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Double Bass Pre-amp suggestion please

J

jebo

Apr 25, 2009
109
10
#1
Hi,

I'm tossing around the idea of getting a pre-amp for my double bass because I'm not consistently happy with the sound I can get out of my amp in every room that I've gigged in.

I have great gear! I'm working with a 50 year old german hofner fully carved bass w/ a realist pickup into an eden WT-400 powering a bergantino AE112 1x12 cab.

I'm new to the pre-amp thing, but I think it might be necessary for my situation... I'm just not sure what is good.

Ideally, I would like something like the EBS micro bass II because it has 2 channels for easy switching on gigs where I have to double on electric bass. But the B channel on this unit seems pretty useless... and I would mind getting something more suited for an acoustic instrument.

Given the equipment that I use, can anyone suggest a pre-amp that might sound good?
 
#2
jebo said:
I'm tossing around the idea of getting a pre-amp for my double bass because I'm not consistently happy with the sound I can get out of my amp in every room that I've gigged in.
Click to expand...

No one is happy with the sound obtained by his/her rig in every room! :) Room interactions are a huge factor in the nature of amplified (and acoustic) sound. Now, you say that you are working with great gear, by which I assume you mean that you're basically happy with the components. That's important, because a pre-amp really isn't the "fix" for a poor setup (which doesn't seem to apply to you).

I'm not sure what is the input impedance of the Eden. The best I could tell, it's 500k ohms, but I could be wrong. Piezo pickups usually are at their best looking into 1 Mohm or somewhat higher.

It seems that what you need most is a good pre-amp with flexible tone-shaping. I'd recommend a parametric tone-shaping stage which it appears the EBS doesn't have. One thought would be to switch out your head for one with an optimal input impedance and better tone-shaping circuitry, rather than cascading devices in order to achieve what you want.
 
#3
drurb said:
It seems that what you need most is a good pre-amp with flexible tone-shaping. I'd recommend a parametric tone-shaping stage which it appears the EBS doesn't have. One thought would be to switch out your head for one with an optimal input impedance and better tone-shaping circuitry, rather than cascading devices in order to achieve what you want.
Click to expand...

I think the Eden 400 has 3 bands of parametric. I used an Eden WT300 for many years and it has a lot of tone shaping flexibility. It may not be everyone's cup of tea for double bass amplification, but I could get a good sound out of it, and used it in countless rooms over the years.
 
#4
the eden wt-400 has lots of tone-shaping options. though im sure it does lack in input impedance, which im sure that is the main issue. I love how this amp sounds w/ my electric basses & I have gotten desirable acoustic bass sounds out of it before... its just not consistently sounding good.

If I were to swap the head, what would you suggest? and If I were to get a pre-amp instead, what would you suggest?
 
#7
jebo said:
Hi,

I'm tossing around the idea of getting a pre-amp for my double bass because I'm not consistently happy with the sound I can get out of my amp in every room that I've gigged in.

I have great gear! I'm working with a 50 year old german hofner fully carved bass w/ a realist pickup into an eden WT-400 powering a bergantino AE112 1x12 cab.......

I'm new to the pre-amp thing, but I think it might be necessary for my situation... I'm just not sure what is good.........


Given the equipment that I use, can anyone suggest a pre-amp that might sound good?
Click to expand...

Jebo,
Eden World Tour amps sound very nice with Electric Bass ,unfortunately they aren't particularly good Double Bass Amps IMHO. The least expensive thing would to be to purchase a HPF/Buffer Pre Amp from Francis Deck

Invalid Link Removed.

Doubling really requires a separate EQ channel for each instrument. Short of buying a entirely new head you could try inserting a Headway EDB-1 into the efffects loop and using as the preamp for your Hofner DB.

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

As Les said, the EBS really isn't suited to what your trying to accomplish. If you like the Headway you David Gage (Realist) has a special cable to match the pickup with that pre amp.
 
#8
Ric Vice said:
Jebo,
Eden World Tour amps sound very nice with Electric Bass ,unfortunately they aren't particularly good Double Bass Amps IMHO. The least expensive thing would to be to purchase a HPF/Buffer Pre Amp from Francis Deck

Invalid Link Removed.

Doubling really requires a separate EQ channel for each instrument. Short of buying a entirely new head you could try inserting a Headway EDB-1 into the efffects loop and using as the preamp for your Hofner DB.

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

As Les said, the EBS really isn't suited to what your trying to accomplish. If you like the Headway you David Gage (Realist) has a special cable to match the pickup with that pre amp.
Click to expand...

thanks... but what is the advantage to placing the pre-amp in the effects loop as opposed to infront of the amp? If I'm playing a doubling gig, I think it would make more sense to put it infront of the amp so I only use it with the DB and not the EB.
 
#10
You can run the pre into the return and ONLY use it with DB. Run your electric into the main input. You may need to unplug the preamp to make it all work when you play electric but I have done that successfully with various amps.
I second your opinion on the suitability of Eden amps for electric. They are much better suited for that than DB. However, many people use them and get a nice sound. At minimum, Fdeck's HPF is a good thing to have for the increased (10meg) impedence and high pass filter. It saved me last night in a very boomy room.
 
#11
clink said:
You can run the pre into the return and ONLY use it with DB. Run your electric into the main input. You may need to unplug the preamp to make it all work when you play electric but I have done that successfully with various amps.
I second your opinion on the suitability of Eden amps for electric. They are much better suited for that than DB. However, many people use them and get a nice sound. At minimum, Fdeck's HPF is a good thing to have for the increased (10meg) impedence and high pass filter. It saved me last night in a very boomy room.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that tip! Does running it through the effect return instead of the front input change the sound you get from the amplifier at all?

looks like I'm prob going to get either a Headway EDB-1 or a D-Tar Solstice 2 depending on what I can find easier here in Toronto... In the future I might look for a dedicated double bass combo amplifier like something from GK, acoustic image, phil jones, or mark bass.

EDIT: Clink, does plugging something into the effects return of a head completely bypass its pre-amp?
 
#12
jebo said:
.......looks like I'm prob going to get either a Headway EDB-1 or a D-Tar Solstice 2 depending on what I can find easier here in Toronto... In the future I might look for a dedicated double bass combo amplifier like something from GK, acoustic image, phil jones, or mark bass.......
Click to expand...

The DTar is a great little box with two full channels of EQ. Both channels have 10 meg ohm input impedances which work great with peizo pickups like the Realist. I'm not sure how that load effects the Electric Bass. you'll need to check that out. It's also missing the high pass filter and notch filter (which I avoid like the plague).

The Headway EDB-1 has switches that change impedance loading, change the high pass filters frequency, phase shift, a variable notch filter, and a five band EQ section. Unfortunately, it only has Channel 1 and Chanel 2 Level controls. I guess there was only so many features they could pack into that little box.

Ric
 
#13
Ric Vice said:
The DTar is a great little box with two full channels of EQ. Both channels have 10 meg ohm input impedances which work great with peizo pickups like the Realist. I'm not sure how that load effects the Electric Bass. you'll need to check that out. It's also missing the high pass filter and notch filter (which I avoid like the plague).

The Headway EDB-1 has switches that change impedance loading, change the high pass filters frequency, phase shift, a variable notch filter, and a five band EQ section. Unfortunately, it only has Channel 1 and Chanel 2 Level controls. I guess there was only so many features they could pack into that little box.

Ric
Click to expand...

so you would prefer the DTar?
 
#15
If you've already got good tone-shaping, then I second the use of the Fdeck HPF/Pre. You'll only get the benefit of its 10 Mohm input impedance if you plug the pickup directly into the pre-amp.

I'm going back to your original post, however, where you expressed a lack of satisfaction with the sound in some rooms. That's usually best addressed with tone-shaping, the benefits of the fdeck unit notwithstanding.
 
#16
I played a room last night that I also played two years ago. Same bass but the first time with a Focus 2R/12" cabinet and last night with the Fdeck HPF/GK MB200/Acme B-1. I set the cabinet on a chair and set the HPF to about 100hz and just sucked it up.
This has got to be the worst sounding room I've ever been in and both experiences will hopefully be forgotten. Point? I am almost always able to get a good sound in a variety of rooms but some rooms just sound so bad the goal is to get through the gig with as little pain as possible. The little HPF has saved me several times but my next purchase will be a Headway. I want more ability to dial in my sound in more situations and it has a reputation for that. If nothing else, it has a lot of knobs and switches that must be there for a reason.:rolleyes:
 

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