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Old Jazz pickups have developed thin tone

A little while ago, my '74 Jazz started sounding weird - all nasally and honky. I think it came one fairly quickly, as I only noticed it one day while getting set up for a recording. My first thought was that it was a weird placement in the room that was cancelling out frequencies, so I moved the amp around the room to no avail. I then plugged in my engineer's cheap, Chinese made Squier and BOOM! Back was the bass & low mid, and significantly higher output. So, it was my jazz that was the problem.

The lower output from my bass was suspicious, though it had always been a bit low and I was used to turning gain up fairly high to compensate It seemed to be more so than usual, however. My engineer and I decided that it could be time to remagnetise the 40-year-old pickups, and that it couldn't hurt to try. While we had the pickups out, we though it would be as good a time as any to pot them, as they had been somewhat microphonic for many years.

After potting in wax and remagnetising the pickups with a couple of rare earth magnets, we put them back in the bass and tried it again. The output was hotter, and the sound fuller, but there was still a weird accentuation in the upper mids and a huge lack of bass and lower mid heft. This bass had always had an interesting upper mid character, but it was certainly much more subtle and didn't come at the expense of serious lower end!

What I'm interested in finding out is what might have gone funny with my pickups. Most of the 'old pickup failure' stories I've heard seem to be about complete failures, i.e. no output, usually due to a broken or shorted winding. I'm perplexed as to what might have caused such a change in character. The pickups are RWRP with each other, so it shouldn't be an out-of-phase problem. Has anyone encountered this sort of thing before?

Of course, what I'd really like to know is if there's anything I can do to fix it! New pickups are of course an option (and one that I imagine that the GAS-afflicted are likely to suggest!), and the Fender 'Pure Vintage' '74 pickups present themselves, but I'd like to keep these ones going if it's at all possible. My engineer wants to experiment with rewinding pickups, so this may be his chance...

Thanks in advance for any light that you may be able to shed on this.
 
This sounds exactly like the problem I have just experienced with the neck pickup on my 63 jazz. It still had some continuity but I could not get a constant reading, with it sweeping between about 3 and 12k.
I will be getting it rewound, as apparently even if there is a break there can still be a reading along these lines. The tone from the pickup was as you describe with yours - thin and down on volume.
 
I had these symptoms but the problem was different. On my vintage 64' the bridge pickup was intermittently working/not working and also exhibited low volume and reduced bass when working, but the problem was not with the pup but the volume pot not making proper contact with the control plate... Years of sweat, smoke and general funk had caused a built up resistance between the pots and the control plate, which was their path to ground... By taking the pots out from the control plate, cleaning the plate and pots with isopropyl alcohol and replacing, the sound returned to it's former glory... I was shocked but very relived that was the problem... If your jazz electronics don't have a dedicated ground wire, it would be worth cleaning the parts and giving it a go.
 
The first thing to do is to carefully unsolder the hot lead from the volume pot and take a reading of the pickup to see if it has the standard 7 to 8 kohms steady to ground. If so, then clean the pots. If not, a coil may have opened up internally and a rewind may be in order. The same thing happened to me in 1981 on the '75 J-bass I used to own.
 
Thanks for your responses. @Pimmsley - Interesting! Certainly an unexpected source of a problem like that. Mine has a dedicated ground wire though, so unfortunately it wouldn't be that. @Tim1 & @iiipopes - glad to hear of a similar experience, I'll try to test them this week. In theory, if they are reading a consistent 7-8 kohms, the pickups themselves should be ok and there might be some problem caused by dirty pots? There's no scratchiness in them, which is what I would usually associate with pot dirt.
 
youll still get signal if theres an internal short in the pickup. itll just be thin and low output. that era of fender has a pretty high failure rate ime with pickups. the insulation breaks down and shorts out against the pole piece. both my 72p and 74j came to me with pickups that needed to be rewound. ive owned a bunch of late 70's bullet truss fender jazzes and never had any pickup failures.
 
I tested the pickups yesterday and came up with some interesting (to me) results. The bridge pickup is fine, reading 7.6KΩ. The neck pickup had no continuity (i.e. infinite resistance) according to the ohmmeter. What's strange to me then is that the neck pickup makes any sound at all - which it does! It doesn't put out dramatically less volume than the bridge pickup when soloed, just thinner tone than it should. It 'clacks' in the expected way when the strings touch the polepieces. How is this happening if there's no continuity across the windings? I was honestly expecting the bad pickup to read lower than the good one, rather than infinitely higher - but I am certainly no expert and learning as I go here. With much-appreciated help from you guys!

In any case, it's clear that the winding has broken somewhere and the pickup will need to be rewound. I don't have time to be without a bass for long, so I'll buy a replacement and hang on to the old pickup for a future rewind. I'm disappointed but not too much - I don't think that 40 years of service is bad going ;)
 
The reason you still get signal out of the neck pickup is because of inductance. The old trick of moving a magnet or something magnetic over a magnet to induce a signal in a coil, even if open ended, is what is happening here.
 
well, as i understand it the reason is capacitance, which is why you get a bit of signal but no low end; either way, that's the problem, you have a dead pickup in need of rewinding.
 
The reason you still get signal out of the neck pickup is because of inductance. The old trick of moving a magnet or something magnetic over a magnet to induce a signal in a coil, even if open ended, is what is happening here.

well, as i understand it the reason is capacitance, which is why you get a bit of signal but no low end; either way, that's the problem, you have a dead pickup in need of rewinding.

Ahhh...makes sense. Sort of. Hmmm. I definitely didn't go this far in electronics class. Generating a signal across a circuit that has no continuity is well spooky enough for me!
 
Thank you for this thread!! I've had this too with a set of very good late 80ties/early 90ties jazz bass pickups (I believe they are SD antiquity) that went bottomless and feeble all of a sudden, and never undertstood what on earth it could be.
Wait, they both went south on you? That seems unlikely.
 
Ahhh...makes sense. Sort of. Hmmm. I definitely didn't go this far in electronics class. Generating a signal across a circuit that has no continuity is well spooky enough for me!
It's the fundamental concept that Marconi, Tesla and others have applied to develop broadcast technology since the beginning of radio.
 
I have just replaced the faulty neck pup on my 63 J with the Seymour Duncan Antiquity 1 which arrived yesterday. It is an excellent match visually, tonally and volumewise. The aging matches up nicely and I am glad I took Narud's advice and got the one, not Antiquity 2, as the balance between the two pups is close to ideal.
One thing to be wary of, although it is not a problem, is that the Duncans are wired with hot and earth wires swapped in comparison to the Fender so you need to use the yellow wire as earth and the black as hot then all is sweet. Otherwise the tone is thin when both pups are on full, I suppose because it is out of phase. Narud informed me that S Duncan does this to reduce noise even further when using two of his pups together.
I will send the original off for a rewind, then probably pop it back in at some stage but I am certainly not missing it with the Duncan in place :).