Would you pay for a Ric that has been through a chipper? Why not? You'd still be getting a Ric. My point was that the name doesn't make the item, the item makes the name. Reputation will only take you so far, especially if quality is suffering. And, it seems that's what's going around. I could be very wrong. They could put out 1000 good ones for every bad one. But lately, it doesn't seem that way.
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Ric 4003 NBD Letdown
- Thread starter Pbass4003
- Start date
Would you pay for a Ric that has been through a chipper? Why not? You'd still be getting a Ric. My point was that the name doesn't make the item, the item makes the name. Reputation will only take you so far, especially if quality is suffering. And, it seems that's what's going around. I could be very wrong. They could put out 1000 good ones for every bad one. But lately, it doesn't seem that way.
Do you ever wonder what the ratio is between happy Ric owners who received a great trouble-free bass and those who didn't?
We usually hear about the problem basses. I'd say we don't hear about thousands upon thousands who have gotten a great Ric over the years.
Hardly fair to use TB complaint threads as a barometer.
I'm not talking about back in the day. I'm referring to current production. When many people are consistently complaining about the same problem on brand new basses, it's not a one-time thing. It's a factory issue. Tells me they aren't paying attention to detail. That's how the downfall begins.
I've asked this question before, no one could answer it sufficiently, but maybe you can.
Do you have some imperical data to prove your suggestion that Ric QC was once significantly better than it is today? Because, IME, in addition to the dozens of great Rics I've played from every era, I've also played some less-than-perfect specimens from every era that Ric has been in production.
Not trying to be a smartass, but people make these assertions and it would be nice to have them substantiated. Please enlighten us as to how you came to the conclusion these QC issues are only "current production" as opposed to "back in the day."
Thank you.
PS--And while you're at it, perhaps you can elaborate on this "downfall" of which you speak. Ric's backlog and business model are well-known, and they appear to have been using this business model succesfully for decades and into the forseeable future. But please feel free to tell me when and how the "downfall" will begin. Thanks again.
Wow. Condescending much?
I never said they were on their way out. I did say that when companies stop focusing on what got them there is when they will begin the backslide. I was generalizing. How can a company stay successful if they are producing flawed products? Lower quality>drop in reputation>decreased sales>less demand>production cutbacks>company sinks.
Life is all about appearance. Ric appears to focus on fixing their flubs, rather than actually preventing them. Prevention is much more cost efficient. If they didn't have to make 3 to get 1, maybe they could roll back the price.
Tell you what. I'm going to contact Ric and ask them for yearly details on how many basses they've produced and how many they've had returned over the past 40 years. Anyone think they'll respond?
You used the word "downfall," which is why I have it in quotes. I think most would agree "downfall" is synonomous with "on their way out."
That is the question indeed. And you have just described dozens of musical instrument manufacturers, all of which have a margin of error they are willing to accept, all of which are thriving and doing a healthy business.
That's the big picture. Fortunately for us, the consumers, you don't have to accept a less-than-perfect Ric. There are many features in place, both at the retailer and factory level, to ensure that if you really have your heart set on getting a great Ric, you will be able to do it. Usually the first shot. Sometimes it may take extra effort. But if you have your heart set on it, it's a small price to pay for perfection IMHO.
Now if you're on the fence to begin with, prone to buyer's remorse, skittish about new things, etc., it's a perfect opportunity to return the item, distance yourself from the brand, and come bash it on the internet.
I suppose if their bottom line was in danger, they'd change something. But I doubt that is the case. Rickenbacker seems to be not only floating, but sailing along rather nicely.
Brother, don't get me wrong. I am completely indifferent towards Rics. Don't care one way or the other. But, over the past couple of years, it seems that a lot of people have to do an awful lot just to get what they paid for - a flawless, mint condition item, not something that's good enough. I am just an outsider looking in. But, most of us are just that. If I can see this, don't you think other bassists can, too? There's already rumblings of Ric quality dropoff among bass/guitar websites. Apparently, I'm not the only one who has noticed.
Yes, it is noticeable. I will give you that. Appearances caused by complaints on the internet could give one the the impression that every other Ric sold is flawed.
Only the truly thoughtful will consider the source and put it in perspective.
Must jump in- yes, you do hear complaints on the internet, especially here on TB. But, as an owner of 9 Rics myself, spanning from late 70's, mid 80's, late 90's, as well asmore recent, including 2012, NONE of my instruments had or have any defects. And, from talking to dozens of other happy Ric owners, with even more Rics than myself, the same can be said. I'd venture to guess 99.9% of happy Ric owners don't come on the internet to sing the praises of thier Ric, but rather, they play them. Then, you get a handful of young, inexperienced first time Ric owners who spot a problem. Maybe it's a real problem, maybe it isn't. But here they come, spouting hate. If this is how you judge a company's product, I'd call it short-sighted and unreliable.
It amazes me that we see these threads over and over again. People don't comment as much on a bad Fender bass they might get, they just send it back for a replacement. I don't really think Ric has any more construction problems than Fender, but they make a lot less instruments and they're more iconic.
Really?
Really. Different strokes for different folks. What's right for me may not be right for someone else, and vice versa. My point in all of those posts was that it seems their quality is slipping. Even if it isn't, the appearance is there, and that's really what matters.
I am one of the 99% I love my rick it arrived from wildwood set up and ready to play. I can't say how easy or hard the set ups are because since it arrived in August I have not had to adjust it even though I have been tweaking some of my other basses lately. I will say that it did develop one small problem but wildwood or RIC QC would not have caught this. After I had it for about a month and a half I noticed a rattle on the A string. The saddle was loose but I didn't come on here and gripe about it I'm pretty handy so I fixed it. I am still very happy with my purchase and will be a RIC customer in the future.
IIRC, the plaintiffs for a lack of quality on RIC's part have all bought their instruments (sometimes multiple times) from big box music retailers such as MusiciansFriendMart® and zZoundsMart®; perhaps this tells us something?
Ric, Fender and latterly Lakland and Sadowsky are big names. Industry standards. We see them on TV, our favorite players play them in the main. I guess some of us (me included) see these "perfect" basses and get disappointed if we buy one that is less than such. I.e. less than perfect action, neck out of alignment, a finish issue, etc... (Note that these observations can be wildly subjective).
Thing is, these instruments are wood, paint, electronics and metal. Built and shipped within a nation of different climates, etc...
I'd bet good money that all can have at least some very minor flaws based on the beholder.
I picked on these names above because I have owned all and non were squeaky clean, pristine perfect. All were bloody good basses though.
As I get older, I can put any flaws into perspective. I couldn't when I was younger and money was much tighter. Also as I got experienced, I began to understand that many issues were perfectly resolvable. The same issues that would have freaked me out when younger...
No one is wrong here.
Thing is, these instruments are wood, paint, electronics and metal. Built and shipped within a nation of different climates, etc...
I'd bet good money that all can have at least some very minor flaws based on the beholder.
I picked on these names above because I have owned all and non were squeaky clean, pristine perfect. All were bloody good basses though.
As I get older, I can put any flaws into perspective. I couldn't when I was younger and money was much tighter. Also as I got experienced, I began to understand that many issues were perfectly resolvable. The same issues that would have freaked me out when younger...
No one is wrong here.
No, you wouldn't.
Exactly. Rickenbacker has been making basses the same way for a long time. There QC isn't any better or worse now. That's not speaking to their quality in general, just saying it's the same now as it ever was.
I firmly believe this. I think these retailers just recycle them until someone accepts it. Worst case scenario is the bass gets shipped back. Best case is they get rid of a crap bass. They have nothing to lose.
My Ric from Wildwood is as close to perfect as I've ever seen a Ric.
If Rics were $799, there may some greater tolerance for some of these issues. The one I got had a broken saddle from the get-go. While there are plenty of people who get good ones and don't start threads raving about them, there are also people (like me) who also got one with a defect that didn't start a thread to gripe. The point is that Ric fans shouldn't automatically chalk up the QC issues to a vocal minority of those who post on TB to complain.
