• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Live sound woes....please help...

LightGroove

LightGroove

Oct 24, 2006
1,997
187
Happy Bottom, VA
#1
I come to you once again my fellow tb bretheren with a weird issue.

Current setup.

2 2x15 peavey mains
2 1x15 peavey monitors
2 1x15 powered mackie monitors
1 18' powered nady sub

Main power amp is a crown 602...run parallel using a y connect cable

monitors run off of a single channel behringer.

Our band has recently picked up a new behringer3400 crossover to add a sub to our main mix.

We had a show today . I ran sound for my friends band and a 2nd act. Had a few hiccups early with the 1st band..basically the limiter was set too high...no problems outside of some distorted vocals. Ive never had this issue before..almost as if too much was being pushed through the speakers.

2nd band...same issue...even worse problems...these guys were much heavier with dueling electrics and typical modern rock....vocals were crazy distorted. again almost like too much was going through the speakers. I checked and rechecked and no major clipping issues. Later in the set we lose our powered sub...someone saw some smoke...:hmm:a few songs later one of the power mackie monitors craps out...the overheat light was on.

Now this system has never been pushed this much for this period of time...over 2 hrs..secondly the sub and mackie have been sitting for a period of time.. I had all gains adjusted properly with no major clipping... was this system pushed too hard...did i miss something and cause this or is this a fluke?

really bummed
 
#2
Short answer, not enough rig for the gig. Your PA is all bottom feeder gear from what I can tell. Not to pick on you but your bass gear costs more than your PA which is wrong IMO. The specs on that Nady sub are terrible. No way that one would be enough for a gig that required any volume. It is also possible that you don't have your crossover set right.
 
#3
If the vocals were distorting you were clipping something somewhere.
Either the channel on the mixing board, the main outs from the board, the input/output from any EQ, the crossover...
Smoke coming from the sub is a sure sign to me that it was driven way too hard....yeas, it could have just failed...but from how you are describing how the show was going my money is on it was driven way too hard.

Have someone local that really knows PA systems check your rig out, maybe they can find something that you may be overlooking in your setup.
 
#5
Indeed our setup is low budget..this was actually a big step up from our previous setup. We typically play small church and low key outdoor events...this happened to be thrown together at the last minute and we were forced to use our setup.... I agree it is/was not ideal...and per the issues we hit it was clear that this was the case.

Routing:
Proco stagemaster 16x4 snake - I send a mono signal (left channel)through the snake to the crossover and then have a Y xlr cable out of the high end of the crossover into both inputs of our crown amp. This feeds the 2 2x15 speakers. I had the low end summed on the crossover and send a basic xlr mic cable to the sub. Which after thinking i didnt need to sum as its mono.

Our board is a simple peavey pv14 ... I use a separate behringer mixer that I use for drums to condense them down and dump them into the peavey.

Ive done the clipping test with our amps...The board was set right ...however the lead vocals were clipping at times...only when he really got into it...Ive had minimal time with the crossover... I have the low end set around 65hz right now. I assumed that anything above this went to the 2x15 cabs...is this correct?

One of my major beefs with the band is everything is so rushed..we had NO time for a soundcheck yesterday..a few mic checks and guitar strums was it...:mad:
 
#7
That PA would be fine for vocal, guitar and maybe snare / hi hats / bass drum, But if you are running the whole band though it it won't cope.
If you have good backline leave the PA to do vocals and bring out the drums, I can never understand why the current fashion is to thow everything at a small PA?
A crossover point at around 120hz should be fine
Blown gear sucks.
 
#8
If the entire pa was distorting along with the singer, that's one thing. Could be clipping anywhere in the chain pretty much.

If only the singer distorted when he dug in, his channel is likely too high at the attenuator.

If there are no clip lights going off on the channels, the board or the power amps, some effect in the signal chain is likely the culprit. Or the speakers can't handle what they're being sent.

Randy
 
#9
Thanks guys... I'll do some adjusting of the crossover if we end up replacing or repairing the sub. What should the output levels at the crossover be set at. It gets a little confusing as I have gain/output on the board, on the power amps, and on the crossover. :hmm:

I agree about running everything through...this was a beef of mine early considering the smaller setup....then everyone agreed yea lets give it a shot and here we are.

Whats the smartest way to run everything through on a budget ?

Peace
 
#10
LightGroove said:
Thanks guys... I'll do some adjusting of the crossover if we end up replacing or repairing the sub. What should the output levels at the crossover be set at. It gets a little confusing as I have gain/output on the board, on the power amps, and on the crossover. :hmm:

I agree about running everything through...this was a beef of mine early considering the smaller setup....then everyone agreed yea lets give it a shot and here we are.

Whats the smartest way to run everything through on a budget ?

Peace
Click to expand...

You're doing the best you can with gear on hand but it will have some limitations. BTW, you mentioned a limiter...what limiter are you talking about?

*Set your crossover at 100 hz for starters, 65 is way too low. The Behringer Xover has a defeatable fixed 25 hz HPF which is better than nothing. My back-up dbx 223xl has a 40 hz filter and, better still, my DriveRack has a fully adjustable HPF which I set at 45-50 hz with BW 18 slope. Think protection and conservation of energy. Also, set your input and ouput at -0-. Make sure your freq. selector is set at X1 (normal), not X10.

*Set each vocal channel in "solo" mode with the PFL engaged. Use the loudest vocal passages possible; "testing...one, two, three" won't cut it.

*If you haven't set component gain structure with a pink noise CD, I strongly suggest you do so. You should be able to push your main faders to -0- during a live performance without clipping the xover or power amps. I just dug a little deeper into the Behringer manual and it does have a limiter which can be rolled into the equation.

*Whenever possible, use a "cut-only" approach when setting EQ. Boosting freqs. eats up a lot of headroom and can contribute to the distortion.

*Know your equipment. As mentioned, a single Nady sub probably won't keep up with a pair of Peavey 2 X 15's.

Riis
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back