Using low frets and empty string notes

[Shenron]

Sorry for this to sound a bit like drunken rambling... I am trying to collect my thoughts as I type.

I try out a lot of new songs all the time, from transcriptions I find on the web and such. Sometimes the tablature transcriptions are using low frets (1-4) on the higher strings (ADG), when they could have used higher frets (5-8) on a lower string (EAD) instead. And most of these times, I hate it. It just feels unnecessarily more straining on the fingers, adding tension for the additional stretch required or otherwise forcing you to do more hand shifts to avoid stretching... I can imagine it could be a choice dictated by tone, but the problem is that I am starting to also hate specifically the tone of low frets compared to higher frets. Is tone the only reason why someone would want to play a groove on low frets of ADG instead of middle frets of EAD? Obviously, the lowest notes of the E string can be played only on that string, so if the groove includes notes between the lowest E and G#, then this could be another reason to play the whole groove in the 1st-4th frets area as it is overall less straining than other ways, and in such case I would myself make the same choice even if not liking the tone much.

A somewhat related thing that I am starting to question in many tablatures is the use of empty string notes ("fret zero") seemingly at random among those lower frets notes. Now the technical problem with empty string notes, is that you cannot mute/stop them in the same way you can stop a fretted note. I am aware that you can stop a ringing note in many ways, for instance by touching the string with unused left hand fingers, with right hand finger or even with your right hand wrist, but all these ways may or may not work depending on what else you might need to do with those other fingers at that moment. Empty string notes cannot instead be muted/stopped by the quickest and most effortless method, which is simply releasing the pressure of the finger which played the fretted note, exactly because no (left hand) finger plays an empty string note. So whenever these empty string notes are mixed up with fretted notes, it causes me a lot of trouble to control the exact end of each note duration, as I have to figure out a different way to mute them compared to all the fretted notes.

Because I noticed this mainly in web-found unofficial tabs, I just wonder if these are really purposeful choices by the transcriber, or merely the result of the transcriptions being done by people who just put down "correct notes" without giving a thought about where on the neck is the best place to play them. So I'd like to hear if these are for you perfectly normal and comfortable ways to play or if you perhaps share my preference for fretted notes over empty string notes* and higher frets of lower string over lower frets of higher strings.

*as a disclaimer, I am not completely against empty string notes! I love them in arpeggios, pull-offs, single-string patterns and even some double-stops. I only hate them when they seem played at seemingly random places among fretted notes.

 

[JonathanPDX]

I'm not hip to the current tab scene, but back in my tab days many years ago they were mostly created by other amateurs, beginners, or journeymen musicians who didn't have the full understanding and skill of a more experienced musician. As such, tabs often had incorrect notes, poor or impossible fingerings, and omitted some notes or simplified things to match the tab-creators skill level, even if the song had more complex elements within.

Even official transcription books have been known to include incorrect tabs that had bad fingerings or wrong notes.

So, tab is a fine tool to use, but it shouldn't ever replace your ear. You may find tabs for very complex songs (for example, solo bass arrangements by guys like Victor Wooten) where the fingering is actually important, as there may be just one fingering that makes sense to play a given passage, but outside of that there are usually several fingering options available and your own level of skill, fretboard understanding, and even physical ability to stretch and shift may determine which fingering to use when playing.

On gigs I'd often shift to less "ideal" fingerings while walking just to stretch out my tendons and give my fingers a rest. It may result in more movement, but if it prevents a specific muscle from getting fatigued then it's actually more efficient over the course of a gig.

 

[Rocket Queen]

Get a:
1. 5-string bass, with a
2. zero fret

 

[MrLenny1]

Yup, get a 5 string and most Tabs are not worth reading.

 

[Wasnex]

I don't generally use TAB, although I can figure it out when it's the only available resource. IMHO, TAB is sort of a "double-edged sword." The primary benefit is it shows you exactly where the author thinks you should play the notes. Of course that is also the problem with TAB, as you may have a different way that works better for you. The way around this is to use TAB to learn the notes, and then finger them how ever you think is best.

I came up on upright bass, and was first taught to use the open strings.

I actually find notes on lower frets easier to play. Part of that may be because of the way I set up my basses. A lot of basses have the nut cut a lot higher than I like. My perception is this causes string tension to ramp up quickly across frets 3,2,1. I also find it makes the tension across strings seem uneven near the nut.

I usually file the slots down so the tension does not ramp up on the low frets...and I also try to make the tension at the low frets feel relatively even across the strings.

I originally used Simandl finger on bass guitar (1,2,4). Eventually I transitioned to one finger per fret (OFPF). The spacing between notes is bigger close to the nut, and occasionally this causes problems for me. I.E. the reach between my fingers is not quite enough for some OFPF patterns. The problem is related to the strength required to play certain minor patterns low on the B and E string. So it does not really influence my tendency to play close to the neck. The solution is to use something other than OFPF fingering. I might revert to Simandl fingering or I may use a alternate 4-finger pattern that uses micro-shifts to avoid the excessive reach.

I do think having an extra half step under my fingers increases my tendency to play up the neck and avoid the open strings. Playing a 6-string for a very long time has also increased my tendency to play across the strings, but I don't like enharmonicity that creeps in as I play up the neck on the E and B string. I usually prefer the purer tone of notes played closer to the nut. IMHO E starts to become unusable around about the 10th fret and the B starts getting nasty by the 5th fret.

As far as tone of the open strings. On most basses it doesn't bother me. The tone changes incrementally as I play frets 0,1,2,3,4. The tone also changes incrementally as I play 1,2,3,4,5. IMHO on most basses the 5th fret sticks out from 1 just as much as the open string sticks out from 4...perhaps more in some instance.

I do have a bass with a brass nut were the open strings really jump out garishly. The bass also has the bridge mounted closer to the center of the body. This makes the reach to the nut further, which makes it harder for me to play near the nut. It's rougher on my hand and my shoulder.

In regards to muting the open strings. Since I learned from the beginning to play the open strings, I don't find muting the open strings to be a problem. If you want to do it well, practice. Also you have to mute the open strings, regardless of whether you play open strings are not. This was a fairly big issue for me when I first started playing 6-string, but now it happens pretty much automatically.

 

[SteveCS]

...
I noticed this mainly in web-found unofficial tabs, I just wonder if these are really purposeful choices by the transcriber, or merely the result of the transcriptions being done by people who just put down "correct notes" without giving a thought about where on the neck is the best place to play them.
...

There is a 'third way', which is that the TAB is being generated by a notation program. Typically the TAB is linked to a standard notation staff which is where the editing is done. The TAB 'follows' the standard notation but is often biased towards placing notes on open ('empty') strings and in lower positions on the neck. These automated functions sometimes come up with irrational, illogical and even the occasional impossible fingering which always needs some level of review or sanity check.

 

[albertus]

stop reading tabs, start reading music and play whatever feels confortable to you

 

[Lance Bunyon]

The first thing I do with a song is position it to where I'm comfortable. I exclusively play 5 string.

 

[BASSDROID]

Is tone the only reason why someone would want to play a groove on low frets of ADG instead of middle frets of EAD?

- No. As you have pointed out it may simply be the most economical way to play that particular passage.

Because I noticed this mainly in web-found unofficial tabs, I just wonder if these are really purposeful choices by the transcriber, or merely the result of the transcriptions being done by people who just put down "correct notes" without giving a thought about where on the neck is the best place to play them.

- Yes, Both reasons are entirely plausible.

As I see it, the larger issue here is mastery of the instrument. Mastery means complete control and confidence in that level of control. Controlling shapes, dynamics, tone, and durations of notes on open strings falls into that category. Yes it takes a different process to do it, but it is entirely possible.

One of the concepts I try to impart to my students is that it is necesary to explore all possible fingerings for a given passage before settling on the one that works the best according to the musical effect that you are after and what you are physically capable of. So developing fingerings is more of a process of discovery rather than searching for "the correct answer"... whatever anyone thinks that may be.

I would suggest that the next time you are faced with a fingering that seems illogical or unpleasant, take that as a challenge and try to make that fingering as musical as possible. Instead of asking "why" ask "how". It may not ultimately be the fingering you choose to use, but you are very likely to learn a thing or two or three in the process of making it work.

 

[KenSmithFan]

Music is not a math equation where there is only one correct answer. Decide what notes you want to play, then decide where and how you want to play them. It’s just that simple.

 

[Shenron]

stop reading tabs, start reading music and play whatever feels confortable to you

I think you (and others) missed the point of the thread, but it is my fault because I should have avoided mentioning tabs multiple times...

My question is not about the tabs, my question is about playing notes on lower frets of high strings and on open strings. Tabs using these are only what made me notice that I don't like them, and the abundance of such tabs made me question if I am in a minority that doesn't like them, and instead maybe most bass players actually prefer using them (but if otherwise it is entirely a problem with the tabs themselves, then it's good to know!).

And yes, clearly it's a personal choice at the end, between tone/performance and comfort, but I would like to hear what are people's most common preferences or otherwise if they don't have a preference at all.

 

[FullumMusic]

There is a 'third way', which is that the TAB is being generated by a notation program. Typically the TAB is linked to a standard notation staff which is where the editing is done. The TAB 'follows' the standard notation but is often biased towards placing notes on open ('empty') strings and in lower positions on the neck. These automated functions sometimes come up with irrational, illogical and even the occasional impossible fingering which always needs some level of review or sanity check.

^^^ This is probably the most likely situation.

Really, save yourself a bit of headache and don't put too much weight into any Tab you find online, or the nitty-gritty details of it. Online tabs and tutorials and play-alongs are just what some random person thinks the notes are. There's nobody reviewing these things for accuracy before they're posted to Chordify or Ultimate Tab or YouTube or whatever. Anyone can post anything. Usually i find it's kinda close enough. But more often than not, i find it's outright wrong.

Use tabs as a rough guide and use your ears to figure out the details, and decide which is the best and easiest position to play the line for yourself.

I find keyboard tutorials way more useful for figuring out bass-lines on my own than the long string of arbitrary numbers that is tab. The usefulness of keyboard tutorials is very genre dependent. But a decent keys player understands chord voicing, and will give you a great harmonic understanding of everything that's going on in the song, and makes figuring out the bass-line way easier. Bass "tutorials" and tabs are often just people spouting off a string of notes or numbers with zero musical context and it becomes rote memorization, if the tab or tutorial is even playing the right notes, which they're often not.

 

[MCS4]

The only thing that really matters about what you have noticed is that identical notes do have different characteristics when played on different strings in different areas of the fretboard and when played on open strings versus on frets. Choosing which to play in a given situation is completely a matter of personal preference, and there is no better/worse or right/wrong choice. Heck, it is even a matter of personal preference as to whether you are more likely to choose the option that you feel sounds the best or the option that the easiest or most economical to play, which might not be the same thing. Some people tend to operate by default preferences or rules -- for example, some people try to play open strings whenever possible, but others prefer to play open strings as rarely as possible, for very different reasons -- but others, including myself, just do whatever sounds and feels best for a particular part, which could be anything.

 

[MCS4]

A somewhat related thing that I am starting to question in many tablatures is the use of empty string notes ("fret zero") seemingly at random among those lower frets notes.

It might or might not be relevant to the tabs you are looking up, but there very much are bass players who will use an open string whenever physically possible. James Jamerson is an example commonly cited for this. It is also a characteristic of upright bass playing that can sometimes leak over in bassists who have an upright background (such as Jamerson).

 

[SteveCS]

my question is about playing notes on lower frets of high strings and on open strings.
...
And yes, clearly it's a personal choice at the end, between tone/performance and comfort, but I would like to hear what are people's most common preferences or otherwise if they don't have a preference at all.
...

Having tonal/timbral options is part of the unique nature of stringed instruments as compared to say piano. Each has it's uses and I try to make a conscious effort to 1) make deliberate decisions on fingering and 2) prioritise the demands of the music over comfort, convenience or efficiency when making those decisions. There are some things for which I go to the very top of the fingerboard on the 3rd and 4th (A and E) strings for that dulled attack and thick gooey resonance creates an energy not present in the middle of the neck on the 1st and 2nd strings. Then there are times where I need the cutting brightness of the first few positions on the 1st and 2nd strings.

As far as preference is concerned, historically I would have preferred lower positions on higher strings. Now it is all over the map and the preference, if you can call it that, is to choose what is best for the music, which sometimes adds complexity to the execution.

 

[mambo4]

I would like to hear what are people's most common preferences or otherwise if they don't have a preference at all.

I love open strings and lower fret tones, way more overtones and clarity
Plus the challenge and novelty of smoothly incorporating open strings is fun
Plus my bass GOAT James Jamerson used exactly those open positions to revolutionize the instrument.

But some songs call for the fat bass sound and stronger fundamental you get from a closed position
So Context matters as always

One thing I have noticed in my own pursuits:
If you play heavy handed with the plucking hand
the difference between fretted and open will be more pronounced
and open strings will be less controlled
But, If you play with lighter touch , you get a more even response and more control.

So maybe your dislike of open strings and lower positions is technique related

 

[Killing Floor]

Play the notes in the most efficacious hand positions. Simple as that.

 

[Queue]

I learn a song, and work out where I like to play it. Sometimes that changes over time. Sometimes I'll check YouTube to see where/how the artist plays a song, but don't always follow suit.

The biggest downside to playing open notes is that if you learn a song that way, you cannot easily change keys.

Do what feels and sounds good to you.

 

[BASSDROID]

My question is not about the tabs, my question is about playing notes on lower frets of high strings and on open strings.

And yes, clearly it's a personal choice at the end, between tone/performance and comfort, but I would like to hear what are people's most common preferences or otherwise if they don't have a preference at all.

I love all the notes equally. There are no bad or better notes, but there are bad or better decisions. A note by itself has no inherent goodness or badness. What's done with it and in what context is the essential source of it's meaning and musical value.

 

[Smooth_bass88]

I would recommend that you never ever use tabulartue; instead, focus on learning songs by ear and playing them in a position that is most comfortable. Over time you will develop your ear, and this is an invaluable skill. Also, learn how to read music