Tone is in the fingers??

[MultiScaleMale]

We hear "tone is in the fingers" frequently. Sure, gear matters too, but Geddy Lee is going to sound remarkably like Geddy Lee whether he's playing on a Jazz through an Orange or an acoustic sitting around a campfire. (That would be an awesome camping trip, but I digress.) The notes that are played, how the strings are attacked, where the strings are plucked and with what, how the left hand lifts or mutes the notes, all of these matter to the eventual tone.

So, I've decided to study how particular bassists play. Try to emulate their left and right hand styles, not just the notes on paper (or iPad). The end result is to just have more arrows in the quiver to attack any given situation.

 

[Groove Doctor]

Brilliant idea, I learned sooo much doing this. Much easier/rewarding on a very articulate bass, esp with newer roundwounds.

 

[soulman969]

Not mine. My fingers are actually mute so I let my bass or guitars speak for them.

 

[bass12]

My tone is in my toes. Man did I get the short end of the stick on that one...

 

[JGbassman]

Totally agree and what a great idea. I wish you the best learning!

Funny, my guitarist stated just last week that regardless of which bass I bring to a gig it always sounds great. Poor guy must be loosing his hearing.

All joking aside, I think it's due to my technique, and how I play over the different rigs or basses I bring.

 

[12BitSlab]

Listen to Rocco - listen to other players, but develop your own style.

 

[Killed_by_Death]

This might just be the piece of the puzzle I'm missing. Earlier I was watching a G&L video, a demo of the L-2000. The thing sounded amazing, nothing like how I sounded on one just yesterday.
Of course, they're using their best tube preamp for the demo & I don't know what strings are on it, but I'm feeling like the technique aspect is part of it also.

I can get that growlish timbre if every note is a hammer-on quickly followed by plucking the note.
I'm really disappointed that I couldn't get the same bass to sound as punchy.

 

[lz4005]

So, I've decided to study how particular bassists play. Try to emulate their left and right hand styles, not just the notes on paper (or iPad). The end result is to just have more arrows in the quiver to attack any given situation.

Another approach to getting the most out of technique is to play a gig (or 100) plugged directly into an amp, without touching any of the knobs on the bass.

One of my favorite basses has a single pickup wired directly to the jack, with only a mute switch in between. You end up thinking a lot like an upright player using an instrument like that. Technique is all you have to alter the tone, so you quickly learn how to make the most of it.

 

[ThudThudThud]

Another approach to getting the most out of technique is to play a gig (or 100) plugged directly into an amp, without touching any of the knobs on the bass.

One of my favorite basses has a single pickup wired directly to the jack, with only a mute switch in between. You end up thinking a lot like an upright player using an instrument like that. Technique is all you have to alter the tone, so you quickly learn how to make the most of it.

Yes! I went from lots of pedals, two basses, rounds... to a project were I took a simple SS combo, and a Precision with Chromes plugged straight it. I found myself never touching the tone control, and instead changing my right hand position, and attack to achieve different tones. Eye opening.
The tone is in the fingers, but it certainly matters where, and how those fingers meet the strings.

 

[Judge Nickels]

Another approach to getting the most out of technique is to play a gig (or 100) plugged directly into an amp, without touching any of the knobs on the bass.

One of my favorite basses has a single pickup wired directly to the jack, with only a mute switch in between. You end up thinking a lot like an upright player using an instrument like that. Technique is all you have to alter the tone, so you quickly learn how to make the most of it.

I like to take this idea a step further and practice at home on an unplugged electric bass. Whenever a beginner asks me for "1 piece of advice" I always suggest this. Once you get to the point where you sound big, clean and clear on an unplugged electric bass you will sound titanic plugged in.

 

[Lobster11]

I like to take this idea a step further and practice at home on an unplugged electric bass. Whenever a beginner asks me for "1 piece of advice" I always suggest this. Once you get to the point where you sound big, clean and clear on an unplugged electric bass you will sound titanic plugged in.

I completely disagree with this. Practicing unplugged -- unless you're using a pick -- encourages you to pluck much harder than you need to in order to be able to hear yourself, which defeats the purpose of learning to vary your technique in subtle ways. If you're going to play the instrument through an amp, you should practice through an amp (or headphones, if you really want to hear all the subtle details).

 

[Mushroo]

Interesting topic.

One recurring trope I've noticed on TalkBass through the years goes like this:

"I love Paul McCartney's music, but you shouldn't learn to play like him because he has questionable technique."
or
"I love Sting's music, but you shouldn't learn to play like him because he has questionable technique."
or
"I love Tal Wilkenfeld's music, but you shouldn't learn to play like her because she has questionable technique."
(and so forth)

I go back and forth on this. Some days I think, I should only study the technique of players with a certain "ideal" skill set, or else I might learn bad habits. Other days I think, maybe there is value to studying the actual real-world techniques used by in-the-trenches players with long, successful careers.

A specific example would be, wrapping my left-hand thumb over the neck to mute the E string. A lot of textbooks will tell me not to do that. But then I watch videos of my musical heroes and see lots of them use this technique; not just one or two. So who should I listen to? The textbook telling me to do one thing, or the experienced pros actually doing the opposite?

I don't know the answer. Just trying to stimulate the conversation.

 

[Lobster11]

Interesting topic.

One recurring trope I've noticed on TalkBass through the years goes like this:

"I love Paul McCartney's music, but you shouldn't learn to play like him because he has questionable technique."
or
"I love Sting's music, but you shouldn't learn to play like him because he has questionable technique."
or
"I love Tal Wilkenfeld's music, but you shouldn't learn to play like her because she has questionable technique."
(and so forth)

I go back and forth on this. Some days I think, I should only study the technique of players with a certain "ideal" skill set, or else I might learn bad habits. Other days I think, maybe there is value to studying the actual real-world techniques used by in-the-trenches players with long, successful careers.

A specific example would be, wrapping my left-hand thumb over the neck to mute the E string. A lot of textbooks will tell me not to do that. But then I watch videos of my musical heroes and see lots of them use this technique; not just one or two. So who should I listen to? The textbook telling me to do one thing, or the experienced pros actually doing the opposite?

I don't know the answer. Just trying to stimulate the conversation.

I think you're making a really important point here. Emulating the specific finger-movements of great players isn't necessarily the best way to cop their sound. Jamerson famously plucked with one finger, for example, but I think it would be a serious mistake to think that adopting that physical technique is the best way to sound like him.

This makes me think that when we say "the tone is in the fingers," that isn't true literally; perhaps it would be more accurate to say that the tone is in the player. It's more about what they are hearing in their head and reproducing with their fingers, in whatever way they happen to accomplish this, than in their fingers per se.

 

[lz4005]

I completely disagree with this. Practicing unplugged -- unless you're using a pick -- encourages you to pluck much harder than you need to in order to be able to hear yourself, which defeats the purpose of learning to vary your technique in subtle ways. If you're going to play the instrument through an amp, you should practice through an amp (or headphones, if you really want to hear all the subtle details).

It's easy to play unplugged in a quiet room and hear all the details, using exactly the same right hand dynamics you would plugged in. You just have to use your brain and remember not to play too hard. Maybe it doesn't work for people with hearing damage or loud rooms or something, but otherwise it isn't a problem.

 

[jamro217]

If tone isn't in your fingers, how do explain someone who goes from novice to pro using the same gear for two or three years? At first their tone is garbage, before long it's great. Changing strings notwithstanding.

 

[SteveC]

We hear "tone is in the fingers" frequently. Sure, gear matters too, but Geddy Lee is going to sound remarkably like Geddy Lee whether he's playing on a Jazz through an Orange or an acoustic sitting around a campfire. (That would be an awesome camping trip, but I digress.) The notes that are played, how the strings are attacked, where the strings are plucked and with what, how the left hand lifts or mutes the notes, all of these matter to the eventual tone.

So, I've decided to study how particular bassists play. Try to emulate their left and right hand styles, not just the notes on paper (or iPad). The end result is to just have more arrows in the quiver to attack any given situation.

I think this is valid. I am down to one main bass for the last 6 years, and one "backup" bass. I have all the "gear" I need to sound good. Not just like him or her, but good, and like me. I have been told many times that I sound like me. That's a good thing. I was using one of my old amps at a jazz reading session at a local store. I had traded it in on something. Anyway, piano player whom I've played with for a while says man, your tone is baked into that amp.

Studying bassist is good. When I joined a funk/horn band, I bought the Rocco VCR tape and book (yes that long ago) and tried to copy his style - hands and notes. I learned a lot. Do I sound like Rocco? No. Do I have a decent approximation of that style/tone when needed? I think so. Joined a contemporary jazz group, listened to and tried to grasp Jimmy Haslip, Nathan East, people like that. Same piano player at a gig, playing some standard, turns to me after I played a little lick and says man, you sounded like Nathan East with that lick.

Be yourself, but we are all influenced by the players - bass and otherwise - to which we listen and thats a good thing.

 

[saabfender]

I love musical impressions on any instrument. I almost explode when I hear one done well. I also love doing them. It's the way I got through playing drums for years: imagining me as another guy in my mind's eye and trying to play like him.

Interesting topic.

One recurring trope I've noticed on TalkBass through the years goes like this:

"I love Paul McCartney's music, but you shouldn't learn to play like him because he has questionable technique."
or
"I love Sting's music, but you shouldn't learn to play like him because he has questionable technique."
or
"I love Tal Wilkenfeld's music, but you shouldn't learn to play like her because she has questionable technique."
(and so forth)

Most players who are interesting to listen to have some aspects of "questionable technique" to their playing. That's where the hook to do a meaningful impression lies.

 

[Mushroo]

I think you're making a really important point here. Emulating the specific finger-movements of great players isn't necessarily the best way to cop their sound. Jamerson famously plucked with one finger, for example, but I think it would be a serious mistake to think that adopting that physical technique is the best way to sound like him.

This makes me think that when we say "the tone is in the fingers," that isn't true literally; perhaps it would be more accurate to say that the tone is in the player. It's more about what they are hearing in their head and reproducing with their fingers, in whatever way they happen to accomplish this, than in their fingers per se.

Jamerson is a great example because, as primarily a studio musician, he would have been more concerned with how his technique sounds than how it looks. And given how our tone is the sum total of many variables (including which finger(s) we pluck with, which fingers we use to fret, how we incorporate open strings, etc.) I would not be surprised if the one-finger thing was a conscious artistic decision, for that particular music, in that particular studio environment. Maybe Jamerson tried it both ways (one finger vs two fingers), listened to the playback with the producers, and decided using one finger gave a more consistent attack, or resulted in more musical phrasing, or sounded better in the mix. Or maybe it was even a purely practical consideration, like perhaps one time he flubbed a take using two-finger plucking, and then nailed it on the second take with one-finger technique, so the producer said "I need you to always play it like that in the future because we can't afford to waste studio time."

Where I think it gets really tricky is with new players. How is a beginner supposed to know whether Jamerson's one-finger technique is a reason why he had great tone, or did he have great tone despite this unusual technique? Or (another example relevant to my own experience as a beginner in the '90s) watch the RHCP and how best to emulate Flea's slap technique. This is where I think an experienced teacher can be very helpful. The teacher can help "separate the signal from the noise" and explain to the student, "these are the important factors you should be working work on."

 

[Watchootognbout]

Sure it is.
With just an adjustment of finger position a Gibby EBO with flats will sound like a Ric 4001 with rounds.

 

[Judge Nickels]

I completely disagree with this. Practicing unplugged -- unless you're using a pick -- encourages you to pluck much harder than you need to in order to be able to hear yourself, which defeats the purpose of learning to vary your technique in subtle ways. If you're going to play the instrument through an amp, you should practice through an amp (or headphones, if you really want to hear all the subtle details).

YMMV. Of course you're going to spend a lot of time playing through an amp in normal day to day musician world. In my experience, being able to make an unplugged bass project big and clean means you have a high ceiling for your dynamics when you're plugged in as well as more control over your sound at the very source of it.