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Double Bass Undergrad And Graduate School Ideas

#21
Oh yeah
interesting statement made by a conductor i just worked with...
Medical schools like seeing a undergrad degree in music. Shows that they know how to work their asses off.
Anyone go to medical school after completing an undergrad in performance???????
Just a wondering.
 
#22
Dr_Atomic said:
+1. Good one.

Edgar was a math major at IU.

Joel Smirnoff, the first-violinist of the Juilliard Quartet, was a history major as an undergraduate.

Bill Buchman, the principal bassoon in the CSO, was a physics major at Brown.

My former teacher in NY was very keen on becoming a doctor before deciding to go full-time into bass.
Click to expand...

I would argue that the amount of talent at a young age is increasing and its becoming increasingly hard to win an orchestral job if your not only doing undergraduate music but also doing a masters at a top school. Most of the top players are coming out of four places: Boston U, Indiana, Curtis and Rice. While this is true I have tinkered with the idea of double major in music and math/physics. not because I dont want to do music, but because I am very interested in both fields. I have the lucky situation of having a lot of AP credits though that will assist me.
 
#23
Dr_Atomic said:
+1. Good one.

Edgar was a math major at IU.

Joel Smirnoff, the first-violinist of the Juilliard Quartet, was a history major as an undergraduate.

Bill Buchman, the principal bassoon in the CSO, was a physics major at Brown.

My former teacher in NY was very keen on becoming a doctor before deciding to go full-time into bass.
Click to expand...

so, basically, if i am dedicated enough and work my ass off it is possible.
this about answered my question
 
#26
I think it is great that you are beginning to think about these things while you are still a sophomore.

A back up plan is excellent, and you should always have one unless you are studying in a field that has an almost 100% guarantee for employment. Personally, I'd recommend something like music education. Besides the general teacher-related perks (a 9 month job with free summers, job security, competitive salary, etc.), you'll spend a lot of time in the music building, which could help your aspirations of becoming a professional musician.

When choosing your undergrad program - if music is your end goal, remember that all majors are not the same. Certain subjects are much easier than others, e.g., political science & communications vs. electrical / chemical engineering. That said, certain course loads will not allow you to take a minor in music, with respect to the time required for both subjects. I had a music minor at University of Delaware (major in chemical engineering), and dropped it after my 3rd semester. I simply didn't have enough time to maintain the private lessons, practicing for orchestra, etc. at an acceptable level. Also, some academic programs / majors do not accept music classes as electives - something to keep in mind. I took the 1st year theory course at UD, but it did not count towards my degree requirements. A great course & I learned a lot, but had no value in the engineering department.

W.R.T. tuition - for most schools, you can attend a school as an out-of-state resident and pay out-of-state prices. If you establish residency within that state for at least 1 year, you may qualify as an in-state resident, with lower tuition. Make sure to read the rules carefully - the rules at each school may be slightly different, regarding residency & residency requirements. Make sure your folks are on-board with the ideas also, as they may be footing a portion of the bill.

Keep playing as much as you can and have as much fun as possible!

Ian
 
#27
Thanks Ian. That really helped.
Say I went to UMD for music ed as an undergrad, studied with Mr. oppelt in performance, and once again, continue practicing as much as i can, ...

would anyone see there being any real downfall to that plan???

I know one of the conductors/ coordinators at UMD and know that that they do give full rides to students going into the Music Ed program who have the chops.
Then after i graduate, go to Julliard or wherever to get a nice graduate degree in performance

Ive known about this option for a while but i just didnt think that music ed was that safe of an option.... Im wrong aren't i?
 
#28
ADissen said:
Geez. Why such a downer?
Click to expand...

Cuz making it as a symphony musician is hard enough when you get all the training of an undergrad education is hard enough. An undergrad contains more than just lessons. You get to play in a top level college orchestra, you get theory lessons, you get chances to take exclusive master classes, you build bonds with other musicians that will be of value to you and you don't have all the other distractions. My opinion is clear, if you wanna do music thats what you should study in college. In my mind what you're suggesting is like saying "I'm gonna study Chemistry, so that I can be a great Psychologist." To me it doesn't add up, I think the music undergraduate education is worth the money.
 
#29
What are the OP's specific goals as a "music professional"? I think that the paths you should take are very different depending on what you specifically want to do.

1-Do you want to play in a full-time "Major Symphony Orchestra"? (this is what I'm guessing because of the fourm it's in)
2-Do you want to play in a part-time regional orchestra and do other music gigging/teaching to round out your income?
3-Would you be happy playing in a part-time regional orchestra more for fun and working a "normal" job for your income?
4-Do you want to play jazz in clubs and try to tour and record?
5-Do you want to write music?
6-Do you want to play popular music?

If 1, then you have to be completely focused on playing classical music. Forget about anything else, there's too much competition.

If 2 or 3, then your plan could be good. If you get tired of the hustle of trying to get students and getting music gigs, then you can do some other sort of job. And you still get the pleasure of playing classical music even if it is with a small-time orchestra.

If any of the others, why bother getting a music degree? Just get a crappy job to pay the bills for a number of years, study with whoever you can, and work towards making your art.

An aside - what is the market like for music educators for school systems in the US? I was always under the impression that there weren't that many jobs for that, but the posts here seem to be hinting that it's a good field to find work in.
 
#30
Eli_Upright12 said:
Cuz making it as a symphony musician is hard enough when you get all the training of an undergrad education is hard enough. An undergrad contains more than just lessons. You get to play in a top level college orchestra, you get theory lessons, you get chances to take exclusive master classes, you build bonds with other musicians that will be of value to you and you don't have all the other distractions. My opinion is clear, if you wanna do music thats what you should study in college. In my mind what you're suggesting is like saying "I'm gonna study Chemistry, so that I can be a great Psychologist." To me it doesn't add up, I think the music undergraduate education is worth the money.
Click to expand...

When you minor in performance do you get to have the extra "perks"?
 
#31
ADissen said:
When you minor in performance do you get to have the extra "perks"?
Click to expand...

I believe you do, but you would get your lessons(possibly only from a grad student) and only part of the theory series. You would get to do the master classes, but probably not studio classes which are just as important as your regular lessons. If you were good enough you could still audition for the orchestra, but preference is usually given to majors in all of these cases.
 
#33
dgelting said:
What are the OP's specific goals as a "music professional"? I think that the paths you should take are very different depending on what you specifically want to do.

1-Do you want to play in a full-time "Major Symphony Orchestra"? (this is what I'm guessing because of the fourm it's in)
2-Do you want to play in a part-time regional orchestra and do other music gigging/teaching to round out your income?
3-Would you be happy playing in a part-time regional orchestra more for fun and working a "normal" job for your income?
4-Do you want to play jazz in clubs and try to tour and record?
5-Do you want to write music?
6-Do you want to play popular music?

If 1, then you have to be completely focused on playing classical music. Forget about anything else, there's too much competition.

If 2 or 3, then your plan could be good. If you get tired of the hustle of trying to get students and getting music gigs, then you can do some other sort of job. And you still get the pleasure of playing classical music even if it is with a small-time orchestra.

If any of the others, why bother getting a music degree? Just get a crappy job to pay the bills for a number of years, study with whoever you can, and work towards making your art.

An aside - what is the market like for music educators for school systems in the US? I was always under the impression that there weren't that many jobs for that, but the posts here seem to be hinting that it's a good field to find work in.
Click to expand...


I would have to go ahead and choose # 1.5
My main goal/dream is to be a full time orchestra member.
but keeping it on the realistic side of things, i know the competition is fierce and that career doesnt always work out even if you are as talented as Edgar Meyer.
I would throw myself into the career after i knew i had a "safety net".
I dont necessarily consider this safety net another career being taught to me at the same time as i try to learn the tools of the trade for bass performance, although having a double degree is another option of the safety net.
What i am really concerned with is being left with a ton of debt from an undergrad major in performance and no real job.
If i got the scholarships to pursue an undergrad degree in performance at a great school and not have a huge figure of debt then that is enough safety net for me as i wouldnt be tied down by the massive debt if i wanted to go to... (example) med school if my post-undergrad career doesnt work out.
 
#34
Eli_Upright12 said:
I believe you do, but you would get your lessons(possibly only from a grad student) and only part of the theory series. You would get to do the master classes, but probably not studio classes which are just as important as your regular lessons. If you were good enough you could still audition for the orchestra, but preference is usually given to majors in all of these cases.
Click to expand...

The minor is just one option.
i dont know.
 
#36
How about this option: Find a community college with a great bass teacher, get your gen-ed's out of the way for half the price, practice your butt off and then make a decision. The first two years of any major has generally the same requirements as another, and there are a lot of symphony cats rounding out their income in the community colleges. Saves a lot of money and gives you time to figure it out.
 
#38
I'm all for planning ahead, but it seems like you are limiting yourself (and too early, at that). Just keep learning, practicing, and connecting to the music world. You have the advantage of deciding this early what you want to do, but by no means should you decide or invent a rigid path to prosperity. Let time and experience decide what you do.
 
#39
When I went to school at MSM, my former room mate, who had already gotten her BM from MSM, got her Masters' in Piano Performance, also from MSM. As she was working nights/weekends as a lab tech.

Then she went to medical school. Now she's a doc. Only one I knew, personally, who walked in both worlds to equal degrees (no pun intended).

The exact opposite of what you are asking about, I realize. For the record, she had no trust fund, no family money, no emotional support from her family (met them once, they were Doozies, and made her accomplishment and strength seem truly miraculous), no rich boyfriend.

She did it all on her own, with sheer grit, drive, and brains. She worked and practiced her *ss off, got scholarships, put herself through all of her schooling. She didn't eat or sleep much. I knew she was home when I heard Scriabin, Beethoven, or Rachmaninoff's 2nd Piano Concerto going in the apartment.

She was a monster player and a great person. Haven't seen her in decades but she still inspires me when I think of her.
 
#40
Not trying to toot my own horn but... I'm doing two majors (music theory + physics/math) and a minor (german) at the #8 university in the world and I still get bass fellowships and scholarships and stuff, and I've got a bunch of great teachers. Maybe I've just been lucky but if you work really hard and put yourself out there (be pro-active) you can do whatever you want in life... at least I think so...
 

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