Should I replace MEC with Duncan?

[Evan Skopp]

Even, those original Basslines pickups, the ones that had the DIP switches on them.. those were AMAZING pickups! I built a PJ bass for someone, and they raved about the tone.

I know that model isn't made anymore, but do any of the current Bassline pickups get a similar tone.

Click here for more information on the dip switches. We replaced the old "Active EQ" pickups with our new "Pro Active" P and J series. They take the most popular dipswitch positions and "hard wire" them. (The truth is, most players couldn't figure out how to use the dip switches and it created more questions than solutions -- so we took the guesswork out of it).

I hope that helps.

 

[bannedwit]

I've owned 6 Warwicks and the only ones that had a "growl" to them were my Thumb Bolt-Ons. I had a 5-string and I have a 6-string now.

Bingo. I noticed the same thing. My Streamer Stage 2 just sounds sweet all around.
Thumbs have more bite and growl to them.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

Click here for more information on the dip switches. We replaced the old "Active EQ" pickups with our new "Pro Active" P and J series. They take the most popular dipswitch positions and "hard wire" them. (The truth is, most players couldn't figure out how to use the dip switches and it created more questions than solutions -- so we took the guesswork out of it).

I hope that helps.

I didn't even care so much about the DIP switches, but the underlying sound of the pickups was just wonderful. I think I found one setting I liked and left it there.

Do any of the soapbars sound similar?

 

[fortress1w]

I slapped some Bartolini's in my pre factory Warwick fortress one. I chose the neck pickup that had a a more boosted low end and the bridge pick-up that had boosted highs. putting them 50/50 on the blend is great.

I am thinking of putting the Aguilar pre amp in it, but I want to be able to switch between active and passive. Is this suggested with this pre-amp.

 

[luknfur]

I slapped some Bartolini's in my pre factory Warwick fortress one. I chose the neck pickup that had a a more boosted low end and the bridge pick-up that had boosted highs. putting them 50/50 on the blend is great.

I am thinking of putting the Aguilar pre amp in it, but I want to be able to switch between active and passive. Is this suggested with this pre-amp.

FWIW:

to my knowledge you can install an active passive circuit in any onboard preamp that's combined with passive pickups. The issue is the controls tend to be minimal passively cause most controls bays aren't large enough to mount a mess of pots if you wanted to. That may or may not be an issue for you but you're not going to have bass/midrange/and treble control in a passive mode if that's what you're thinking.

 

[HotRatz]

thanks luknfur, Evan, for your replies.

Evan, which DIP setting was the one that proved most popular? In your opinion, would these make good pickups for a clean (but fat) jazz tone, or is there a more appropriate choice in the Duncan lineup? The site lists pop, blues, heavy rock, etc, but no jazz..that's probably an annoying question.

How bout this: was there much, or any, difference b/w the neck and bridge pups on a stock set of the dips? I'd be getting two bridge pups with my current plan. Still sorta wondering how that would compare to a voiced/calibrated neck/bridge prefab set..

 

[luknfur]

FWIW:

I'm guessing the dips would have worked quite well to jazz. If memory serves me correctly, they had a refined mellow vintage Fender quality about them. Distinctly more top half half frequency wise not heavy on the bottom with a top end that was rounded (in fact all tones were fairly rounded), not piercing or over the top at all though. They didn't sound like any other SD's I've had - including the SB Fretless or Lightnin rod actives.

Some pups that come to mind similar in tone were a set Fender Lace sensor J pups and an old set of English active Relfex PJ's.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

They didn't sound like any other SD's I've had - including the SB Fretless or Lightnin rod actives.

At the time I thought they sounded like Alembic pickups, maybe a little warmer ... and that's high praise from me!

 

[luknfur]

At the time I thought they sounded like Alembic pickups, maybe a little warmer ... and that's high praise from me!

FWIW:

Had some curiosity about Alembics but never pursued it. There so packaged deal with their electronics and connections. If you're after their sound then that's the route to go anyway but I've never crossed that threshold.

But I've always wondered (Alembic purists read no further least you be blinded by the dark) and you'd probably know, is there anything in their circuitry that prevents just clipping those connectors off the pups and wiring them up to a jack or another preamp - and sounding "normal" I mean? For that matter, I have no idea if their pups are active or passive or if they make both.

 

[HotRatz]

hey y'all, i finally did it. put duncans and an aguilar pre in my thumb bass. here's the link to my first two days' impression:

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=215296&page=2&highlight=warwick+duncan

 

[HotRatz]

oh, BTW, i ended up NOT going with the DIP-switch pickups, instead the later hardwired ones. The DIP ones were split-rail configuration, and due the angling of the pup layout on the thumb, the B and A strings fell into the nonsensitive regions and were way quieter. The newer ones are stacked coils and don't seem to have this problem (not sure if they're a solid rail on top or not).

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

...is there anything in their circuitry that prevents just clipping those connectors off the pups and wiring them up to a jack or another preamp - and sounding "normal" I mean? For that matter, I have no idea if their pups are active or passive or if they make both.

What's normal? They sound normal to me. The difference with an Alembic, and say something like EMG pickups, is the Alembic pickups are designed to not have a sound of their own, and to reproduce the bass as faithfully as possible.

The pickups are technically passive, but they are low impedance. So if you run them without the preamp you won't get very much out of them. All the onboard electronics do is boost the level of the pickups, and depending on the model bass, either have active tone controls (usually bass/treble) or a variable frequency low pass filter with selectable Q settings. The idea is that since the pickups are very wide range, the high end extends much higher than something like a Jazz pickup, and you lose the "hump" in the pickup's frequency response that exists right before the frequency range drops off. This is commonly known as the resonant peak of the pickup, and is one factor on why certain pickups sound as they do.

By rolling off some top end with the low pass filter, and selecting a mild Q setting, you get a similar sound as from a passive pickup.

Also, the series I basses have single coil pickups with a dummy coil for common mode noise cancelation, and that is adjusted at the preamp. Later model basses have stacked coil pickups.

It's the pickups that help give Alembics their sound. The preamp is made to be as transparent as possible. With the filter you can get pretty much any tone you like... But as with anything, it will still sound like an Alembic, just as putting P bass pickups on a Rick wont make it sound like a Fender (or vice versa).

Some of the after market preamps out there, are not at all hi-fi, and will color the sound of your bass, even with the control set flat. If that's the sound you want, than that's fine.

 

[luknfur]

What's normal? They sound normal to me. The difference with an Alembic, and say something like EMG pickups, is the Alembic pickups are designed to not have a sound of their own, and to reproduce the bass as faithfully as possible.

The pickups are technically passive, but they are low impedance. So if you run them without the preamp you won't get very much out of them. All the onboard electronics do is boost the level of the pickups, and depending on the model bass, either have active tone controls (usually bass/treble) or a variable frequency low pass filter with selectable Q settings. The idea is that since the pickups are very wide range, the high end extends much higher than something like a Jazz pickup, and you lose the "hump" in the pickup's frequency response that exists right before the frequency range drops off. This is commonly known as the resonant peak of the pickup, and is one factor on why certain pickups sound as they do.

By rolling off some top end with the low pass filter, and selecting a mild Q setting, you get a similar sound as from a passive pickup.

Also, the series I basses have single coil pickups with a dummy coil for common mode noise cancelation, and that is adjusted at the preamp. Later model basses have stacked coil pickups.

It's the pickups that help give Alembics their sound. The preamp is made to be as transparent as possible. With the filter you can get pretty much any tone you like... But as with anything, it will still sound like an Alembic, just as putting P bass pickups on a Rick wont make it sound like a Fender (or vice versa).

Some of the after market preamps out there, are not at all hi-fi, and will color the sound of your bass, even with the control set flat. If that's the sound you want, than that's fine.

By "normal" I was implying adequate volume, no distortion, basically a useable tone played to music.

It so happens I've since picked up an old Alembic PJ/pre setup, the greenish tinted ones. Basically the after-market activator set - which looks like they've changed from PJ recently to soaps. No info of any significance I could find on the Alembic site on their pups/onboard electronics, and not much more in the Alembic club.

One thing's for certain, the combination of their pups and preamp have a unique tone/quality that I assume is a signature sound cuase it doesn't sound like anything else - at least through portions of their tone filter spectrum and definetly not over the entire range of the filter as a whole.

I did get input in another thread that the pups are passive/low output and he'd ran them without the Alembic preamp and said they sounded fine. A previous response said they were active but I don't know if he owned an Alembic or not. Nothing new about someone with an onboard preamp thinking they have active pups when they don't.

My experience with the filter jives with your description. It's more of what I expected when I first started exploring onboard preamps and so suprisingly unique to date. It doesn't just sound like the same thing cut or boost. The curve is in your face, pretty extreme range of tones, mostly dark or bright tone selection and comparatively slim midrange, has a wonderfully refreshing passive quality to it without the typical tone sucking from passive pup experience, dead quiet. The dark tones are suprisingly useable and appealing and typically the top end can be maxed and useable as well. There's usually a dark and bright tone that works well to each tune so it's very interesting. Obviously made by someone who knows something about bass tone and it's hard to believe this is not the norm rather than the exception.

I've put them in 3 basses so far, two mindrange and one acoustically dark. The top end was harsh with irritating overtones in one bass. That bass I played for a year with a Bart PJ setup 3 band TCT and it was pretty toastie. Barts typically have a stunted top which apparently was just what this bass needed. Alembics worked fine in the other two and the extended top end of the filter was a good compliment to the inherent dark nature of that bass. I would have expected as dark as that filter made the low end on the midrange basses that the dark side of the filter wouldn't be of much use in that bass, but even set as dark as the filter would go the tone was useable.

Pretty decent stuff.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

By "normal" I was implying adequate volume, no distortion, basically a useable tone played to music.

Got it!

It so happens I've since picked up an old Alembic PJ/pre setup, the greenish tinted ones. Basically the after-market activator set - which looks like they've changed from PJ recently to soaps. No info of any significance I could find on the Alembic site on their pups/onboard electronics, and not much more in the Alembic club.

I remember those... They are listed on this page:

Link Removed

$700!!!

One thing's for certain, the combination of their pups and preamp have a unique tone/quality that I assume is a signature sound cuase it doesn't sound like anything else - at least through portions of their tone filter spectrum and definetly not over the entire range of the filter as a whole.

I did get input in another thread that the pups are passive/low output and he'd ran them without the Alembic preamp and said they sounded fine. A previous response said they were active but I don't know if he owned an Alembic or not. Nothing new about someone with an onboard preamp thinking they have active pups when they don't.

I don't think these are like the original pickups they put in their basses.. these might have preamps built in, a la EMG.

Pretty decent stuff.

Cool!

 

[luknfur]

Got it!
I remember those... They are listed on this page:
Link Removed
$700!!!
I don't think these are like the original pickups they put in their basses.. these might have preamps built in, a la EMG.
Cool!

This pre is just two volumes and a filter control, not the vol/pan/bass/treble setup. There's a PCB on each pot with the battery clip and jack for harness. There's only two male contacts on the connectors for the pups. I've never seen an active pup with only two leads but doesn't mean they're not out there. But if there's any consistency to that, there should be a third male contact in the connector for the preamp if the pups are active, unless there's a way around that.

I'm guessing this set's maybe 10 years old or more.

I have no idea if they came out of an Alembic bass or were purchased after-market like the activators. I didn't ask but I got the impression the guy I bought them from wasn't the original owner, or even had them for long. Seems I read in the Alembic club the AXY pups they do install in their basses so apparently some of the activator stuff is the same. Quite a bit of obscurity around the Alembic stuff. I do know I've seen a few Alembic PJ basses with this control setup and the same control setup in their older basses with soaps. Pretty minimal but a second filter would probably be excessive cuase even the single filter is not that user friendly in terms of finding a tone and even less so getting back to it. No detents in the control. The switching option they have is a thought. Wouldn't mind hooking up with more the Alembic stuff.

It would be interesting to check the pups out without the preamp and the preamp with other pups.

I got an old dimarzio preamp once that had male female connectors for the pups very much like the new Alembic connectors are (the ones I have are the old orange rectangular connectors ). Do you have any idea where I might pick up some connectors similar to those (the pin type not the rectangular)?

 

[avi]

Nope, MECs are the best for pure rock and distorted guitars. Seymour Duncans, in my limited experience, are have less growl and more gain. Instead of changing your pickups, I'd change your equalization or add some light fuzz.

Idk. Jack Bruce used Duncans in his Warwick Thumbs and they were plenty growly. I also owned an early bolt on Thumb. They came with Duncans and it was the best sounding bass overall IMHO. I played rock/hard rock and it was perfect. Just bought a Streamer and Im ripping the MECs or the preamp, or both out. Terrible highs.