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Stopping Unwanted Harmonics

W

WannaJazz

Supporting Member
May 7, 2010
556
166
#1
As an example of what I'm experiencing,

When playing staccato 1/4 notes on the open E string, I get a harmonic on each note as I mute the string with my right hand.

My right hand thumb is usually positioned at the pickup.

I play finger style, and the harmonic happens whether playing unplugged, or amplified.

I'm using D'Addario EXL 180 Extra Super Light strings, 35-95

When playing with a band, the harmonic is less obvious.

When I try to make a recording of a bassline as a demo to send to friends, the unwanted harmonics are a problem.

I have tried foam under the strings at the bridge, and I tried a hair tie next to the nut.

I think I've covered any questions someone might ask.

Has anyone experienced this problem, and found a solution?
 
#2
It sounds to me like the place where you are muting the string with your right hand just happens to be at a spot that generates a harmonic. Simply shifting your muting finger(s) a little in either direction might solve the problem.

I'll just add that if you adopted a different right-hand technique, such as the floating thumb or moveable anchor, you would have more flexibility in terms of your right-hand placement than you do anchoring your thumb on a pickup.
 
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#5
Lobster11 said:
It sounds to me like the place where you are muting the string with your right hand just happens to be at a spot that generates a harmonic. Simply shifting your muting finger(s) a little in either direction might solve the problem.

I'll just add that if you adopted a different right-hand technique, such as the floating thumb or moveable anchor, you would have more flexibility in terms of your right-hand placement than you do anchoring your thumb on a pickup.
Click to expand...
...and if he adopted a floating thumb technique, he could better use his two hands, together, to mute.
 
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#6
I do almost all muting with my left hand, open or fretted notes. And when I’m muting, I try to mute with as many fingers as possible to reduce the likelihood of letting a harmonic ring. To me, it’s an essential part of my playing. A lot of people don’t focus enough on articulation and note length, and to me that drives the tempo and subdivision of the song so much.
 
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#8
WannaJazz said:
When playing staccato 1/4 notes on the open E string, I get a harmonic on each note as I mute the string with my right hand.
Click to expand...
If the line is repetitive quarter notes (just the root, or root-fifth, or whatever), one technique I would try is fretting the note with a pair of fingers on the string rather than one, and lifting to mute the note. Doing it with one finger can lead to harmonics or clank, so two fingers usually sounds cleaner. That's more difficult if the line is moving, though.

Edit: Okay even though I even quoted it, I missed the part about playing an open string. Sorry, ignore me, I'm being dumb this evening.
 
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#10
Ah, this is one of the difficulties of playing bass that most other musicians do not know about (but know something is wrong playing with you when you're not good at it!).

You have to be touching strings that you don't want to have sympathetic and harmonic ringing in at least two spots to ensure no unwanted sounds are happening.

I do this by combining a hybrid floating thumb technique (on the B and E-string, always anchoring my thumb on a string or two - with the side of the thumb - and not the pickup or end of the fretboard) as well as with my left hand, sometimes even with my right hand ring and pinky fingers too.
 
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#11
PotsdamBass8 said:
I do almost all muting with my left hand, open or fretted notes. And when I’m muting, I try to mute with as many fingers as possible to reduce the likelihood of letting a harmonic ring.
Click to expand...
The Rocco approach. Watch a video of him playing. But yeah, I mute every which way (playing five string most of the time)--fretting hand, floating thumb, palm mute, combinations of all the above.
But specifically for this, fingerstyle, open E string, thumb mounted on pickup--you can mute with your plucking fingers and not even use your left hand. It's a different sound, but a very defined one. It's basically finger pluck, followed by the alternating finger muting the string, then that same finger plucking from that muted state. You can really control the length of the space between the notes. Depending on the tempo, it's very effective and clean. Just use the fingers on the fretting hand to mute the other three strings while you're doing this.
EDIT: ah, I see the OP says they're getting a harmonic muting with their plucking hand which is what I just described, NOT their fretting hand.....:confused:. In that case, getting a harmonic then is kinda weird....
 
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#13
brianrost said:
Even if one finger is centered perfectly for a harmonic, if you mute with two fingers, the second finger will mute the harmonic. Your palm will work even better if it’s comfortable to use it.
Click to expand...

OP could try to reverse the fingers to see if the middle finger (if that happens to be the switch) generates the harmonic. there should be a 3/4 scale length harmonic that rings as e somewhere a bit past where the fretboard ends...

so this happens with the low e I kind of wonder if it's not a back length or otherwise sympathetic resonance issue. maybe it's not the string that's ringing at all?
 
#16
PotsdamBass8 said:
A lot of people don’t focus enough on articulation and note length,
Click to expand...

QFT. There is so much talk about note choice and the like, but the truth is that the same 3 notes played 30 different ways offers more interesting and diverse opportunities for musical expression than 30 notes played 3 different ways!!
 
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#17
SteveCS said:
QFT. There is so much talk about note choice and the like, but the truth is that the same 3 notes played 30 different ways offers more interesting and diverse opportunities for musical expression than 30 notes played 3 different ways!!
Click to expand...
Here's an amusing story about Pino Palladino (playing with Miley Cyrus) that illustrates the point nicely:

www.yahoo.com

How Pino Palladino turned the demo bassline in Miley Cyrus’s End of the World into something "so much better"

"I just thought it would sound the same, but my God," says awestruck producer Shawn Everett
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com
 
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#18
Good morning!

That's a lot of replies!

Thanks guys!

Rather than replying to each suggestion, I thought it might be helpful if I made a recording to post here.

When I posted the specifics of how I'm playing, what strings, and all that jazz, I forgot to mention that the first thing I tried was moving my plucking hand .

I hope this will shed some light on the issue.

The first example is plucking at the pickup, the second is down near the neck, and the third example is up by the bridge.

 
#19
I can clearly hear two harmonic tones alternating. if you listen to the first example you first hear an E harmonic after the first mute, the second time around it is a D harmonic.

the harmonics change as you move around the string but it still alternates every time. they aren't the same tone.

is everything sitting ok at the nut and the bridge?
 
#20
WannaJazz said:
Good morning!

That's a lot of replies!

Thanks guys!

Rather than replying to each suggestion, I thought it might be helpful if I made a recording to post here.

When I posted the specifics of how I'm playing, what strings, and all that jazz, I forgot to mention that the first thing I tried was moving my plucking hand .

I hope this will shed some light on the issue.

The first example is plucking at the pickup, the second is down near the neck, and the third example is up by the bridge.

Click to expand...


Now I see why it is bothering you. Maybe you need new strings. How is it at gig volume. Does the fundamental get more prominent .

I can replicate it but it seems that you can overcome this with modulating how you much you press the strings when you mute it. I certainly can. Now playing at gig levels as the fundamental gets amplified the ratio of the harmonic to the fundamental is less , Note that I am using a EA Wizzy 12 which had UN-defeatable co-axial tweeter, so my speaker is bright. Also the amp is a Mesa Prodigy Voicing 2 which also has slight mid-scoop.

So really interesting that at practice levels clean I can replicate your harmonic but once I am playing loud it is minimal because the low end is overpowering if not cancelling it. Of course I can reduce the harmonic just the way I mute at any volume -- so I'd say work on your muting. If you think you got that covered then strings and review your setup and fret level.

Also note that when there is music as in backing tracks it becomes a non issue.. The ping on some snares with rimshot playing will definitely overpower that. The bass I am using is a Fender PJ also with D'Addarios nickels
 

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