Markbass Little Mark 250 vs III, Volume/power difference.

[sideFX]

Hello everyone!

I'm debating between the above two heads, my cab is a Genz Benz Focus 115 @ 8Ω (it can handle 300W), and my main bass is a SbMM Ray34.

My initial purchase was an Aguilar Tone Hammer 350 I bought one month ago but I found it to be a bit too wooly and power lacking with my Ray34, which has a rather hot output, so I finally tuned it back.

As a matter of fact the Tone Hammer could do a decent warm, yet clean sound, with the drive at 0 and the gain about noon but at this setting it was seriously lacking power compared to a friend's Little Mark 250. By the way the Tone Hammer is 175W @ 8Ω and the Little Mark 250 is 150W @ 8Ω. I had to put the master on the TH at 1-2 o'clock for it to compete volume wise my mate's LM250 with the master at 9-10 o'clock! I was kinda shocked I should say...

On the other hand when I tried to eq the TH to compete with LM250 in terms of output, the sound I was getting was too wooly (almost overdriven) for me (gain and drive at about 1-2 o'clock) and didn't do my ray justice. I also didn't like the lack of clean highs of the Tone Hammer (and this isn't my cabs fault, the LM at the same cab had more and cleaner highs for sure), and I think this amp has way too much mids. Not a good match for a ray/stingray imho.
All tests and A/B-ing were made with the above Genz Benz Focus 115 cab @ 8Ω.

Anyway... since I liked the tone and output levels I was getting from my mate's LM250 I decided to return the TH get one Little Mark myself. Although I should say here that the LM250 seemed to compress the sound a tad at higher volumes (master at noon and above).

So, my question is will the 250 be enough in terms of power or should I go for the III? The LM250 surely was significantly louder than my tone hammer 350. I'm not planing to get another cab in the near future. Will there be a significant volume difference between the III and the 250 in my cab?
LM III: 300W @ 8Ω
LM 250: 150W @ 8Ω

Thanks!

ps. sorry for the long post, anyone who doesn't wanna read the whole thing can only read the last paragraph.

 

[smogg]

IMO, The LM 3 will give you more headroom. IME, If you are going for clean the headroom is your friend.

 

[sideFX]

yeah I'm going for clean headroom, I have pedals for my dirt when I feel the need.

My question is if there's a significant volume difference between the two with my single 115.

 

[AlexanderB]

I have no experince with your cab but with a speaker that can use the addtional power, your rig will be 3dB louder. That is clearly noticable but not a dramatic change. Please consider Fletcher Munson curve. Your average, clean volume (between peaks) can now be 3dB louder and thereby end up higher in the FM curve, sounding fuller with the same EQ setting. Beware that some 15" woofers will not respond well to as little as 50W in the low range before distorting. (Eminence Kappa 15C, for instance.)

 

[el murdoque]

i own both a LMII and a Tonehammer 500.
Initially, i bought the LMII to have some amp while waiting on the TH500 and wanted to sell it when the TH500 arrives, but i found myself unable to do so. While i absolutely love the Tonehammer's sound, the LMII offers more brilliance in the highs and super dry lowest lows, where the TH can't compete. I don't use the LMII often, but when i use it, i'm glad i have it.
When using either amp with just one 8ohms cab, i have to turn up the master quite far and i feel that the LMII shines more at 4ohms.
with 8 ohms i _nearly_ run out of headroom, there's just enough left, it's slightly out of my comfort zone but nothing to really worry.
So, i'd go for the LMII / III instead of the 250.

 

[sideFX]

Thanks everyone for the input!

@el murdoque: yeah, I had a similar feeling when I was comparing the two. Not that the TH is a bad sounding amp, it was just missing solid deep lows and crisp highs compared to the LM 250.

Any additional feedback is always welcome!

 

[sideFX]

Just an update,

I did order the LMIII after all, and it arrived 4 days ago. First thing I noticed, this thing is freaking LOUD!!! With the gain set at 2-3 o'clock, I can't put the master above 9-10 o'clock without shaking everything in the house (and in the flat above)!! TONS of power with just one 15" cab! Also the clarity on this thing is amazing, solid deep thumpy lows, nice mids, and crystal clear highs, very even across the range and warm sounding too without being wooly! Perfect match for a stingray IMHO, all in all I'm very impressed, way better then the Aguilar with my setup!

 

[Ft tq]

is the difference between lm250 and lm III just at the power? how about the tone ?

 

[sideFX]

No difference in tone between the two. Very little difference (if any) in perceived loudness.

 

[Zbysek]

i own both a LMII and a Tonehammer 500.
Initially, i bought the LMII to have some amp while waiting on the TH500 and wanted to sell it when the TH500 arrives, but i found myself unable to do so. While i absolutely love the Tonehammer's sound, the LMII offers more brilliance in the highs and super dry lowest lows, where the TH can't compete. I don't use the LMII often, but when i use it, i'm glad i have it.
When using either amp with just one 8ohms cab, i have to turn up the master quite far and i feel that the LMII shines more at 4ohms.
with 8 ohms i _nearly_ run out of headroom, there's just enough left, it's slightly out of my comfort zone but nothing to really worry.
So, i'd go for the LMII / III instead of the 250.

I had TH500 and LMIII at the same time. I liked the LMIII better... I felt that LMIII was somehow more powerfull and reliable... So I sold TH500...

 

[sideFX]

I had TH500 and LMIII at the same time. I liked the LMIII better... I felt that LMIII was somehow more powerfull and reliable... So I sold TH500...

I also had both the Aguilar TH350 and the LMIII at the same time, and ended up returning the TH350. It just could compete volume wise... Plus the lows on the LM3 are MASSIVE while the highs are present and clear, it totaly kills the TH in that regard.
The low end on the Tone Hummer is quite mushy and rather absent to be honest (the TH lacks true lows imo, it's all about the low-mids with that head) and the highs are muffled and very unclear.

 

[Zbysek]

I also had both the Aguilar TH350 and the LMIII at the same time, and ended up returning the TH350. It just could compete volume wise... Plus the lows on the LM3 are MASSIVE while the highs are present and clear, it totaly kills the TH in that regard.
The low end on the Tone Hummer is quite mushy and rather absent to be honest (the TH lacks true lows imo, it's all about the low-mids with that head) and the highs are muffled and very unclear.

Yeah, exactly. LMIII cuts through much better than TH, IMO. To be honest, I don't understand all the fuzz about TH500. In my social bubble, it seems that everybody considers TH500 to be the best amongst light-weight amps. I have not tried many of those but at least LMIII and Genz Benz Shuttle Series I prefer over Aguilar...

 

[Zbysek]

With the gain set at 2-3 o'clock,

I have never set gain on my LMIII over noon. In my view, gain at 2-3 might probably too much. With some of my basses (Musicman Sterling, in particular), the clip light goes on if I set the gain at 10-11 already. May be my bass guitar's output is stronger than yours... But, still, I would recommend that you make sure that the clip light does not go on, when you hit strings hard...

 

[sideFX]

wow, I'm embarrassed. Really.

I don't know what I was thinking when I wrote that, but I never play with the gain above 10-11 o'clock. I guess my mind was strolling somewhere else while I wrote that.

So yeah, the gain would be at 10-11 o'clock.