The Eden WT-880c saga continues....EQ Quirks?

[Dilfis]

Hello all,
Awhile ago I'd asked for feedback regarding OM replacement tube types for the Eden WT-800c and Thank you for the replies. Subsequently, I stuck a Electro-Harmonix 7025 in the preamp, douched all the pots with DeOxit and have been running sweet and strong through a pair of Aguilar 12's. I play a Warmouth build 5-string with Seymour guts.
Everything works fine in that regard and I'm enjoying the parameter it provides. (the OM in mine turned out to be a Ruby 7025ss/12AX7A).

My amp has a reoccurring operational spasm: I'll be playing along (I use the internal compressor in my eq) and I'll hear a electronic 'clack' sound. Immediately afterward the tonal output of the eq settings changes to a hollow-sounding (high-mid?) dominance and the low and low mid influences seem to be reduced. Sounds like the signal is being played through an empty toilet paper tube. The lower positions on the fretboard stringing change to a 'twongy', 'nasal' kind of sound, with less bottom.
So I'm about to pull the amp out of the rack and 're-douche' all the pots, thinking that over time some gunk from my previous (and first ever) cleaning may have worked it's way into a position that shorts out the function of a pot in the variable active eq section? I've 're-zeroed' my preamp signal chain and am unable to ferret out this nasal tone.

Anyway, this is an old amp (probably has about only 1000 hrs) that I love and I've been unsuccessful in obtaining any 'factory' support, including OM parts. Eden isn't even in the US anymore.

I'll check back on this thread while I hamfist my way through this endeavor and I'll Thank you in advance for any insights this may draw from owners or ex-US-factory employees.

 

[agedhorse]

Ham-fisted is accurate imo.

You may have ruined the entire set of pots from your previous "douching", something to be entirely avoided because it often created new and much more difficult problems to now solve.

Your assumptions completely lack common sense (from an electronics professional's point of view).

 

[Dilfis]

Of course. I'm not an electronics professional. However if you know of one who could post a solution to this issue, please direct them. My described 'issue' with this amp started occurring before I replaced the tube or did any douching. It's an old amp that was bought new but sat unused for years. It has been daily active for over 3 years now. It doesn't travel much, it lives in a dry Texas climate inside the house.

 

[frankie5string]

Of course. I'm not an electronics professional. However if you know of one who could post a solution to this issue, please direct them. My described 'issue' with this amp started occurring before I replaced the tube or did any douching. It's an old amp that was bought new but sat unused for years. It has been daily active for over 3 years now. It doesn't travel much, it lives in a dry Texas climate inside the house.

That amp has to be seen in person by a qualified service tech. You're only going to get guesses here, some of which are potentially dangerous.
That amp is pretty old - I remember when they were new and they were very good amps. If it hasn't been plugged in for an unknown period of time, any number of things could be wrong with it and just powering up and turning on something like that without a lookover could cause problems.

Take it to a tech. Hopefully one that can get access to Eden schematics and has a proper test-bench setup.

 

[agedhorse]

Of course. I'm not an electronics professional. However if you know of one who could post a solution to this issue, please direct them. My described 'issue' with this amp started occurring before I replaced the tube or did any douching. It's an old amp that was bought new but sat unused for years. It has been daily active for over 3 years now. It doesn't travel much, it lives in a dry Texas climate inside the house.

No, I don't have an internet quality crystal ball that's capable of making accurate wild ass guesses.

 

[ardgedee]

So I'm about to pull the amp out of the rack and 're-douche' all the pots, thinking that over time some gunk from my previous (and first ever) cleaning may have worked it's way into a position that shorts out the function of a pot in the variable active eq section?

DeOxit is not a miracle spray. It is a chemical solution that leaves residue after the solvents evaporate. The more you spray, the more gunk you add.

With due respect, you have to take this to somebody who understands how to test it properly. Nobody can accurately diagnose your amp's problem through words and pictures.

 

[jjk2007]

I had a WT 550 that developed similar types of issues like you described with yours. Unfortunately using the Deoxit is not the way to solve this. You have internal components failing. I took mine to a qualified tech here in Austin and he had to test/scope the entire unit to find the failures and make the repairs. If you love the amp and plan on keeping it this would be well worth it. It hurts to spend the money but if the repairs are done correctly you'll probably be able to use the amp for years to come….

 

[ole Jason]

You're going to have to find someone willing to take a look at the amp... which can be a real pain (and expensive) nowadays even if you live in a larger city.

 

[Michael Vee]

Buy a new amp. We have an incredible selection of bass amps these days to choose from.

 

[agedhorse]

You're going to have to find someone willing to take a look at the amp... which can be a real pain (and expensive) nowadays even if you live in a larger city.

Especially if it's already been worked on and is now a bigger mess. These kinds of repairs often end up becoming more expensive because of the clean-up and "re-repair" costs.

 

[pb9717]

Bad day? Lil crunchy bro.

Original poster; I went through this dance with an old WT 800. I brought it to a professional tech rather than delve into it. I have 15 years experience in military electronics. And I know when not to touch something. After a month and a half, with a very highly qualified amp tech here in Cincinnati ( Peter Framptons guy) the 27 pound behometh still not 100%. I opted to dump it at Guitar Center and take the loss.

Sometimes it's better to walk away. No matter how much affection we have for a specific model or make. There's too much good stuff out there to be married to a single model.

Although I'm one to talk, as I sold my precious streamliner 900 only to buy another one a year later but the one I have works like New.

Good luck.

 

[eniac]

I recently got in an Eden WTDI for repair that showed symptoms similar to the OP's amp. Also, turning the pots did "random things", if that makes any sense. I opened it up and found the board coated in some kind of weird film. I knew at that moment there was nothing I could do, at a reasonable charge anyway. Too bad, really, because those things aren't made any more.

 

[Thumpin6string]

I've had amps with similar issues. They all ended up being dirty send/return jacks. Easy test: put a patch cable between the send and return and see if it still has the problem. If it does, it's tech time.

 

[agedhorse]

I recently got in an Eden WTDI for repair that showed symptoms similar to the OP's amp. Also, turning the pots did "random things", if that makes any sense. I opened it up and found the board coated in some kind of weird film. I knew at that moment there was nothing I could do, at a reasonable charge anyway. Too bad, really, because those things aren't made any more.

Yup, "douched" with some form of miracle cure-all spray, exactly what I was getting at in my earlier posts.

 

[Dilfis]

Yup, "douched" with some form of miracle cure-all spray, exactly what I was getting at in my earlier posts.

Welp...mine is not an entirely lame original idea. The maintenance section of the owner's manual quotes: "Contact Point Cleaning; '-these points should be cleaned regularly with a cotton swab soaked in denatured alcohol or commercially available de-oxidant.' Referring to input and output jacks, front and back panels. This is something I did with my 'extended parameter douching' (some of the pots) over a year ago. My original 'funny things' complaints with some of my pots (mainly scratching) disappeared and the amp has behaved itself for over a year, hence my question about re-doing the original 'procedure'. Patience and Process? Roll the Dice? The pots have never actually quit, even this time, and I don't think that every good tech avoids deoxidation sprays. My father was an electrician (although he didn't work on amps), so I'm kinda unafraid to jump right in on stuff. Sounds like the WTDI experience you describe was obviously someone's bad choice of 'miracle goo'...lol. I'm as yet undecided as to go ahead with another 'localized' cleaning, the option being a new amp altogether. I do have my eye on three different brands/products, but you know,....'the wife'...lol. Anyway, I wanted to Thank you for your following this thread and sharing your opinions, and Thank you to the others here in on this conversation.

 

[jjk2007]

I still think you have issues with components within the signal chain. Here is something to try.....keep your volume low but but start working your EQ and frequency set point knobs up and down and see how the amp reacts. Does anything change, get worse, get better etc. My WT550 would put out a weird, almost feedback type sound when I would turn up the treble knob some and then move the frequency sweep knob around to different positions. The good thing is there are plenty of great options out there should you decide to move on. Good luck!

 

[agedhorse]

Welp...mine is not an entirely lame original idea. The maintenance section of the owner's manual quotes: "Contact Point Cleaning; '-these points should be cleaned regularly with a cotton swab soaked in denatured alcohol or commercially available de-oxidant.' Referring to input and output jacks, front and back panels. This is something I did with my 'extended parameter douching' (some of the pots) over a year ago. My original 'funny things' complaints with some of my pots (mainly scratching) disappeared and the amp has behaved itself for over a year, hence my question about re-doing the original 'procedure'. Patience and Process? Roll the Dice? The pots have never actually quit, even this time, and I don't think that every good tech avoids deoxidation sprays. My father was an electrician (although he didn't work on amps), so I'm kinda unafraid to jump right in on stuff. Sounds like the WTDI experience you describe was obviously someone's bad choice of 'miracle goo'...lol. I'm as yet undecided as to go ahead with another 'localized' cleaning, the option being a new amp altogether. I do have my eye on three different brands/products, but you know,....'the wife'...lol. Anyway, I wanted to Thank you for your following this thread and sharing your opinions, and Thank you to the others here in on this conversation.

Understanding electronics is not genetically related to your father being an electrician. A YouTube or TikTok education isn't a good way either since ~50% of the advice is dead wrong.

I'm trying to help you understand how you got to where you are so that you don't

 

[Michael Vee]

Is this the sole thread on TB that has references to cleaning electronics as "douching?" I suspect that it is. Wonder if it'll catch on?

 

[eniac]

Welp...mine is not an entirely lame original idea. The maintenance section of the owner's manual quotes: "Contact Point Cleaning; '-these points should be cleaned regularly with a cotton swab soaked in denatured alcohol or commercially available de-oxidant.' Referring to input and output jacks, front and back panels. This is something I did with my 'extended parameter douching' (some of the pots) over a year ago. My original 'funny things' complaints with some of my pots (mainly scratching) disappeared and the amp has behaved itself for over a year, hence my question about re-doing the original 'procedure'. Patience and Process? Roll the Dice? The pots have never actually quit, even this time, and I don't think that every good tech avoids deoxidation sprays. My father was an electrician (although he didn't work on amps), so I'm kinda unafraid to jump right in on stuff. Sounds like the WTDI experience you describe was obviously someone's bad choice of 'miracle goo'...lol. I'm as yet undecided as to go ahead with another 'localized' cleaning, the option being a new amp altogether. I do have my eye on three different brands/products, but you know,....'the wife'...lol. Anyway, I wanted to Thank you for your following this thread and sharing your opinions, and Thank you to the others here in on this conversation.

Have you tried bridging the effects loop(s) with an instrument cable yet? Could be something as simple as corrosion on the effects return jacks(s) switching contacts. I'm assuming the effects loop(s) on that amp are in series with the signal path (the traditional way) rather than in parallel with the signal path, which may be a false assumption on my part.

 

[Geri O]

Is this the sole thread on TB that has references to cleaning electronics as "douching?" I suspect that it is. Wonder if it'll catch on?

At least that term will give the reader an accurate clue of the outcome from utilizing that procedure….