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Underpowering Cabinet Question?

Frankenwill

Frankenwill

May 6, 2011
79
0
Sugar Hill, Georgia
www.facebook.com
#1
I currently have an orange Terror Bass 500 head and an orange sp410 isobaric cabinet as well as an ampeg 8x10 cabinet. I've started to notice that playing at the loud volumes I'd like to be, the head begins to distort at relatively medium settings (volume and gain at 11 oclock) and begins to sound really "farty" for lack of a better term. Is this because the amp only pushes 500 watts and the cabinets are rated for 1200 watts (orange sp410) and 800 watts RMS (Ampeg 8x10)? Would upgrading the head to a TB1000 help out, or is the problem elsewhere? Any other head reccomendations to get more low end and general volume? I don't feel like this should be a problem, but it is. Thanks!
 
#3
It sounds like you're overpowering the cab(s).

Ignore the wattage, that is pretty meaningless as a cab is rated at X watts at 1khz which doesn't require much speaker cone movement to reproduce (maybe less than 1mm).

With low frequencies, like the low E on your bass, the cab will take much less, depending on the speakers in the cab, as the cones have to move a lot further, and will eventually reach their effective limit.

You can help this by backing off on any bass eq you may have added. Try boosting low mids instead - this can give a good punchy effect without farting the speakers out.

Cheers,

Jim
 
#5
Also, a gentleman at the local music store warned me that if I cranked the volume or gain or both past 12 oclock, I risked damaging the drivers in the cabinet as well as the head itself....Not sure if this is accurate, but it's got me paranoid. So even if I get a decent tone and less "farty" sound I worry that I am pushing it too much.
 
#6
'Farting' is a term most people use to describe speakers that are being driven too hard with a low frequency signal, like that from a bass geetar.

I'm no expert here, but I think that if there was a problem with the amp it wouldn't necessarily show up when the volume was cranked - it would more likely sound crap all the time, IME of broken amps.....

If it sounds ok if you back the volume/bass eq off a tad, I would bet that it is the speakers.

How loud have you got that thing!!!

Jim
 
#7
jimcroisdale said:
How loud have you got that thing!!!
Click to expand...

That's just it, it's loud, but not REALLY loud. My band plays lighter acoustic folk rock, and I have a tough time cutting through the mix, filling in the low end without cranking it. I'm only competing with drums, an acoustic guitar, and an electric guitar. The guitars are playing through small vox combo 2x12 for electric, and an old fender tweed 1x12 tube amp. The drums aren't miced for practice. Seems like my big daddy rig should shake the house down in comparison to theirs. I'm beginning to think it may be a low output problem from my actual bass.... 1980 rickenbacker 4003. Perhaps a good setup, wiring/pickup checkup or repair is in order?
 
#10
Frankenwill said:
I currently have an orange Terror Bass 500 head and an orange sp410 isobaric cabinet as well as an ampeg 8x10 cabinet. I've started to notice that playing at the loud volumes I'd like to be, the head begins to distort at relatively medium settings (volume and gain at 11 oclock)!
Click to expand...
For maximum clean output turn the volume all the way up, turn up the gain only as much as required. The single 8x10 should be all you need, BTW. For that matter I'd think the 410 alone would be enough considering what you're competing with.
 
#15
Frankenwill said:
Bass is not boosted or cut, but if I start to boost, the nasty "farty" sounds starts quicker as I increase the volume.
Click to expand...
That indicates either the pre-amp or power amp or speaker is out of headroom. I suspect it's from having your master volume way too low, as even the 810 alone should be massively loud powered with 500 watts.

BTW, how are you able to run both cabs when that amp is only rated for 4 ohm operation?
 
#16
Wow, a 4x10 and an 8x10 and you're not cutting through? Maybe it's the acoustics of the room you're in or is this everywhere y'all play? If your band is not a loud band, I don't understand how you can't be heard. I run 2 GK Neo112's and we can get pretty loud at times but I'm nowhere near the loudest I can get and quite often get told to turn it down.

Wondering if that amp has a tube and it can do overdrive/grit? As mentioned above....with the gain higher than the volume...maybe this is what's happening.
 
#17
jimcroisdale said:
It sounds like you're overpowering the cab(s).

Ignore the wattage, that is pretty meaningless as a cab is rated at X watts at 1khz which doesn't require much speaker cone movement to reproduce (maybe less than 1mm).

With low frequencies, like the low E on your bass, the cab will take much less, depending on the speakers in the cab, as the cones have to move a lot further, and will eventually reach their effective limit.

You can help this by backing off on any bass eq you may have added. Try boosting low mids instead - this can give a good punchy effect without farting the speakers out.

Cheers,

Jim
Click to expand...

+1
 
#18
The BassGearMag review of the Orange 500 shows quite a bit of bass boost with the control at noon. To make the amp "optimally flat" they turned the bass and treble both to fullest CUT position, and mid to fullest boost (!)

At ay rate, OP, you can't make speakers distort by not giving them enough power, or they'd distort like mad whenver you play quietly. You could try a bit of bass cut to see if that cleans things up.
 

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