Judging parents who let their kids take risks

[bolophonic]

My kids are never unsupervised, but they are allowed a huge amount of autonomy in deciding what they try. They are about to turn 3 and 5 and they experiment with real tools, climb ladders, handle animals. They obviously still require an enormous amount of guidance, but I feel like they are already showing signs that they are becoming savvy to assessing risk.

 

[blastoff99]

My kids are never unsupervised, but they are allowed a huge amount of autonomy in deciding what they try. They are about to turn 3 and 5 and they experiment with real tools, climb ladders, handle animals. They obviously still require an enormous amount of guidance, but I feel like they are already showing signs that they are becoming savvy to assessing risk.

Right. Too young to be solo, but not too young to be learning to make decisions with you to guide their thought processes (and spot them on ladders). I don't have kids but it is fascinating to watch parents engage their kids in public with "what might happen if..." and "would it be better to...".

Thinking is important. It just might lead to problem solving. When I was home alone, I was the only one there to deal with whatever might happen. Obviously there had been conversations about the "call 911" potential events, but short of that I had to decide whether whatever was going on merited a call to mom at work, a trip to the trusted neighbor, or if I could solve it myself without creating further chaos. That's useful stuff.

 

[blue4]

This all started with "It Takes a Village" and we all know who is responsible for that nonsense...

The Celts? That notion has been around forever. It'd be nice to lay it at the feet of one group or another but it isn't that simple in my mind.

 

[jmattbassplaya]

I rode my bike to school when I was 9 or 10.

I would walk home from school at that age with one of my neighborhood buds. We lived about a mile away.

 

[megafiddle]

It's called responsibility.

If you accept responsibilty then you are also entitled to authority.

Too many today are far too willing to hand over their authority in exchange for someone (or some agency) talking over their responsibility.

-

 

[Will_White]

This all started with "It Takes a Village" and we all know who is responsible for that nonsense...

I don't think you know what that means, unless you're trying to bring politics into this.

 

[hbarcat]

"America's Worst Mom"

Lenore Skenazy let her 9 year old son, Izzie, ride the subway by himself.

A mother who lives in Queens with her husband and two sons, her controversial decision to let her then-9-year-old son take the New York City subway home alone became a national story and prompted massive media attention. She was dubbed, "America's Worst Mom." In response, Skenazy founded the book, blog, and movement "Free-Range Kids," with the aim of "fighting the belief that our children are in constant danger from creeps, kidnapping, germs, grades, flashers, frustration, failure, baby snatchers, bugs, bullies, men, sleepovers and/or the perils of a non-organic grape."

Lenore Skenazy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


She was featured on Penn and Teller - BS!

 

[fingerguy]

"America's Worst Mom"

Lenore Skenazy let her 9 year old son, Izzie, ride the subway by himself.


Lenore Skenazy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


She was featured on Penn and Teller - BS!

What about the mom that drowned her kids? What about the recent mom that joined her daughter in a gang bang and had sex with the daughters boyfriend and the daughter was okay with it. This mom might be bad but there are worse things that can top what she did.

 

[Jazz Ad]

Is it really inherently bad to let a 9yo kid ride the subway by himself?

 

[fingerguy]

Is it really inherently bad to let a 9yo kid ride the subway by himself?

I would say so. My 9-year old wouldn't know what to do, how to get there, etc. Plus when you say subway I am assuming NYC and have you ridden the subway in NYC? If you have, then you should know the many reasons why a 9-year old should not be alone on a subway.

 

[fhm555]

When i was 13, my dad sat me down and told me I was old enough to make my own decisions. He assured me he would be available if i wanted to discuss things or if i needed help, but outside that i was on my own regards decisions that affected my life.
The first thing i did was take my savings and buy a motorcycle. My dad went with me to the local police chief and got a letter allowing me to ride the bike to run my paper route until i turned 14 and could obtain a legal license. We lived out in the sticks so i rode out there a lot until i turned 14.
My mom worried about me riding so my dad told me not to lie, but to employ creative license when she asked me where i was going. I've always been a risk taker and adrenalin junky so these days my folks might have been considered negligent, but nothing could be further from the truth.

 

[Gaolee]

We wrapped our kid in padding and duct tape. He survived. He even turned into an apparently responsible adult. I just don't know what we did wrong!

Fortunately, he's got the survival instincts of his mother. I have the life expectancy of a fruit fly. My continued existence is proof there's a god who likes the entertainment. He seems more likely to live to old age than not.

 

[96tbird]

I swear that it all began when they changed Snakes and Ladders to Chutes and Ladders. I mean WTH?

 

[hbarcat]

What about the mom that drowned her kids? What about the recent mom that joined her daughter in a gang bang and had sex with the daughters boyfriend and the daughter was okay with it. This mom might be bad but there are worse things that can top what she did.

The reason I linked to that was to point out that what she did was controversial. About half of the responses to her letting her 9 year old son ride the NYC subway were praising her for letting him have some responsibility and demonstrate self reliance. The other half called her the worst mom in America.

It needs to be pointed out that the kid asked to be allowed to ride the subway. It was his idea. She had a talk with him before giving permission and had him explain what he would do each step of the way and say what he would do if something unexpected happened.

The boy was interviewed numerous times in the news media and he really is significantly advanced in maturity for his age. I'm firmly on the side of the mom in this case. She is the opposite of a bad mother - her son is being prepared for the decision making skills of the adult world.

 

[BboogieXVII]

I'm just glad my kid is 18 now. Old enough to buy cigs and have sex with whomever, old enough to die for whatever belief system he indulges in, but not old enough to buy a six pack. Old enough to be unsupervised, maybe. Anyway the age of responsibility and able to be left alone I thought was 13, at least legally.

 

[hbarcat]

My brother and I were allowed to do so many things that would have gotten our parents called negligent if it happened today. I'm genuinely surprised we not only survived but managed to never get seriously hurt enough to merit a trip to the emergency room.

I'm extremely grateful for having grown up with so much autonomy and for having had so many opportunities to test my limits. I learned to be a good judge of which risks are acceptable and which are not. My younger brother is an extremely talented person and a skilled athlete. I think he benefited more than I did from the risk taking we took as children.

My wife was a "helicopter mom" with our daughter - always hovering over her so she wouldn't get hurt or abducted by a stranger, or even try something that might get her a skinned elbow. It drove me nuts.

Our daughter is now 23 and has turned out okay, but she honestly doesn't have very much confidence in her own abilities and is reluctant to try anything new. This is just anecdotal, but it does suggest a cause and effect to me.

 

[fdeck]

The reason I linked to that was to point out that what she did was controversial. About half of the responses to her letting her 9 year old son ride the NYC subway were praising her for letting him have some responsibility and demonstrate self reliance. The other half called her the worst mom in America.

It needs to be pointed out that the kid asked to be allowed to ride the subway. It was his idea. She had a talk with him before giving permission and had him explain what he would do each step of the way and say what he would do if something unexpected happened.

The boy was interviewed numerous times in the news media and he really is significantly advanced in maturity for his age. I'm firmly on the side of the mom in this case. She is the opposite of a bad mother - her son is being prepared for the decision making skills of the adult world.

Chances are, the kid was more familiar with NYC transit than most of us, and could get home from a familiar place, blindfolded.

Now, letting his mom ride the information superhighway without supervision was apparently another matter. If she was genuinely surprised by the reaction to her blog, then she must have been pretty new to the Internet. My kids might have gotten lost on the NYC subways, but they wouldn't have turned themselves into the targets of a media sensation by accident. We've talked about it.

On the other hand, maybe she manufactured the controversy, heaven forbid.

Which brings me to my question: In the absence of the "free range parenting" movement, how many parents actually get accused of neglect for letting their kids do ordinary things like going to the park? We all know that the fear of child abduction is exaggerated, but maybe the fear of neglect-accusations is exaggerated too. I see lots of small kids walking to school in my locale, or playing in the park, alone or in groups, sometimes doing some pretty stupid things. Parents always gossip and try to one-up one another on Facebook, but nobody's ever been accused of child neglect by the authorities.

Now for a couple of observations. First, today's kids get less time to experience autonomy because their lives are so over-scheduled. This is not caused by fearful parenting, but by other issues. Second, some improvements to child safety are beneficial. For instance we take concussions much more seriously today, and our pediatrician asks us if we smoke or have guns in the house.

Maybe a simple prescription is: Let your kids do normal things, but don't blog about it, especially if your blog is critical of other parents.

 

[fdeck]

Our daughter is now 23 and has turned out okay, but she honestly doesn't have very much confidence in her own abilities and is reluctant to try anything new. This is just anecdotal, but it does suggest a cause and effect to me.

Don't accuse yourself. While you know what I think about "studies," I've read about studies suggesting that genetics are more important than parenting when it comes to shaping someone's personality.

 

[hbarcat]

Now, letting his mom ride the information superhighway without supervision was apparently another matter. If she was genuinely surprised by the reaction to her blog, then she must have been pretty new to the Internet. My kids might have gotten lost on the NYC subways, but they wouldn't have turned themselves into the targets of a media sensation by accident. We've talked about it.

On the other hand, maybe she manufactured the controversy, heaven forbid.

Good question. The answer is she was an experienced professional journalist with a regular column in a high profile publication and she wrote an article describing how she let her son ride the subway home alone for the express purpose of objecting to what she saw as the growing trend of excessive over protection of children by their parents. She knew that what she was saying was controversial but she also said she was shocked at the amount of anger and hate that was directed her way as a result. She deliberately inserted herself into the middle of the controversy but the controversy was already there. She had nothing to do with manufacturing it. She was simply adding her professional opinion based on her personal experience. I consider this a proper use of the press and is good for positive public debate. But along with that comes the expectation that putting yourself in the middle of the fray means that you're going to have to accept the consequences. In this case, a lot of vitriolic responses from some outraged parents.

Now for a couple of observations. First, today's kids get less time to experience autonomy because their lives are so over-scheduled. This is not caused by fearful parenting, but by other issues. Second, some improvements to child safety are beneficial. For instance we take concussions much more seriously today, and our pediatrician asks us if we smoke or have guns in the house.

I agree with this. There were risks that my parents allowed me to take that I didn't extend to my daughter because I knew they were too risky in my judgement. I have the benefit over my parents of a generation of health and safety improvements and an overall increase of relevant knowledge. The best example I can think of is mandating that my daughter wear a helmet while riding a bike. This isn't over-protection - it's truly ignorant of the vast number of head injuries that send kids to the hospital every year to consider bike helmets an option for sissies.

 

[fdeck]

Good question. The answer is she was an experienced professional journalist with a regular column in a high profile publication and she wrote an article describing how she let her son ride the subway home alone for the express purpose of objecting to what she saw as the growing trend of excessive over protection of children by their parents. She knew that what she was saying was controversial but she also said she was shocked at the amount of anger and hate that was directed her way as a result. She deliberately inserted herself into the middle of the controversy but the controversy was already there. She had nothing to do with manufacturing it. She was simply adding her professional opinion based on her personal experience. I consider this a proper use of the press and is good for positive public debate. But along with that comes the expectation that putting yourself in the middle of the fray means that you're going to have to accept the consequences. In this case, a lot of vitriolic responses from some outraged parents.

High profile publication:

The New York Sun - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

On Web forums, saying something for the purpose of provoking a response, then chiding people for responding with strong words, is called trolling. If you provoke people, you're guaranteed of receiving extreme responses that you be shocked by. "Journalists" use shock and outrage to manipulate people.

Sure the controversy already existed... since the dawn of civilization. People have always gossiped about which parents are too lenient, protective, strict etc. Parents are under the microscope all the time, especially moms. All that's changed is that what used to be expressed in private is now spewed all over the Internet. But Skenazy manufactured the incident that provoked the outrage. There's nothing to learn from it. If you read an article and feel inclined to be outraged, always ask yourself if you're being manipulated.

And it may still be much ado about nothing. I've never heard of any real person getting arrested for letting their kid walk home from school.