider. Back in the 60s, bassist frequently used cabs that were essentially running guitar speakers. I think it was fairly common for them to blow drivers though. In my experience a 100W tube head can push a 412 full stack rated for 600W beyond the drivers excursion limit if you crank up the lows. So some degree of caution and restraint is still required even when the cab is rated for six times the amps power rating. To be fair a 412 full stack will be pretty darn loud, but it won't have deep extended lows.
A few years back, swapping a pair of Jensen Mod 10s into the upper chamber of an Ampeg 810E was a common mod. This was intended to brighten up the 810E which is a fairly dark cab.
If the Mod 10s are allowed to run full range the power rating of the 810E must be significantly derated. The original power rating for an 810E is 800W. Swapping in a pair Mod 10s will probably lower mechanical power handling to about 200W. So as long as you are not pushing heavy lows, you may be fine.
Since the Mod 10s are fairly lean down low, it would probably be a good idea to run a suitable value capacitor inline with them. The capacitor will serve as a high pass filter so the Mod 10s see less power below the cutoff.
If you don't know, the E120 is rated for 150W RMS so a pair is 300W RMS. The Twin is considered an 85W amp. I could run the amp to close to it's clean limit as long as I kept the bass control at 4 or lower. I actually gigged in a cover band with this setup. I could hear because I elevated the cab and tilted it to aim at my ears...but I would not say it carried the band. We mic'ed one of the JBLs and ran it through the PA.
Keep in mind the JBLs E120s are more robust than most guitar drivers. While I was able to gig with them, I don't consider them an ideal choice in this application.
Would I recommend a guitar amp for a bassist. Yes, but with a very firm warning: Keep the power level with the limits the cab. IMHO a lot of people will not be able to do this.
As a low volume practice amp or recording amp, most guitar cabs will be fine with bass...and can even sound great.
Another thing to consider. Back in the 60s, bassist frequently used cabs that were essentially running guitar speakers. I think it was fairly common for them to blow drivers though. In my experience a 100W tube head can push a 412 full stack rated for 600W beyond the drivers excursion limit if you crank up the lows. So some degree of caution and restraint is still required even when the cab is rated for six times the amps power rating. To be fair a 412 full stack will be pretty darn loud, but it won't have deep extended lows.
A few years back, swapping a pair of Jensen Mod 10s into the upper chamber of an Ampeg 810E was a common mod. This was intended to brighten up the 810E which is a fairly dark cab.
If the Mod 10s are allowed to run full range the power rating of the 810E must be significantly derated. The original power rating for an 810E is 800W. Swapping in a pair Mod 10s will probably lower mechanical power handling to about 200W. So as long as you are not pushing heavy lows, you may be fine.
Since the Mod 10s are fairly lean down low, it would probably be a good idea to run a suitable value capacitor inline with them. The capacitor will serve as a high pass filter so the Mod 10s see less power below the cutoff.
“In my experience a 100W tube head can push a 412 full stack rated for 600W beyond the drivers excursion limit if you crank up the lows.”
Absolutely! You can destroy a 1000w 18” transducer with just a few watts if you send the right (or rather wrong) signal to it.
The E-120s I have are in the original JBL Cabaret 4621 cabinet which is ported and tuned to those speakers. It has a low response of 50hz (-10dB) so it makes a nice bass cabinet. I’ve used Fender Showmans, Bassmans, and Marshall Plexis to run it so it’s not like I’m pushing massive power through the E-120s. If it was an open back cabinet I’d be far more careful. In this cab I’m not overly worried about it, although I certainly don’t abuse it. I want those speakers to last as long as possible!
Absolutely! You can destroy a 1000w 18” transducer with just a few watts if you send the right (or rather wrong) signal to it.
The E-120s I have are in the original JBL Cabaret 4621 cabinet which is ported and tuned to those speakers. It has a low response of 50hz (-10dB) so it makes a nice bass cabinet. I’ve used Fender Showmans, Bassmans, and Marshall Plexis to run it so it’s not like I’m pushing massive power through the E-120s. If it was an open back cabinet I’d be far more careful. In this cab I’m not overly worried about it, although I certainly don’t abuse it. I want those speakers to last as long as possible!
I suspect your E-120s are in a 4622 cab -- the 4621 is the same cab with a single E-130. Both of those products were aimed at guitar players.
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