Making a fretted into a fretless.....

[woodyng2]

I wanted a Rickenbacker 4004 fretless,which doesn't exist as a factory offering,so i had my Cheyenne ii defretted by the 12th fret in Portland,OR. I'm very happy with it,although i don't play it as much as i should.
I do sometimes consider having the fingerboard finished. (Cheyenne ii's have unfinished boards from the factory).

 

[woodyng2]

Only in more recent years.

View attachment 932705
Photograph Copyright © Jeffrey P. Scott 2005 All rights reserved.

I don't have anything better that shows more of the fingerboard, but note the nice dark, finished look.

Jeff,that one must be a faker,wrong trc,keys,etc.

 

[woodyng2]

But seriously....i did think the cheyenne ii fretboards were unfinished,and the Laredos had the finished ones.
Like most things Rickenbacker,there must be exceptions to the rule.....

 

[Whippet]

Another thing worth considering: have you ever played a fretless bass? Or are you just bored and looking for a project? The first step should be to go and play a few fretless basses. It would completely suck to spend a ton of time on converting a bass, only to realize you're not a fan of playing fretless.

I am actually playing the F Bass AC 6. It's a great bass but I need a beater bass to carry around on the ariplane and am thinking of converting a cheap Bacchus jazz bass.

 

[Whippet]

Filing the frets down is a nightmare for any future refret, I would never do that as an amateur, nor would most pro Luthier's, but it's your bass.

Never thought of that one.

 

[Whippet]

I had a fair bass, and de-fretted it, filled the gaps and it looks nice. It plays nicely from the feel but sounds muddy and dull. The rosewood fingerboard is now nowhere near flat anymore and the strings have rubbed it away pretty badly. I don't play it often and only when I need that dull sound. I won't do it again.

My cheap bacchus is a rosewood too. This is a problem......

 

[Whippet]

What bass are you converting? If I was doing a P or a J, I'd buy a Mighty Mite fretless neck. $100, done.

Cheap Bacchus 5 string active jazz bass @ 275 bucks including gig bag. I will look up Mighty Mite.

 

[Whippet]

It would be best to understand which characteristics of basses in general are appropriate to your preferences for fretless. For example, I vastly prefer a very light resonant body bass for pizz work in general; and since 99.9% of my fretless playing is pizz, I specifically look for the lightest most resonant bodies I can find for fretless. For me, one of those 12 pound ash bodied Jazz Basses, which is great for slap, would not be the bass I would think about defretting. YMMV, of course.

Second, information is out there to do the work yourself; but, if you are unsure what you are doing, best to have the work done by a qualified luthier who has previously done the conversion. Among other things, removing the frets changes the flexural characteristics of the neck; and, so, the slots need to be filled with a suitable material. Plus, you may decide to convert back to frets at some point; and properly filled slots are readily re-cut in the case of a later refret. There are also issues related to fingerboard finish; but, that's another discussion.

I forgot the model number of the Bacchus I am thinking about converting. I believe it was called the W 005 (something like that) I honestly have no idea what the wood it. It does have a rosewood fretboard which I know is not always the best fretboard for fretless.

I would be asking a professional to do the job.

 

[bucephylus]

I forgot the model number of the Bacchus I am thinking about converting. I believe it was called the W 005 (something like that) I honestly have no idea what the wood it. It does have a rosewood fretboard which I know is not always the best fretboard for fretless.

I would be asking a professional to do the job.

The only issue with rosewood is that it is a bit softer than ebony and somewhat more prone to wear if you use round wounds. Quite honestly, the make of the bass is a good bit less important than getting the conversion done correctly, getting a good setup(including nut adjustment, if necessary), and figuring out fingerboard finish or lack thereof. I had a purple Fernandez 5 string that was a killer.

The finish on the board is a debated topic with a variety of different advocates.

Epoxy is quite different from bare wood, wears well, but is a good bit brighter than bare wood. Polyurethane, as posted earlier, is much closer to bare wood in warmth, but wears like nails. Polyurethane is also a bit easier for a DIY job, even using Minwax brush-on from Home Depot. Just make sure to sand with 400 grit paper between coats, eliminating ALL high spots with a sanding block; and if you finish off with fine steel wool, you get a matte finish that almost looks like bare wood. Or you might want to have someone like Pat Wilkins do it. He is excellent. Or, the tech who does your conversion?

Or, if you are just experimenting, the bare wood is fine for a while too, though you might have to do some leveling if using round wounds after a while. I have rutted an ebony board beyond playability; but, that was after a prolonged (~ 18 mos.) open mic blues gig stint.

And, after you get the conversion done, just have fun with it. We all debate the different approaches on here; but, quite honestly, almost any fretless I've ever picked up with a decent setup was a blast to play. Roundwounds or flatwounds or whatever. Also, be aware to target stops right on the lines. You can't target between the lines, and that is difficult for some players. Some cats just have to have a blank board because of the visual reference issue and do not choose to adjust. If you can learn to target the lines, then that technique, will also, IMO, improve your fretted technique.

Probably TMI. Good luck with the conversion and have fun with it!

 

[tfer]

I forgot the model number of the Bacchus I am thinking about converting. I believe it was called the W 005 (something like that) I honestly have no idea what the wood it. It does have a rosewood fretboard which I know is not always the best fretboard for fretless.

I would be asking a professional to do the job.

Rosewood is just fine for fretless. the open grain is warmer sounding than ebony, but it holds up very well against string wear. Proper technique and setup will help ensure a lighter touch, helping to eliminate wear.

Expect to see light markings on the board within a few months, but they won't affect playability. I used rounds on my first fretless (a conversion I did myself) for over a decade before I used a radius sanding block and cleaned up the board. There was still no buzzing, but I was getting it ready to sell.

 

[Whippet]

The only issue with rosewood is that it is a bit softer than ebony and somewhat more prone to wear if you use round wounds. Quite honestly, the make of the bass is a good bit less important than getting the conversion done correctly, getting a good setup(including nut adjustment, if necessary), and figuring out fingerboard finish or lack thereof. I had a purple Fernandez 5 string that was a killer.

The finish on the board is a debated topic with a variety of different advocates.

Epoxy is quite different from bare wood, wears well, but is a good bit brighter than bare wood. Polyurethane, as posted earlier, is much closer to bare wood in warmth, but wears like nails. Polyurethane is also a bit easier for a DIY job, even using Minwax brush-on from Home Depot. Just make sure to sand with 400 grit paper between coats, eliminating ALL high spots with a sanding block; and if you finish off with fine steel wool, you get a matte finish that almost looks like bare wood. Or you might want to have someone like Pat Wilkins do it. He is excellent. Or, the tech who does your conversion?

Or, if you are just experimenting, the bare wood is fine for a while too, though you might have to do some leveling if using round wounds after a while. I have rutted an ebony board beyond playability; but, that was after a prolonged (~ 18 mos.) open mic blues gig stint.

And, after you get the conversion done, just have fun with it. We all debate the different approaches on here; but, quite honestly, almost any fretless I've ever picked up with a decent setup was a blast to play. Roundwounds or flatwounds or whatever. Also, be aware to target stops right on the lines. You can't target between the lines, and that is difficult for some players. Some cats just have to have a blank board because of the visual reference issue and do not choose to adjust. If you can learn to target the lines, then that technique, will also, IMO, improve your fretted technique.

Probably TMI. Good luck with the conversion and have fun with it!

I just started playing the fretless and because my technique sucks, the F Bass AC6 already has markings on it, even though it's macassar ebony . The default stainless steel exposed core round wounds didn't help too much either. Right now I changed them to nickel Elixirs and although the setup is too high after the 12th fret, it's fine for me who is just starting out and don't need more than the first 12 frets. I do need to get some exposed core nickel flats so that the fret board doesn't get busted up before my technique gets better.

I do wonder about the lines vs no lines. The F Bass AC6 has lines on the side of the fretboard (not on the fret board itself but the edges) and dots from 12 on. I notice the dots help since as I play higher notes on the skinnier strings, there is an optical illusion and I need to adjust the position slightly to the left otherwise the notes are always a little flat. The Bacchus I am thinking of converting will have lines vs the AC6 that has no lines and someone told me that it gets confusing. I'll just have to try this.

As for overall job, I am going to ask someone to do this for me. I can hardly set up my own string height, truss rod, nut job, etc. I do need to learn how to do all this but I hate having to use up my practice time for maintenance time. The worst part of the setup is that it seems like every single maker has a different approach to the truss rod. I have a bunch of bass guitars and most truss rods act differently. Some are mild, some move a lot, some work better on the low range, some high, etc etc. This makes setting up the string height a pain. I can see this as a major problem setting up a fretless bass. And I am way too lazy to try to figure out this stuff. LOL

Anyway thanks for the information. Much appreciated. I hope this beater Bacchus will do its job when the conversion is done..

 

[BAG]

Rosewood is just fine for fretless. the open grain is warmer sounding than ebony, but it holds up very well against string wear. Proper technique and setup will help ensure a lighter touch, helping to eliminate wear.

It can depend on the piece of rosewood. The neck I bought had some serious wear and was unplayable and had only been used with flats. When the luthier started leveling it he couldn't believe how soft the rosewood board was. He epoxied it so we'll see how well it wears now.

 

[paulears]

Yep - that was my experience. The rosewood was not resilient at all. I suppose species could be important, and maybe some varieties are better than others. I liked the sound of the round wounds compared to flats, but they really dug it up - and the flats made the muddy sound much worse.

 

[Apolicious]

I have a somewhat similar (but totally different) predicament. I have an SX Ursa with a lacquered maple fretboard. Now, I've defretted two basses before, but they both had rosewood fretboards. Is there a way I can de-fret my SX without having to completely re-poly?

(and before someone says "buy a new neck," I have zero funds, but the necessary tools.)

 

[honeydorick]

Hi TBer's,I want to defret my new acoustic electric short scale Luna bass.Im already using tape wound strings ,but still hate the slight fret noise of the tapes hitting the metal frets,Any suggestions.Im looking for the upright type sound.I'm real close, but I think fretless would be closer.Is it harder to defret an acoustic bass,verses electric?Any thoughts.I have the skills,Im a modle builder/craftsman type.Any suggestions would be appreciated,Thanks