Precision pickup in bridge position (compared to jazz/MM bridge pups)

[Camilo Pefaur]

Hello everybody.
I'm a mod maniac and I just decided to add a bridge pickup to my P bass.

Though Initially I thought of throwing in some jazz pups wired as a Humbucker (mainly for series/parallel options) It came to my mind the idea of throwing another Precision pup...

I've seen reviews of some BC Rich Mockingbirds with 2 P pups (normal and inverted positions) and seems to be a good idea... a bit ugly, but a good sounding one imo.

But first hand experience is totally different compared to some youtube vids so, since almost every player has had or played more than once a jazz bridge pickup equiped bass, the ones who have tried the bridge precision pup might be able to tell more details...

Or well, will be much appreciated any comment on whatever bridge pickup might make a good match for the Precision pup.

I appreciate all of your opinions in advance.

 

[gfen]

I own two, a Mockingbird and a Fender Blacktop Jazz. In both cases each pickup as placed in the "traditional" EA forward position.

If you solo the bridge pickup, you can definatly notice the difference in the coil positions, but turn 'em both on and it becomes just a monster heavy sound. The DG coil is as thin as a soloed Jazz, the EA not quite as bad, but its when you use the bridge P for colouring the neck that it shines, or, well both for a thunderous wall of tone.

Lots of people swear by reversed P, if I were going to do a P/P I'd want them both reversed not one of each.

 

[NKBassman]

I own two, a Mockingbird and a Fender Blacktop Jazz. In both cases each pickup as placed in the "traditional" EA forward position.

If you solo the bridge pickup, you can definatly notice the difference in the coil positions, but turn 'em both on and it becomes just a monster heavy sound. The DG coil is as thin as a soloed Jazz, the EA not quite as bad, but its when you use the bridge P for colouring the neck that it shines, or, well both for a thunderous wall of tone.

Lots of people swear by reversed P, if I were going to do a P/P I'd want them both reversed not one of each.

What he said.

I actually prefer PP to standard Jazz, it's a much thicker tone. The DG coil being so close to the bridge is my only gripe.

 

[Camilo Pefaur]

I own two, a Mockingbird and a Fender Blacktop Jazz. In both cases each pickup as placed in the "traditional" EA forward position.

If you solo the bridge pickup, you can definatly notice the difference in the coil positions, but turn 'em both on and it becomes just a monster heavy sound. The DG coil is as thin as a soloed Jazz, the EA not quite as bad, but its when you use the bridge P for colouring the neck that it shines, or, well both for a thunderous wall of tone.

Lots of people swear by reversed P, if I were going to do a P/P I'd want them both reversed not one of each.

First, thank you guys for your replies. I've decided to put a Presicion in the bridge.

gfen, what's your experience with the presicion pup switched? Does it thins out too much the EA strings? Do they gain deffinition? Do the GD strings become useful? lol, that's a joke... but you get the idea I think...

Now, as I was thinking of reversing both pickups, I've read only good things about it, but my doubt comes here: Should I simply "switch" the positions of the now "neck" coils or would it be better if I only move the GD coil in front of the AE (and keeping the AE coil position intact)...

I think I'd be extremely lucky if There's somebody here that has actually heard or played a bass like that... I just seems so intriguing that I think I might do that anyway...

Well, thanks in advance!

 

[gfen]

gfen, what's your experience with the presicion pup switched? Does it thins out too much the EA strings? Do they gain deffinition? Do the GD strings become useful? lol, that's a joke... but you get the idea I think...

I may not have gotten my point across clearly, and I apologize for the confusion.

On both my examples, both the bridge and neck are in "regular" P position (EA ahead of DG).
I have no tried a reverse bridge and normal neck version, it strikes me that two halfs of each pickup will be too close to matter (depending on which position you chose to invert).
I would actually try a double reverse (both bridge and neck with DG ahead of EA), but I have not.

When I look at basses like the G&L 2000 I think their design of two soapbar humbuckers (but not offset coils!) might be the ideal position, or in the case of my BTJ the "middle point" where the coils split seems to be the best one, and I wish the pickups could be centered down that (but still sound like thick split Ps). But, when you turn them both up (or favour the neck), you don't really notice the thinness.

I've been pursing the option for pickup replacements a pupgrade* to beef up the stock MIMs and have been looking closely at the mid-heavy Dimarzio Will Power for the bridge to make up for it.

Since you've already got the P in position, I'd route for the second P normally and run with it. If you like it, save the reverse P/P for your next platform.

There's also quite a few P/P threads on this forum with people who've got all sorts of variations.

Edit: Before I forget, for what it's worth, I've measured both pickups in both examples of my bass and unlike in a traditional PJ setup with a higher output Jazz, both of my pickups measure the exact same with regards to resistance. I'd probably start by matching the same thing you've got in your bridge to your neck, as that seems to be the factory suggested method.

* - I got your back on this, mmbongo.

 

[Camilo Pefaur]

Nice! Didn't find any info previously in the forum about P/P configs, but now I know I'll have to search better.

This idea of not moving backwards the EA coil but moving in front of it the DC coil is gaining a lot of followers among the little men working in my brain... maybe I'll only do that by now... or maybe... I'll just go look for those P/P forums and in case your interested I'll let you know the results of my Frankenstein syndrome.

 

[NKBassman]

Yes, please do let us know what you end up doing.

 

[Rip Topaz]

Following this cuz I've got a MIM P that I've been fighting with since I bought it two years ago.

Debating adding a second pickup, since adding a preamp really didn't give me what I was after.

Just need a ballsier P-bass.

 

[gfen]

Nice! Didn't find any info previously in the forum about P/P configs, but now I know I'll have to search better

They key is to use Google, not the search bar. IE, like this: "dual p" site:talkbass.com

Here's some handy ones:
"p/p" site:talkbass.com - Google Search
"dual p" site:talkbass.com - Google Search

 

[Badwater]

If you have a Alnico passive P pickup, try to get a ceramic J pickup with matching output. And mount the J pickup 2.5" from the bridge saddle on the G string. This will give you a lot of tone options. When time for pickup height adjustment, start with the J pickup and then use the multiple adjustments on the P pickup. For wiring, use the same value pots 250k, and do a Master Volume, Master Tone, and 3 way selector switch (J, both, P).

 

[Camilo Pefaur]

Following this cuz I've got a MIM P that I've been fighting with since I bought it two years ago.

Debating adding a second pickup, since adding a preamp really didn't give me what I was after.

Just need a ballsier P-bass.

Well, I did it and tested it in every environment possible and, not only I'm fascinated with the change but, I'm also filled with more questions than answers.

It ended up being a double reversed Presicion pickup set.

Is a precision pup better than a J on bridge position?
YES.
Bigger, meaner, louder, no poopy 60 cycle hum... It's the kind of things that make you wonder why isn't THIS the standard yet.

About it's interaction with the other precision pup:
First, you should be in knowledge of the pickups useg: Neck is a Wilkinson, the cheapest. Probably ceramic though were sold as alnico. Sounds like a hot/modern P pup. I play from Jazz to Rock and sounds incredible with 250k volume pot and 500k tone pot with... The cap is 0.33 I guess... Doesn't do much, but that's good for me, since I use it only to get rid of the nasty highs when needed according to the amp used.

The bridge Ppup was taken from a very very old P. Vintage style but high output. Probably some crappy alnico precision pup from the 80s that happens to sound awesome.
Gnarly... Thats how it sounds. Bass? There's bass on a bridge pup. Nasal? Yeah, but bassier too, so it's actually pleasant.
Note that I don't like Jazz pickups. I love the bridge precision pup.

The classic jazz wiring is not as easy as expected. The scoop is heavy. Bass is very heavy. Almost muddy. Depending on the style you want it may be your thing. I got my pups a bit far from the strings and I played with it as an eq'd scoop. Never decided which altitude was better. But i enjoyed every second of that day...

Then I wanted a neck tone knob. The bridge was all right, but the neck precision reacted too scratchy with some amps and PA's.

And I'm stuck on finding a good vvtt diagram.

Overall, do you want a precision sound where you can add mid definition without loosing output? This is the way
Do you want a Jaco sound with bass and no noise? Again, this is the way.
Do you want to try a new dimension to scooped mids? You should try this at some point.

 

[Camilo Pefaur]

I should add, I'm a precision lover. I'm also a 5th string lover. Not a five string, a 5th string lover. I play 4 string basses and stringwise they're like this: 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th string.

For the 5th string, definition is vital. Precision pups are great with 5ths. The added definition of the bridge pup is miraculous.

So good that I'm now on a reversed P MM bass... Deciding on the position and wiring, as I want it passive.

 

[gfen]

Note that I don't like Jazz pickups. I love the bridge precision pup.

Same; I don't care for the Jazz pickup sound.

People say that two tone knobs interact with each other in the same passive circuit, and it will default to the lower value. I don't know enough to argue against this. On my P/P basses, I either just turn the volume down on the neck-side pickup which gives it a clangy sort of pleasant sound (to me) or, in the other case, I built it into a two-output bass. I run them into two signal chains for versatility then bring it together with a Boss LS2 and send to a single amp.

In that case, I generally have both volumes on full.

 

[Camilo Pefaur]

Same; I don't care for the Jazz pickup sound.

People say that two tone knobs interact with each other in the same passive circuit, and it will default to the lower value. I don't know enough to argue against this. On my P/P basses, I either just turn the volume down on the neck-side pickup which gives it a clangy sort of pleasant sound (to me) or, in the other case, I built it into a two-output bass. I run them into two signal chains for versatility then bring it together with a Boss LS2 and send to a single amp.

In that case, I generally have both volumes on full.

Wow... I thought Billy Sheehan was the only human who went that direction.

Now, definitely better the reversed precision. I simply moved the "high" coil up front the "low" one. The thinner strings don't sound like they come from a different bass. They don't loose anything but certainly gain in oomph... And they make you think that you're still playing the same bass, the same precision bass.