Learn Theory

[13lues]

Trust me. Do it. I'm sure everybody has heard that old saying "I don't want to learn theory because I don't want it to get in the way of my creativity". Oddly enough I've never heard anybody say, "I learned theory and it got in the way of my creativity".

Me and my bandmates decided to get serious and all learn how to read music and learn theory. The quality and quantity of our song writing has exploded. It makes communicating ideas so much smoother. No more, "Can you try playing more of a baa baa didly whaow", and more "How about trying that in the Dorian scale with an emphasis on the ____".

Seriously. Do it.

 

[johnReeve]

I dunno... while I like the fact that I can read, and I'm still learning quite a bit... and looking at theory has been super helpful to me in the last couple of years...

the reason I didn't know more theory sooner has more to do with the fact that my gigs just didn't require that much theory.

Like, if I get a call for some blues or country gig, they ain't gonna have charts much less notated parts, and they don't want me to be creative, they want me to play the right parts, which more or less is always whatever notes I pick up off a recording or (more likely) something generic.

That said, I've taken up playing pedal steel and started playing a lot more piano just so I can understand enough theory to play the the steel effectively. That process has been super helpful to my overall grasp on music. And damn, playing with older musicians who really know some jazz is tough if you don't have at least a little bit of an idea of what is happening, even if you think you know the changes in one key.

It can be really fun and useful and inspiring to learn theory stuff. Like, tonight I've been trying to get some chords to substitute so I don't have to think as much when I'm playing guitar with this big band...

and I was playing C augmented on the piano and figured out that its the "same" as e aug and g# aug (though it's a B# and D, which, dang I'm still amazed at the fact these notes have a real and intelligible meaning)...

that kind of stuff is super useful cause I don't have to think as much when I'm playing and I can think about something else like "holy crap what is that next chord even mean" when I'm sight reading. It's probably obvious to most folks who'd find it useful, but news to me.

So yay theory.

But my point is that most folks don't learn theory because they have enough of an idea of what is happening with the music that they don't need the theory, not because they worry about it stifling creativity. And I can't argue with not learning things if you don't find them useful. And to top it all off, it's damn frustrating and boring to try and get some theory down if you don't find it useful... I sure couldn't learn this stuff if I didn't have some other instruments to play where notes other than the major/min triad notes were in play on the instrument in typical generic day-to-day use.

 

[1stnamebassist]

Theory is great if you can apply it to the music your playing. If you are learning some theory but not
playing the type of music you would use it in it probably won't stick. An example would be studying modes and
jazz and playing in a classic rock or country cover band.

 

[99Z3]

Theory is great if you can apply it to the music your playing. If you are learning some theory but not
playing the type of music you would use it in it probably won't stick. An example would be studying modes and
jazz and playing in a classic rock or country cover band.

So you are in favor of limiting your ability as a bass player?

 

[Lobster11]

I don't know how bands manage to write originals without knowledge of at least some fundamentals, such as the names of common scales and chords -- if only to be able to communicate ideas efficiently.

 

[1stnamebassist]

So you are in favor of limiting your ability as a bass player?[/QUOTE
No of course not, but if your only interest is in a certain type of music let's say bluegrass or country, studying something like modes may not be useful, and is not likely to stick in muscle memory unless you can apply it to what your playing. I'm all about learning all you can, but I also enjoy playing different genres of music so I can apply what I have learned. I know for me anyway I could sit home and study all kinds of stuff, but if I have nowhere to apply it it's not gonna stick. Maybe it's because I'm a little older too! Things don't stick in the memory banks as well now as they used to!

 

[99Z3]

No.. I don't believe none of that! Knowledge is power! More you know, the better off you will be .. plus, it makes you more marketable !

 

[1stnamebassist]

You should learn all you can no argument there, but I'm not gonna spend a lot of time studying jazz when I don't play or enjoy jazz, or slap because I don't like slap, I find it annoying and will never play it. I'll play classic rock and blues and tend to focus on that. I just know for me studying things I don't like won't stick. But then again I'm not on the market! But yeah if you can take all the theory and apply it to what you play that's great. I know about chord construction, scales etc.... I've been playing since the 70's. I took personal instruction from a few instructors for a few years. I used to even read music! But a lot of that stuff is long forgotten since a lot of it doesn't apply to what I play.

 

[99Z3]

I have tried to learn to slap.. only for my own enjoyment.. but for some reason, I am like a nerd dancing with two left feet when it comes to slap style!

You should learn all you can no argument there, but I'm not gonna spend a lot of time studying jazz when I don't play or enjoy jazz, or slap because I don't like slap, I find it annoying and will never play it. I'll play classic rock and blues and tend to focus on that. I just know for me studying things I don't like won't stick. But then again I'm not on the market! But yeah if you can take all the theory and apply it to what you play that's great. I know about chord construction, scales etc.... I've been playing since the 70's. I took personal instruction from a few instructors for a few years. I used to even read music! But a lot of that stuff is long forgotten since a lot of it doesn't apply to what I play.

 

[1stnamebassist]

Only slap guy I like is Les Claypool and yeah I tried it even though I don't like it and I suck too! I guess that kind of makes my point also. If you don't like it it probably won't stick. Good luck in whatever you study. And most of all have fun!

 

[Lobster11]

You should learn all you can no argument there, but I'm not gonna spend a lot of time studying jazz when I don't play or enjoy jazz, or slap because I don't like slap, I find it annoying and will never play it. I'll play classic rock and blues and tend to focus on that. I just know for me studying things I don't like won't stick. But then again I'm not on the market! But yeah if you can take all the theory and apply it to what you play that's great. I know about chord construction, scales etc.... I've been playing since the 70's. I took personal instruction from a few instructors for a few years. I used to even read music! But a lot of that stuff is long forgotten since a lot of it doesn't apply to what I play.

It seems to me that the fundamentals of theory, such as basic "chord construction, scales etc...," are useful to know for playing (and especially for writing) any kind of music. You don't need to spend time studying these things because you already know them, but I'll bet that knowledge informs and improves your playing in many ways without you even thinking about it.

 

[99Z3]

It seems to me that the fundamentals of theory, such as basic "chord construction, scales etc...," are useful to know for playing (and especially for writing) any kind of music. You don't need to spend time studying these things because you already know them, but I'll bet that knowledge informs and improves your playing in many ways without you even thinking about it.

Agreed

 

[99Z3]

Only slap guy I like is Les Claypool and yeah I tried it even though I don't like it and I suck too! I guess that kind of makes my point also. If you don't like it it probably won't stick. Good luck in whatever you study. And most of all have fun!

I always have fun.. if I was not, I would not be doing it!

 

[1stnamebassist]

It seems to me that the fundamentals of theory, such as basic "chord construction, scales etc...," are useful to know for playing (and especially for writing) any kind of music. You don't need to spend time studying these things because you already know them, but I'll bet that knowledge informs and improves your playing in many ways without you even thinking about it.

Exactly. You need the fundamentals for everything. I don't think I need to know every bizzare scale to play over a f#msus4+13th chord . That's all I'm saying really. I had a martial instructor say to practice the basics and be a winner. Practice the fundamentals and forget the flashy stuff because that can get you killed. Of course if your gonna play jazz I guess you would probably want to learn as many scales as you can for whatever given chord or progression!

 

[Jbassrockboy]

Do. Re me fa ... What comes after fa?? Da!!?? I don't think so lol

Yes ... Learn the theory if you want to be a better player ....because it opens the door to a better understanding of what's going down in the music around you...


Rossa

 

[friendlybass]

Theory is cool, but often overrated. I've learned a lot of it, and basically only use what I learned in my first 6 months of class.
My opinion, learn your scales, learn your chords, and learn why those things work musically. Then play your ass off and call it a day. Lather, rinse, repeat. But hey, I'm just a guy

 

[Polfuste]

I'm in the process, after 18 years playing bass by ears, to learn theory; in order to go further in Jazz. And i discover a lot of things, like the fact i was stucked in major scales, and that is the reason i could'nt play all these colors i can hear in Jazz. It's like open a door. There's a whole world to discover behind.

 

[SteveCS]

Trust me. Do it. I'm sure everybody has heard that old saying "I don't want to learn theory because I don't want it to get in the way of my creativity". Oddly enough I've never heard anybody say, "I learned theory and it got in the way of my creativity".

Me and my bandmates decided to get serious and all learn how to read music and learn theory. The quality and quantity of our song writing has exploded. It makes communicating ideas so much smoother. No more, "Can you try playing more of a baa baa didly whaow", and more "How about trying that in the Dorian scale with an emphasis on the ____".

Seriously. Do it.

Theory is a framework developed over many years (centuries) to describe music in words. The risk arises when one takes a dogmatic approach to the application of theory in composition, e.g. "I know that sounds good but it is not good theory therefore we shouldn't do it". The reality might be that the individuals' collective knowledge of theory is not sufficient to understand why that sounds good therefore they reject it as bad because it is not good in theory. My bet is that most things are covered off somewhere in the great body of knowledge that is music theory - just because you don't yet know where, does not mean it is not there. Music theory is an ever-expanding body of knowledge that should not get in the way of creativity, but it can be one of those things where a little (or insufficient) knowledge can be a dangerous thing.

Example: In Father and Son, by Cat Stevens. As I play it on the Stick, I replace the last Am7 in the verse with A Major. Huh? How does A Major fit in the key of the tune. In theory, it doesn't, yet it lifts the mood of the harmonic structure right at the point where the lyric is heading towards an expression of hope. Look deeper into theory, and this tiny change is nothing more than a modulation (key change) from G to D. D is the dominant of G - changing key to the dominant is a known motif for 'raising the mood'. The temporary key change is reversed by the final harmonic sequence IV (G Major in D) - ii (Em, which is also vi (relative minor) of G and so prepares the modulation back to G) followed by D7 - G (another tweak and the point where the key change actually happens) even more powerful and underlines the major tonality of the song in spite of it's regular forays into the relative minor tonality.

 

[Jesi Di]

Trust me. Do it. I'm sure everybody has heard that old saying "I don't want to learn theory because I don't want it to get in the way of my creativity". Oddly enough I've never heard anybody say, "I learned theory and it got in the way of my creativity".

Me and my bandmates decided to get serious and all learn how to read music and learn theory. The quality and quantity of our song writing has exploded. It makes communicating ideas so much smoother. No more, "Can you try playing more of a baa baa didly whaow", and more "How about trying that in the Dorian scale with an emphasis on the ____".

Seriously. Do it.

DOing this the last few months and it really, really makes 100% difference in my playing, technique, communication with other performers (even singers, helping others find harmony), and overall musicianship!

 

[Jesi Di]

Theory is great if you can apply it to the music your playing. If you are learning some theory but not
playing the type of music you would use it in it probably won't stick. An example would be studying modes and
jazz and playing in a classic rock or country cover band.

Learning theory helped me tremendously with my country band (especially learning what a major scale, blues scale, and pentatonic scale is, the 'country scale,' mixolydian mode and intervals). I can now do walking basslines, which I didn't really understand before. Theory helps with any kind of music. Knowing scales/being aware of what key the rest of the band is in will always help someone's bass playing. Once you understand these scales and practice them, they stick in your head and never leave. They are now like my 'go-to' licks when just having fun. Of course they didn't stunt my creativity, they only helped it.