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Learning music by ear...questions about it

M

martyman5000

Sep 12, 2004
1,482
6
60
Toronto Canada
www.myspace.com
#1
So I tried out for a band and asked the guitarist what tuning he was in for the recordings. He told me it was a full step down and when I arrived I was told a half step. When I played along with the recordings I sounded in tune a step down.

Its not the first time I've been given a link to a bands music and later I'm told I sound out of tune because the guitarist is playing in a different tuning with out clarification...is this a common problem?

I also gave up on tabs after finding so many that are in a octave higher...I have a philosophy about learning covers from music I just automatically try it as low as possible...any suggestions would be appreciated.
 
#2
Developing your ear takes practice & nothing more. When I was younger I'd sit in front of the TV with my bass and watch MTV and try to figure out every song that came on. Then again, that's back when MTV actually played videos. :D

As far as playing out of tune with the guitar player... In this case it sounds like he told you wrong and you figured it out the wrong way. Kinda his fault there, but it shouldn't be too hard to tune up and play the song. Might have to slide your fingers a half step in one direction or another.
 
#3
Yes, many musicians I have played/auditioned with have no idea about tuning, and truly think that you should be able to guess before or on the spot. And if you have the right attitude, then you will see they are right, you should be able to play the songs no matter the tuning.

First off, always use a tuner. You can't be off if your always in tune. Next is where the ear training comes in. And the best thing for that is to learn as many songs as you can. Then you will start to hear the difference of the same notes on different spots of the neck. And from their you can tell which position the song is played in. And unless you learn music by ear, you should refer to Tabs for help.

And the beauty of this is, when you are done you can play almost anything at anytime. Every song uses the same notes, and there are only so many notes on the fret board, and most songs use the same ones.

Best of luck!!
 
#4
Yes its common for recordings to be played in different keys and tunings live. Its also common for you to have to guess. I have always wondered why, when its so easy to just tell people. Anyway, thats guitarists for you :)

Get yourself a copy of BestPractice. That software lets you slow music down so you can learn it by ear more efficiently, and also allows you to change the pitch of the song.
 
#5
first thing you need to do is never look at a Tab again. They are the worst thing to happen to music ever (at least modern day tabs are).

Next, while listening to songs and trying to figure them out can be helpful and should be a part of your ear training, you should look into getting an actual ear training curriculum (textbook w/cd, online course, private teacher,etc.) musictheory.net is a good basic place to start.

Now, if you don't know music theory you should learn the basics of that too. Voiceless was alluding to this. If you can hear a piece of music as say I, ii, V, I or G maj, a min, D major, G maj. etc.. that sort of thing, then you'll be much better off, and can play the changes in any key. Rather then "well its the third fret, the the fifth...but I don't know what the notes are" --which is what tab does to people and why I despise it.

This to me is the difference between 'somebody who can play bass' and a real bassist, aka musician.
 
#8
I use GuitarPro for learning a lot of the lines I cover and one of the bands I was in all learned off the same version. Made things really easy to get songs up to speed quickly.

Its still tabs but the software has the option to show the sheet music. Plus it lets you play along, loops sections, slow down, speed up, transpose, cut volume on instruments, and write your own riffs and ideas. Excellent all around tool.
 
#9
Our band uses Guitar Pro also, it has many options as Depth Charge just pointed out and Ive learned alot about music from using it. Tabs have a place, as long as you know the limits of using them and use them in conjuction with notation. I recommend it to anyone at any level.
 
#12
walker rosewood said:
first thing you need to do is never look at a Tab again. They are the worst thing to happen to music ever (at least modern day tabs are).

Next, while listening to songs and trying to figure them out can be helpful and should be a part of your ear training, you should look into getting an actual ear training curriculum (textbook w/cd, online course, private teacher,etc.) musictheory.net is a good basic place to start.

Now, if you don't know music theory you should learn the basics of that too. Voiceless was alluding to this. If you can hear a piece of music as say I, ii, V, I or G maj, a min, D major, G maj. etc.. that sort of thing, then you'll be much better off, and can play the changes in any key. Rather then "well its the third fret, the the fifth...but I don't know what the notes are" --which is what tab does to people and why I despise it.

This to me is the difference between 'somebody who can play bass' and a real bassist, aka musician.
Click to expand...

I agree, except that tab can be used as a starting point. I would say that its not something that should be part of the learning routine. But in the past I have used it as a starting point. Like to figure which position the song is being played in, and especially when songs are recorded between tunings.

But you are correct, worst thing to do is become reliant on Tabs. But don't write them off completely.
 
#14
Yeah, its pretty important to agree on the key the song is in he, he.

As far as playing by ear, I think that's the way to go in general if you are doing covers. The pain is that sometimes you have to listen for quite a while to really hear what is being played. But that process is well worth it in the long run, and it gets much easier with practice. The payoff is that while learning to play what you hear in a song by ear, you soon become better at coming up with your own original bass parts.
 
#15
TheVoiceless said:
I agree, except that tab can be used as a starting point. I would say that its not something that should be part of the learning routine. But in the past I have used it as a starting point. Like to figure which position the song is being played in, and especially when songs are recorded between tunings.

But you are correct, worst thing to do is become reliant on Tabs. But don't write them off completely.
Click to expand...

The advise so far has been excellent and I'm going to try a few of them.

To be honest the only good thing about tab is when you find one that is really wrong and you quickly figure out why.
 
#16
To be honest the only good thing about tab is when you find one that is really wrong and you quickly figure out why.
Click to expand...

Haha. imho that's one of the worst things about tabs. They're all wrong. Well, i think about 90% of them are. Even tabs from published books can be dumbed down versions, wrong key, typos, or just plain wrong. Most beginners cannot tell they're wrong, and thus learn many tunes wrong, thinking they're right. That's very damaging.


I guess you could say that tabs are more easily created, published (on the internet), and readily available than standard notation for just about any tune imaginable. But what's the point if they're wrong?

...and you still need to listen with your aural skills to get the rhythms anyway.

tab discussions always send me on a rant. I apologize.
 
#17
martyman5000 said:
He told me it was a full step down and when I arrived I was told a half step...
Click to expand...


The problem you describe is one of transposing more than playing by ear.
To take a song you have learned and move it to a new key, you have to understand the basic of theory: intervals, scales and especially harmonizing the major scale.

You have to reach the point of looking at the songs you leanr as fucntional harmonic progressions (I-IV-V) instead of specific chords or notes (Cmaj -Fmaj- G7).
when you understand harmony and can see a song in this way , transposing is easy and you will never ever have to worry about how anyone else is tuned.
 
#18
My suggestion is to listen to the songs and try to figure out the notes, using a standard tuned bass, and without using open strings. Learning the songs and finger patterns without open strings will allow you to detune your bass to the matching tuning without having to transpose your fingering.

My suggestion, has worked for me for three decades now.
 
#19
The best thing to do is learn the song from the recording and internalize it as much as possible. Think about what jazz musicians do all the time-- someone will call a tune that's normally in, say, Eb Major, and right before they count it off will say "Okay, Gone With The Wind in "F.'" Everyone's expected to know the changes in the new key.

Obviously, that's a skill that takes a while to be developed, but it's something that could be learned in a few years with some really focused ear training. You'll laugh at the fact that you used to read tabs when you can quickly pick up all the changes (and keys) by ear.
 

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