Recording to your PC and latency.

[sean_on_bass]

Alot of good info here for those like myself that are a bit ignorant on recording gear.

So i am planning to start buying some recording gear after i get myself a new laptop that can handle doing the work for me. I'll be honest, anytime i try to record on a system with any noticeable latency it annoys the hell out of me and i can't seem to get the groove right. I also hate the idea of having to nudge a track to get it "in time."

Strangely enough i used to have an Sound Blaster card in my PC with an audio in that seemed to have no latency whatsoever, maybe because it was directly plugged into the mother board. This was MANY years ago. Lately i've been to a buddies house who has a focusrite, and the latency drove me nuts when trying to record a bassline. Maybe he just didn't have settings dialed in right to avoid it, as he really doesn't do any audio recording with the unit. We had to do along of nudging to get it right.

With the setups of today, what is the best way to get minimal latency when recording to a laptop? Will USB 3.0 get me there or close enough to not want to pull my hair out? Or is there a better option? Does latency compensation actually work if i can find a way to remove latency from the monitoring piece?

 

[Frank Tuesday]

I've never had a problem with latency while tracking or overdubbing. DAWs will automatically adjust for latency, do you shouldn't need to nudge to get things aligned. For overdubs, monitor from your input signal and not from the DAW record channel.

The only time latency is a problem is recording Midi from a keyboard or drum pads. Then I use the lowest latency available.

 

[craigie]

I've never had a problem with latency while tracking or overdubbing. DAWs will automatically adjust for latency, do you shouldn't need to nudge to get things aligned. For overdubs, monitor from your input signal and not from the DAW record channel.

The only time latency is a problem is recording Midi from a keyboard or drum pads. Then I use the lowest latency available.

I recently experienced this trying to record midi keyboard parts and it drove me crazy! I had to take off the headphones and record the part and listen back to it after.

As said above, get an interface with a direct monitor. Your daw plays the track and you hear your guitar in real time as you hear what the saw is playing. There is a latency on your input but the daw knows what it is and compensates. Now if you want to hear plugins like effects while you’re recording then too bad.

Not sure if the OP has a daw...
I use cubase and like it. Any free ones to suggest?

 

[Frank Tuesday]

I recently experienced this trying to record midi keyboard parts and it drove me crazy! I had to take off the headphones and record the part and listen back to it after.

As said above, get an interface with a direct monitor. Your daw plays the track and you hear your guitar in real time as you hear what the saw is playing. There is a latency on your input but the daw knows what it is and compensates. Now if you want to hear plugins like effects while you’re recording then too bad.

Not sure if the OP has a daw...
I use cubase and like it. Any free ones to suggest?

One thing to do with Midi is get a cheap module. Plug the keyboard USB into the computer, and the Midi din cable into the module. Then you can monitor from the module. Even if it isn't the sound you'll be using in the final mix, you can at least monitor your performance without latency.

I use Reaper. I haven't tried any others.

 

[craigie]

One thing to do with Midi is get a cheap module. Plug the keyboard USB into the computer, and the Midi din cable into the module. Then you can monitor from the module. Even if it isn't the sound you'll be using in the final mix, you can at least monitor your performance without latency.

I use Reaper. I haven't tried any others.

Do you do that with a midi controller? My Kontact s49 has no internal sounds so I don’t see how it can be direct monitored.

It didn’t do it at first I believe, so I think it’s a buffering issue haven’t tested that yet though.

 

[Frank Tuesday]

Do you do that with a midi controller? My Kontact s49 has no internal sounds so I don’t see how it can be direct monitored.

It didn’t do it at first I believe, so I think it’s a buffering issue haven’t tested that yet though.

Take two separate outputs from your keyboard. The USB connects to your computer, and you can record live Midi cc. Then connect the 5-pin Midi out to a EMU Proformance or some other sound module (<$100 used). You aren't actually recording the sound from the module, but you can use it to live monitor your performance with zero latency. When you play back your recording, you use the recorded Midi cc as a source for whatever virtual instrument or soft synth you are using.

 

[craigie]

Take two separate outputs from your keyboard. The USB connects to your computer, and you can record live Midi cc. Then connect the 5-pin Midi out to a EMU Proformance or some other sound module (<$100 used). You aren't actually recording the sound from the module, but you can use it to live monitor your performance with zero latency. When you play back your recording, you use the recorded Midi cc as a source for whatever virtual instrument or soft synth you are using.

Except my keyboard has no internal sounds. It just sends midi cc to my daw which turns it into sound. In order to direct monitor it would have to go keyboard-> daw -> keyboard-> interface. This is the same reason there is no headphone jack on it.

I bought it at huge discount hoping the Komplete sound library would be fantastic. So far the jury is still out.

 

[sigterm]

I have had fantastic results using my Behringer UMC404HD into Reaper. Whether I'm using the interface's monitor output for zero latency, or playing with very low latency while using DAW live effects. The Behringer has captured my bass very accurately. I'm a believer. Especially for the budget.

I have this same unit and it's great and serves many purposes. My only complaint is that the driver is always trying to phone home to an ip address in China.

 

[Frank Tuesday]

Except my keyboard has no internal sounds. It just sends midi cc to my daw which turns it into sound. In order to direct monitor it would have to go keyboard-> daw -> keyboard-> interface. This is the same reason there is no headphone jack on it.

I bought it at huge discount hoping the Komplete sound library would be fantastic. So far the jury is still out.

You need an external sound module (seperate from the computer) to use this method. You send the same Midi signal from your keyboard to two different devices simultaneously. One signal goes to your computer to record Midi cc, the second signal goes to a sound module to give you a sound to use for live monitoring. It is not the same sound that will be used in your track. It's just a zero-latency sound so you can listen to the notes you're playing.

 

[Samboat]

What I do with my Behringer UCA222 is I record thru OBS Studio (this gives me a video) but I can then strip the audio from the video if I want to have audio only. OBS lets you add in multiple audio sources and also has a desktop audio feature where if you're playing a song on your desktop you can choose for it to be in the recording or not, but you will still here it as you play.

There can be some latency issues recording from hearing the audio on your computer because it records and plays the music at the same time which you then play along to. I play through my amp the music I'm playing along to and listen to it from the amp then when it records there are no issues with Latency

 

[sean_on_bass]

I've never had a problem with latency while tracking or overdubbing. DAWs will automatically adjust for latency, do you shouldn't need to nudge to get things aligned. For overdubs, monitor from your input signal and not from the DAW record channel.

The only time latency is a problem is recording Midi from a keyboard or drum pads. Then I use the lowest latency available.

Makes sense. Use latency compensation but with direct monitor while you actually do the recording.

 

[DigitalMan]

Yep, I've had that installed, and when it's set there is no latency, but I cannot play music from my PC while using those drivers. It's almost like the Windows Exclusive mode.

I wouldn’t recommend playing music from a different program while tracking into a DAW. I would import the music track into the DAW first, and then record the bass track while listening to the track playback from the DAW.

 

[DuckSoup]

I have and use the Behringer U-phoria UMC202HD (192KHz) audio interface into my desktop. It has Zero latency problems. You can record straight off of it or you can push in the "direct monitor" button and anything you play will sync perfectly with what you are listening to. We used to call this "sound on sound" with those old tape machines. It works perfectly if you want to play and sing at the same time. If you want to have others in your "studio" then their 404HD at twice the price is great. If you will only be doing the singing and instruments yourself, no need for the 404HD, just get the 202HD. After you record the melody and an instrument track, you can go back and cut more tracks with other instruments and vocals on it.

I also used it for a while to hook up to an internet service that would let you play in real-time with others. That actually worked pretty well. You usually have to go in and adjust the latency on it to play with 2 or more people but it still works just fine. You adjust the latency with a dialogue box on your 'puter. Stopped using it for that because the guitarist who used a different interface just couldn't get his to hook up with the service. I could play with the drums, but not the guitarist.

I thought my original UMC202 (not HD) had died last year when I was having sound problems on my desktop computer. A newer and better version (192KHZ instead of 96KHz) was available for less than 1/2 the price I paid for the first one. And of course the first one didn't end up being the problem. So I finally tracked down the problem and have the old one set aside to give to our guitar player. Current price on Amazon on the UMC U-phoria 202HD that I use is $59.99 - BUY IT!

So I have a question then. I noticed there are Outputs on the back of the unit. So can I plug my PC via USB to the unit (To supply the music or backing track) Plug my bass to the DAW, Plug in my headphones to the DAW, while using the outputs to go to my Nikon camera, will that allow me to record the audio and video to my Nikon?

 

[Rip Van Dan]

Yes it should. Anything you can hook up to it with the outputs will put send a signal to the device just as if it was a set of speakers. But I don't believe it will send anything to your Nikon but the actual output of whatever you have plugged into the two jacks. I'm not sure because I've never tried that.

When I record, I have my bass and mic plugged into the audio interface, have the direct monitor button engaged if I am playing along with a previous recording, and the tracks are output to my DAW inside the computer. Then after finalizing my mix with all the adjustments I'm going to do, I save it as file and then convert it to whatever format I need.

I would presume it would only send the two signals without the all other tracks or sound source that you can hear with the direct monitor engaged because that direct monitor is only going to the headphones. That direct monitor button sends the sound to the headphones jack so you can play along with previous tracks and sync your two new tracks to the mix. The mix resides on the computer, not in the audio interface.

You may be able to take a line out of the headphones jack once you have your mix where you want it, but you wouldn't be able to tweak a live signal you are adding to the mix because that headphone output is stereo so everything that comes out of it will be stereo (2-tracks) and you can only adjust those two tracks and not anything that goes into them. Basically they are already mixed down so you have few options at that point.

If you give it a try with your Nikon, let us know how it went.

 

[Karlson541]

Get a sound interface with a direct monitoring feature and you wont have to worry about latency.