Providing Your Amp as the Backline for a Gig

[jmattbassplaya]

Well it's definitely a red flag that your guitarist would barely acknowledge it with you or divulge the conversation to you. It may sound like high school, but damn if it ain't true: He is supposed to be on your team.

It should have been: "I don't know, let me talk to him about it and I will get back to you. By the way, can I have the contact info for the other bass players who would be using his amp so he can talk to them?"

You paid for your gear, probably worked hard to get that cash you had to fork over. Don't be shy about looking after it. If your places were swapped and you did it to him, you can be sure you'd hear about how guitar amps are this or that and some random guy playing it could turn out badly.

And you're right - it's bush league to ask someone you don't know to provide their amp for everyone to use. It's something that has to be offered by the owner. And appreciated by everyone else. Not some assumed load of B.S.!

This isn`t the first time my guitarist has done something like this. He already offered another band to use my rig without permission once and the whole situation just turned out ugly. I would go into more details, but you can find the thread about it elsewhere in Band Management And yes, I worked a long time to earn the money for my rig so I am pretty protective of it.

Here's what I would do. I would ask for a fee. For twelve hours, $400 sounds good to me.
I'd also ask for a deposit. Enough to cover the entire rig and a half.
I'd give them very specific instructions on how to treat my gear. They would be written and attached to the rig in a way that you couldn't even plug your bass in without having to see them.
I'd speak with everyone scheduled to use my rig, and tell them what they are and are not allowed to do.
I would not allow anyone to use my rig without speaking with me some time beforehand.
I'd check in periodically to make sure all the knobs are in acceptable positions. If they're not, money is coming out of that deposit and going into my pocket.
When it's all done, I would take it straight to a tech. He would make sure that it's in 100% great and perfect condition. And if it's not, the deposit pays to make it better. If it straight out doesn't work, the deposit is mine, all of it.
Then, once I've made sure I've got my rig at 100%, they get the deposit back.

And if they agree to all that, why not? There's nothing to lose as long as you protect yourself adequately. If it's a well run charity, they're going to do their best to protect their deposit and make sure that everyone treats your stuff real nice. And I just pocketed a nice $400 rental fee. That's worth a bit of trouble for me.

Seems like a bit too much for me, but I like the idea!

I'm sure the bass players of the other bands will have their own amps too and if they are serious would prefer to use their own.

This was my thought as well. On top of that, there was no mention of a backline for the guitars so I`m just curious what`s going on with them. I guess if every band was contributing something I could take it into consideration more, but if all the guitarists are using their own rig then I don`t see why we can`t do the same for the bassists.

 

[otis_thick]

Unless you are in the sound rental business....NO! And tell the guitarist...."Please don't ever ask me again" or "Let me borrow your wife/girlfriend or boyfriend (if that's your thing) for the weekend.... I promise I wont break them!" Really, most sound rental places have some sort of backline that they don't mind donating to a charity event. They may want you to pick up and deliver plus sec. deposit or some music stores may loan thier floor models. You spent a long time getting your rig the way you want. I have seen it many times when someone offered thier rig as back line and it was used just loud enough to start the voice coil to melt but not fry it and when the owner went to play it again...there is that mystery buzz! I was playing through a guys brand new SWR-2cab rig and I was making shure I was not driving the low end too hard, My on-board pre has a plus/minus @20hz along with bass boost...I did not want to adjust his EQ. so I dis-engaged it. As I was playing, I heard an unwanted "flap" and backed my lows off even more...the owner came on stage to turn up the amp while I was playing and I told him what I heard ... but he insisted on turning me back up...it did not make it through the whole song-both cabs toasted and he was still to play another set-to a packed house. He ended up using the house port-a-flex...I felt bad but I tried to warn him.
I now am warning YOU!

 

[Gus Borden]

I thought that was you, jmattbassplayer! There has got to be other folks to play with in Tennessee, bro!

Yea, I hear you. I worked a long time, spent a long time going through what I didn't want learning what I wanted, waited a long time for the components to fall into place myself - I am protective as h@!! of my gear, too.

In the past (not with my current rig), I've set up a few benefits and been part of a few more - I have happily let my rig stand in as the backline - but then I knew all the bass players who would be playing those shows well enough to trust them. Yea, tell him no thanks!

Or you could do this... tell the other 4 bass players you'll be collecting a "rental fee" of $15 from each of them. Show up with this:http://pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/Live-Wire-Solutions-PDI-Double-Shielded-Heavy-Duty-Passive-Direct-Box?sku=150439 and the can all go through the PA. You walk away with a free DI box and a cool $20 for yourself! What can they say? You provided the backline. Heh.

 

[JohnMCA72]

Seems like a bit too much for me, but I like the idea!

The reason for charging an "exorbitant" rental fee is that you really want to very strongly discourage the whole thing. Make the rental & deposit high enough that they'll say, "No, thanks!" & go ruin some other poor sucker's gear.

 

[krafty]

Deposits, rental agreements, etc. are in the realm of the companies who provide such services professionally. Even with a well thought-out agreement you'll probably end up in at least small-claims court if something goes wrong. Besides, if they can't pony up cash to rent equipment, where are they going to get 1.5x the value of your gear for a deposit, anyway?

It's a huge can of worms... or a simple, one-word answer: No.

 

[jaywa]

Playing benefit events sucks, period.

It would take a whole lot of sweet-talking to get me ever to participate in another benefit event again. Whether playing, providing gear, anything. Had enough of em, don't do em anymore.

 

[Phalex]

I've done it before with no qualms or problems.

When we do a charity thing with other bands, odds are I know the bass players in the other bands. We did a toys for tots event 2 Christmas' ago and everybody used my amp all day long. No problems. Last year it was my buddy Jim's rig we all used. Again, no problems.

It all depends on your comfort level. If you know the guys and trust them with your stuff, do it. If it's a bunch of kids you've never met, tell them to rent a backline.

 

[trowaclown]

I frequently tell my friends no when they want to borrow basses and various pieces of electronic equipment. It gets easier every time

Oh yeah. Just some practice, and soon you'll be mastering the poker face response, with a little annoyance mixed in for good measure.

 

[TRCat]

Unless you are in the sound rental business....NO! And tell the guitarist...."Please don't ever ask me again" or "Let me borrow your wife/girlfriend or boyfriend (if that's your thing) for the weekend.... I promise I wont break them!" Really, most sound rental places have some sort of backline that they don't mind donating to a charity event. They may want you to pick up and deliver plus sec. deposit or some music stores may loan thier floor models. You spent a long time getting your rig the way you want. I have seen it many times when someone offered thier rig as back line and it was used just loud enough to start the voice coil to melt but not fry it and when the owner went to play it again...there is that mystery buzz! I was playing through a guys brand new SWR-2cab rig and I was making shure I was not driving the low end too hard, My on-board pre has a plus/minus @20hz along with bass boost...I did not want to adjust his EQ. so I dis-engaged it. As I was playing, I heard an unwanted "flap" and backed my lows off even more...the owner came on stage to turn up the amp while I was playing and I told him what I heard ... but he insisted on turning me back up...it did not make it through the whole song-both cabs toasted and he was still to play another set-to a packed house. He ended up using the house port-a-flex...I felt bad but I tried to warn him.
I now am warning YOU!

Otis, My Man! I was thinking the same thing - I don't rent out or allow anyone to borrow my wife so therefore....! One word, two letters....do the math!

 

[PastorofMuppets]

use GC for overpriced "rental"

buy something you do not intend to keep and return it after the gig.

 

[pasta4lnch]

MAYBE if I knew the other bands . . .and even then, I'd do anything to get outta it!. Personally I wouldn't want to use someone else's rig, and I'm sure not letting a stranger use/ruin my rig!

 

[jmattbassplaya]

Yeah, I only know one other band on the bill as us and while I trust that guy with my stuff, it's the other guys I don't know or trust. Plus, this is a college town and they are all likely college kids...

 

[doctorpunch]

I've loaned out my rig plenty of times with no problem. I played a show with 5 other bands and I just said to every bassist "You break anything, you pay for it." and it was done. Granted, I was friends with 2 of the other 4 bassists so It was only 2 dudes that were iffy.

I'll tell you this, I was compensated with about $70 of free booze and $15 from the promoter for being a good sport.

 

[Drucifer]

Everyone who's suggesting a DI, that's a good idea, but how do you get stage volume? Don't you need something so you can hear yourself and the rest of the band can hear you? Maybe you bring your practice amp instead of your main rig for that.

 

[doctorpunch]

Stage monitors?

 

[ForSix]

Tell them that they can get a better deal from a professional sound rental company.

 

[Flatty Banks]

NO!

 

[Rick Auricchio]

I played a show with 5 other bands and I just said to every bassist "You break anything, you pay for it." and it was done. Granted, I was friends with 2 of the other 4 bassists so It was only 2 dudes that were iffy.

Even when someone agrees to pay for breakage, it may be impossible to collect anything. If you know all the players, it helps considerably.

So the answer is either a simple "no," or there must be a formal equipment rental agreement with the promoter. At a minimum, the agreement states a rental fee and a damage deposit, and perhaps a cartage fee for hauling it.

And you should be sure the signer is the right person to sign. It does no good to have some random member of the Garden Club sign an agreement if he/she doesn't have the authority to spend money!

 

[Burlington]

Never.

 

[lonote]

Let's see, you have everything to lose and nothing to gain and the others have nothing to lose and everything to gain. Don't even think about lending your gear at an event like this. By the way, I'd be willing to bet that the charity is paying everybody involved...except the bands.