To build a Peavenbacker!

[Wademeister63]

I don't want to make a real Ric copy, but I'd like to try to sort of cop a Ric's tone. I've heard a few times from different people that a Peavey T-40 can sound Ric-ish, so I bought a nice cheap ebay T-40 mostly for the electronics. It's an older one with the non-exposed pickup blade/poles, which I think have a different sound than the ones where you can see the metal. I'll have both after the white one arrives, so some experimentation is in the cards.

I know the Rics are all maple neckthrough, but what kind of maple? I'm leaning toward rock (Eastern?) maple, but that's just a guess. I probably read it somewhere but danged if I can find anything right now. Also I have a really nice piece of gaboon ebony for a fretboard, but I'm not sure how that will compare to the 4003's heavily finished rosewood board. Rosewood? That's what I found on the Rickenbacker site. I thought they were padouk? Not sure if it matters much anyway with the all finish they put on top of it.

So what can anyone suggest for wood choices for this project? Sound like I'm on the right track, or should I swap out that fretboard or what? I'm not trying to NAIL the Ric tone, or I'd be buying the rick replacement pickups or even buying real Ric. I would like to get close though, and with the Peavey electronics still have a wide variety of sounds to play around with.

For body style I'm thinking something along the lines of this Rudy Sarzo in white with black binding. Should be good fun =).

the $138 Peavey:

 

[pilotjones]

Rics have a hard (eastern) (rock) (sugar) maple neck (as do nearly everything). Often, perhaps always, have a walnut strip down the center.

For body wings, I'm not sure whether they use hard or soft maple. I've seen pics of a 4002 with birdseye, which is hard maple.

Fretboards I think have been rosewood, padauk (referred to at the time as vermillion), and maybe bubinga. There are lots of Ric people who should be able to tell you more.

 

[manbass]

Easier to mod a used Ric than all the work you're proposing to come from the other side essentially, IMO.

 

[Demon]

Dude, hes not gonna copy it, just try get a similiar sound. Thats what he said. Hes not even gonna go that body style.

 

[manbass]

He should be ok then.

I have played many Rics, own 2, and the closest I've played and heard live that would be worthy of reaching the "Ric Bass Tone" is an Peavey B Quad 4. The Ric tone is achieved in large part by their oversize pole high output passive pickup design and capacitor placement. The bridge/saddle structure also have a hand in the grittyness of the sound texture. I'd start there and research the wood thirdly.

 

[grooVWy]

I believe it´s legal to build yourself a bass, no matter what look-a-like if it´s for your own use.

Wademeister63. Your fun will end if John Hall, who visits this forum, gets wind of the title with the words Ric and build. The 4000 series are fiercely defended legally, in case you didnt know. yeah, I see all your caveats about not nailing it. Just be careful. Visit RicResource and you will understand.

Easier to mod a used Ric than all the work you're proposing to come from the other side essentially, IMO.

 

[pilotjones]

If I could introduce a small tangent...

After seeing that picture, it looks to me that the T-40 maybe could not be made exactly that way today. Ric applied for and was registered a design trademark on its toaster pickups, which those resemble pretty closely (proportions are off, though).

It contains a an illustration:

and the text:

The mark consists of a configuration of a rectangular metal guitar pickup with dual top openings for electronically transmitting sound to the amplification system.

source is here (if the link works): http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=7dcqi5.2.2
TM s/n 75880749, reg no 2665042

BTW that may seem unfair, but these things are published for opposition before they are registered.

 

[Wademeister63]

Thanks guys!

The exciting thing- I sort of remember buying a maple board a while back and I found it today! So now I have a hard maple neck blank all glued up beside me right now .

I have a lot of respect for Ric. They've been around a long time and still produce a great product. Since the Fender Jazz bass has pretty much become public domain in spite of Fender's best (but late) efforts, I can understand Ric wanting to be aggressive in protecting what is theirs. SALUTE! Regarding the specs of the Ric, I won't be putting enough effort into this project to get the recipie deadly accurate. As said, I plan on using a completely different body shape and headstock shape, so nobody would ever mistake my bass for a Ric.

I've got the neck blank all glued up and didn't realize there was a walnut strip missing. I don't think it will be worth the effort of ripping my neck blank to add the walnut piece, so I'm already getting away from Ric's design. The board I have is also big enough to make the wings, so the whole bass except for the fretboard will be made from one board out of convenience. I have some nice bloodwood that I might consider for the fretboard instead of vermillion (love that name, heh), so I may do that. Still leaning toward the look of the ebony fretboard against the white body so I'll think about that a while. Probably will come down on the side of looks since I'm not convinced you can hear a Ric fretboard under their finish anyway.

The pickups have already been bought, though I wish I knew about that B-Quad thing. Never heard of it before. I'll need to do some research on that now which may result in a future project For this project I'll be checking out the Ric pickup placement and will put the T-40 pickups in position so that when they are in single coil mode, the single coil will be in the 4003 stock location. If anyone has accurate measurements from the nut to the polepieces, I could use that info. Otherwise I'll measure it off some pic I can find.

The bridge... Hmm. I had first thought about the replacement Ric bridge. Made by Gotoh or Schaller or someone? Hipshot maybe? But I don't know. Seems like a lot of famous Rics wore Badass bridges so I'm kind of torn on that. I have been thinking about using the Peavey bridge since it's a decent bridge and I'll have one already hanging around when I need a bridge. I really could use more input as to how much sonic or dynamic difference the bridge makes.

Manbass, thanks for your concern and for your input regarding the electronics and bridge. I will check out the RicResource. I don't think I've seen that before. No worries though, I didn't say what I said in my original post as caveats. I think you now see that I am looking to get a similar flavor without making the whole dish, if that analogy works for you. I have nothing but respect for Ric and I have considered buying one. I'm sure one of these days I will buy one, but for now I want to create. I like to try weird stuff and this is just about there so I'm on it.

 

[Wademeister63]

If I could introduce a small tangent...

After seeing that picture, it looks to me that the T-40 maybe could not be made exactly that way today. Ric applied for and was registered a design trademark on its toaster pickups, which those resemble pretty closely (proportions are off, though).

It contains a an illustration:

and the text:

source is here (if the link works): http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=7dcqi5.2.2
TM s/n 75880749, reg no 2665042

BTW that may seem unfair, but these things are published for opposition before they are registered.

I figured they changed because of cost of manufacturing or design improvements, but there are a million things that can happen so you never know do you?

I couldn't even figure out how to get where you were on that site, but if I invent something some day, you're getting a PM from me!

Thanks for the info, interesting stuff.

 

[manbass]

Both Demons and grooVWy points are valid. The B Quad bridge piezo's duplicate the Ric treble pretty well IMO. I cant imagine wiring that setup from scratch, its just not in my ability.

 

[grooVWy]

just a thought:
The body of the Rickenbacker is also thinner than, let´s say Jazzers for example, so you might consider making the body thinner to get more in to that nasal sounds...

Thanks guys!

The exciting thing- I sort of remember buying a maple board a while back and I found it today! So now I have a hard maple neck blank all glued up beside me right now .

I have a lot of respect for Ric. They've been around a long time and still produce a great product. Since the Fender Jazz bass has pretty much become public domain in spite of Fender's best (but late) efforts, I can understand Ric wanting to be aggressive in protecting what is theirs. SALUTE! Regarding the specs of the Ric, I won't be putting enough effort into this project to get the recipie deadly accurate. As said, I plan on using a completely different body shape and headstock shape, so nobody would ever mistake my bass for a Ric.

I've got the neck blank all glued up and didn't realize there was a walnut strip missing. I don't think it will be worth the effort of ripping my neck blank to add the walnut piece, so I'm already getting away from Ric's design. The board I have is also big enough to make the wings, so the whole bass except for the fretboard will be made from one board out of convenience. I have some nice bloodwood that I might consider for the fretboard instead of vermillion (love that name, heh), so I may do that. Still leaning toward the look of the ebony fretboard against the white body so I'll think about that a while. Probably will come down on the side of looks since I'm not convinced you can hear a Ric fretboard under their finish anyway.

The pickups have already been bought, though I wish I knew about that B-Quad thing. Never heard of it before. I'll need to do some research on that now which may result in a future project For this project I'll be checking out the Ric pickup placement and will put the T-40 pickups in position so that when they are in single coil mode, the single coil will be in the 4003 stock location. If anyone has accurate measurements from the nut to the polepieces, I could use that info. Otherwise I'll measure it off some pic I can find.

The bridge... Hmm. I had first thought about the replacement Ric bridge. Made by Gotoh or Schaller or someone? Hipshot maybe? But I don't know. Seems like a lot of famous Rics wore Badass bridges so I'm kind of torn on that. I have been thinking about using the Peavey bridge since it's a decent bridge and I'll have one already hanging around when I need a bridge. I really could use more input as to how much sonic or dynamic difference the bridge makes.

Manbass, thanks for your concern and for your input regarding the electronics and bridge. I will check out the RicResource. I don't think I've seen that before. No worries though, I didn't say what I said in my original post as caveats. I think you now see that I am looking to get a similar flavor without making the whole dish, if that analogy works for you. I have nothing but respect for Ric and I have considered buying one. I'm sure one of these days I will buy one, but for now I want to create. I like to try weird stuff and this is just about there so I'm on it.

 

[pilotjones]

just a thought:
The body of the Rickenbacker is also thinner than, let´s say Jazzers for example, so you might consider making the body thinner to get more in to that nasal sounds...

True. This will also bring the weight down, with an all-maple body.

 

[Wademeister63]

True. This will also bring the weight down, with an all-maple body.

just a thought:
The body of the Rickenbacker is also thinner than, let´s say Jazzers for example, so you might consider making the body thinner to get more in to that nasal sounds...

Yep and yep! I'd also read that Chris Squires's Ric had been thinned down and I was planning on making mine about as thin as I could and still fit everything inside. For weight, comfort, and tone. The T-40 I have now weighs in at 10-3/4 pounds and I'm sure the one coming will be more than that. That's just getting a bit too heavy for comfort. I don't want the corner of the body digging in to my arm or waist while playing either. I'm not looking to build another bass to display on a stand. I want to play this one, so it has to be comfortable too.

The B Quad bridge piezo's duplicate the Ric treble pretty well IMO. I cant imagine wiring that setup from scratch, its just not in my ability.

So this isn't another magnetic pickup, and it's possible that I could use this along with the T-40 pickups??? Ok now I really have to find out about this thing. I'm not too bad with wiring, and if I get in over my head I know a couple of guys who can help me get it working. Got any good reference handy for that B Quad bridge dealio?

Thanks guys!

 

[manbass]

A piezo pickup (pronouced pee-EH-zo) is an ultraphonic transducer, a small dual pole pickup usually mounted in a bridge saddle and wired to its own preamp, then to a dedicated control set. Check graph tech labs or mouser.com for some product info.

 

[grooVWy]

I´ve made meself this:
Link Removed
not as slim body as Ricks usually have, but I wan´t to slap with it as well.

I don't want to make a real Ric copy, but I'd like to try to sort of cop a Ric's tone. I've heard a few times from different people that a Peavey T-40 can sound Ric-ish, so I bought a nice cheap ebay T-40 mostly for the electronics. It's an older one with the non-exposed pickup blade/poles, which I think have a different sound than the ones where you can see the metal. I'll have both after the white one arrives, so some experimentation is in the cards.

I know the Rics are all maple neckthrough, but what kind of maple? I'm leaning toward rock (Eastern?) maple, but that's just a guess. I probably read it somewhere but danged if I can find anything right now. Also I have a really nice piece of gaboon ebony for a fretboard, but I'm not sure how that will compare to the 4003's heavily finished rosewood board. Rosewood? That's what I found on the Rickenbacker site. I thought they were padouk? Not sure if it matters much anyway with the all finish they put on top of it.

So what can anyone suggest for wood choices for this project? Sound like I'm on the right track, or should I swap out that fretboard or what? I'm not trying to NAIL the Ric tone, or I'd be buying the rick replacement pickups or even buying real Ric. I would like to get close though, and with the Peavey electronics still have a wide variety of sounds to play around with.

For body style I'm thinking something along the lines of this Rudy Sarzo in white with black binding. Should be good fun =).

the $138 Peavey:

 

[Wademeister63]

I´ve made meself this:
Link Removed
not as slim body as Ricks usually have, but I wan´t to slap with it as well.

Great! Aside from having too many strings and being built backwards and all, but that's part of why we build our own isn't it?
Looks like you built a very fine bass there!

 

[grooVWy]

cheers !
The "backwards" thing was the fact that got me started in first place. I just couldn´t find a good lefthanded 5-stringer that I could afford from Finland, so I had to do it meself. In fact I haven´t ever seen a lefty 5´er in Finnish music store, go ad figure .

Great! Aside from having too many strings and being built backwards and all, but that's part of why we build our own isn't it?
Looks like you built a very fine bass there!

 

[Wademeister63]

It's getting there.
Obviously not a Ric copy but some of that flavor is in there. Along with a few other good flavors I think. Uh.. anyone ever get GAS for a bass they're building? I can't wait to play this one!

I'll take some good pics in a week or two when it's all done

 

[Greenman]

Looking good Wade.

 

[Wademeister63]

Looking good Wade.

Thanks! Usually I don't have such a great feeling about what I'm building but I'm pretty proud of this one. Another bad pic to show the thin bound body with a thigh cut similar to the tummy cut. I haven't had it on a scale yet but it's very light right now.