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Using MIDI tracks for live performance

D

drunkenrobot

May 31, 2007
141
0
England, Derbyshire
#1
Since our drummer quit the band, the remaining 3; bass, guitar/keys, and singer have been thinking about going the Enter Shikari route and using techno parts and drums (both in the form of a MIDI track) mixed together with our usual alt-rock style. We were thinking that the singer could operate a laptop with the pre-mixed MIDI tracks inbetween songs.

We would probably get a sampler/synth for the singer at some point and an actual drummer whenever someone became interested, so all this would be temporary.

Anywho, what I'm asking is; has anyone got any experience of using MIDI on stage? Any advice to share? If anyone has ever attempted what we're trying with the techno/rock mix, feel free to comment.

For anyone who doesn't know who Enter Shikari are, here's an example of the kind of thing we're aiming for (minus the screaming, our singer can't do it :p):


Cheers,
Rick
 
#6
I did it a lot, and I mean a bunch, back in the mid to late 80s.
At the time, we were using a DOS version of Cakewalk and Cakewalk Live! on a IBM 286 computer. It never failed us, it worked spot on every time.

You will have to be bang-on tight, there will be no room for improvisation, and if you do make a mess it'll very difficult to get back on track.
Click to expand...

I agree, sort of. You can leave room for improvisation, as in there will be an 8 bar solo here - but 8 bars will be all you get - no more no less.
We had our show rehearsed to fractions of a beat. Cakewalk was controlling the drums and keys, including the synth patches. I was using a MIDI guitar processor. I remember when we were working on the timing of patch changes, sometimes we'd be moving it 1/120th of a beat in order to avoid hearing the patch change.
I had a pedal controller, but I never used it. The computer/Cakewalk had all of my patches sequenced along with volume control, effects - everything. It worked well.

That said, If I were to do it today, I don't know that I'd go to that much trouble. I'd probably just burn a CD or mix down to an iPod or something and play along.
 
#7
I also used Cakewalk o a laptop for drums and some bass (I was playing guitar at the time). Cakewalk has a jukebox function were you can put together a setlist and set it to pause between songs so all you have to do is hit the spacebar when you're ready for the next song so if someone needs to change instruments or effect settings, or talk between songs (introduce the band, tell people to tip the wait staff, remind them about the tip jar, etc) it was easy to accomodate. Once a setlist was set up you could still skip songs or change up the order with the arrow keys or the mouse.
I was lucky that the on-board midi sounds were pretty decent in my laptop so all I did was take the laptop's line out directly into the board.
The way I set it up was to pan all the program material hard left on the laptop and add a metronome/click track panned hard right. I ran the stereo output of the laptop to 2 mono channels of the board so I could mix the program material as a mono signal into the FOH and monitors on one channel and put the metronome/click track into the monitors only. That way you can have a lot more dynamics, or start a song and not have the drums or bass come in until several bars later, but you do have to basically play the song the same way every time.
On the plus side, you can give the backing tracks to everyone in the band so they can practice on their own with it.
 
#9
drunkenrobot said:
Thanks for the reply, we hadn't actually considered this. But having something like Reaper or Cubase open surely gives more control over the tracks? We were also considering using a USB audio interface to control output levels on-the-fly. Could always use the CDs as a backup I suppose.
Click to expand...

What will you need to control live that you can't predetermine in rehearsal? I have been using sony MD players for years. I would probably go mp3 now, but i agree you want less stuff that can go wrong
 
#11
Been there! Done that! Hated it! Unless the tracks are killin' (greats sounds and mixed professionally) and you have a drummer (when & if you get one) who can follow flawlessly, don't waste your time!

Nothing worse than cheesy midi patches and chintsy drum sounds!! You also have to worry about crashing laptops and such! Lastly, have a dedicated person to run the doggone thing!
 
#12
I saw a guy (solo acoustic gee-tar)a few months back that was using Ableton Live (I think) to trigger his rhythm backing tracks. Only he wasn't using basic "canned" drum loops, he used more like "ambient percussion" type rhythm loops. It sounded really cool, very subtle, great sounding loops, that kept the pulse and rhythm of the song. (think conga's, shakers, African drums...) mixed pretty far back, just audible enough to keep the songs chugging along. I didn't get a chance to ask him about his set-up, but it looked pretty simple, just a laptop w/ audio out sent to the mixer.
This way it wouldn't be so much of a "drum machine replacing a drummer" type feel. At least that's the impression I got.
 
#13
liltommyg said:
Going to rehersal tonight using
1.drum machine
2.ableton
3.band in a box
I'll let you know which turns out the best (mostly classic rock songs)
Click to expand...

1. worked as expected - decent enough sound,
major problem with 2 & 3 - singer cannot count to four, all the time missing the ques. but to be fair the Ableton seemed better than the BIAB.

time for the old joke?
how do you know a singer is knockin at the door?
because no matter how many time you tell them,
they still don't know when to come in.
 

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