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Warwick vs. Fodera
- Thread starter Thomas Kievit
- Start date
Thanks a lot for your input Just Thumpin
Say, what about the Fodera YingYang Standard? It's about twice as cheap then Victor's signature bass. Except for a bolt on neck instead of a dovetail construction and painted YingYang finish, what else did you guys do to make it more affordable?
Plenty of info in these threads (including a skeptical me before I actually played one):
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f8/fodera-yin-yang-standard-wait-support-group-770174
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f8/fodera-yin-yang-standard-bass-731346
curbowkid said:
Like others, I just see CNC as another tool in the service of a luthier. If this were fifty years ago, someone would have been arguing against power tools.
I don't care which company is considered the best by the most people. Both have their own approach and I respect that.
Dr. Cheese said:
I agree, im just more a fan of more traditional construction methods if that makes any sense
wood age is not a factor in the equation. resonance properties and humidity might be.
hand carving vs. cnc is like comparing writing w/ fountain pen vs. typing on computer. different tools. montblanc fountain pen is not going to make you a better writer.
warwick claims all their wood is hand picked, matched for humidity and resonance before being fed to cnc robots.
played few warwicks, own one thumb. pretty good instrument, but not better than rickenbacker. my opinion. never touched fodera and never will. out of my reach by light years.
at the end of the day - all i can say is to have the deepest respect for anybody who spends his days [in half-lit room] w/ a chisel and a file in his hand.
hand carving vs. cnc is like comparing writing w/ fountain pen vs. typing on computer. different tools. montblanc fountain pen is not going to make you a better writer.
warwick claims all their wood is hand picked, matched for humidity and resonance before being fed to cnc robots.
played few warwicks, own one thumb. pretty good instrument, but not better than rickenbacker. my opinion. never touched fodera and never will. out of my reach by light years.
at the end of the day - all i can say is to have the deepest respect for anybody who spends his days [in half-lit room] w/ a chisel and a file in his hand.
The older the wood, the more stable it tends to be. Im a fan of Fodera and Warwick. I already own a Corvette std. But I just think of it as just another bass. I see Fodera basses as unique instruments with perfection down to the smallest detail.
That would've been Bass Alone. BSD's only about 3 years old. It wasn't that Salas, was it?
So is the take-home lesson "I played a bass 12 years ago from a builder so they must still suck" or "handmade doesn't necessarily mean good"?
- Aug 21, 2008
- 1,168
- 33
- Disclosures
- Endorsing Artist : Fodera Guitars , Harvest fine leather bags & straps
Fodera = handmade , high quality, Vinny is a true artist, very fine tone woods (you don't need fancy tops)
Warwick = CNC , nothing is handmade, cheap woods , totaly overpriced related to their building and material costs
Warwick = CNC , nothing is handmade, cheap woods , totaly overpriced related to their building and material costs
Now this may seem like a stupid comparison, but if you would look at these two brands / builders, which one does really jump out?
Today I had a small conversation with a guy who I know for a few years now and around the time I met him, he owned both a Warwick (Streamer Stage 1, 5 string) and a Fodera (Monarch 4 string). Unfortunatly, he had to sell both basses due to money issues..
Anyway, as far as I know, there is nothing beyond Fodera and bass players call it the ''Stradivarius'' under the basses.. He on the otherhand, would prefer Warwick above Fodera.. Dunno why exacly, but he mentioned something about the air-drying process that Warwick does, letting the wood dry for 3 - 5 years (or longer) and giving the bass a clear tone (or like Warwick says : The tone of the wood). For his idea, this was thé way that Warwick should be the ''Stradivarius'' under the basses and wondering what made Fodera so special.. No idea why he didn't check for more info about Fodera, he just liked the sound..
Anybody an idea how the process is going at Fodera and which of these 2 builders should be the number one?
Just Thumpin'
Commercial User
- Mar 7, 2008
- 4,534
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- Manager and Partner, Fodera Guitars (10/14/09 - 12/16/19)
There's no joinerly involved in the creation of the YY design (on the YYS), different preamp, different construction method (i.e. dovetail vs. bolt-on), 3-piece neck vs. 1-piece neck, angled peghead vs. flat peghead, MOP inlays instead of pearloid and a different bridge...
Regards,
Jason
Regards,
Jason
Thanks a lot for your input Just Thumpin
Say, what about the Fodera YingYang Standard? It's about twice as cheap then Victor's signature bass. Except for a bolt on neck instead of a dovetail construction and painted YingYang finish, what else did you guys do to make it more affordable?
Just Thumpin'
Commercial User
- Mar 7, 2008
- 4,534
- 1,664
- Disclosures
- Manager and Partner, Fodera Guitars (10/14/09 - 12/16/19)
Folks, the discussions seems to be getting somewhat sidetracked by the whole CNC thing. To be clear, we have absolutely nothing against CNC machines. They are tools, just like any other. Used well, they can produce very, very fine results. Used poorly and they can produce a bland, uninspiring instrument. By way of example, a Plek machine is a CNC machine and the one we purchased in January of this year has improved the overall consistency and quality of our fretwork.
The question is far more one of scale, attention to detail and the amount of highly skilled labor spent on each instrument. We have made less than 3,800 instruments over our 29 year history. We pride ourselves on having an incredible amount of hand work involved with each instrument. That's part of our company's soul. We believe that this is where the art happens. The ability to feel each piece of wood and to do the final shaping entirely by hand lends itself to an artisan, hand-built product. Whether or not the initial shaping was to be done using a jig and a router or on a CNC is immaterial...it is the level of skill involved with the final shaping and detail work that is of huge importance.
Our instruments are built by musicians that are incredibly passionate about what they do. We are perfectionists and although we do not get it right 100% of the time, we certainly try to and when we fail we will go out of our way to make it right.
None of this is to say anything about Warwick. I am not personally familiar with the Company and have only played a few of their instruments over the years. They are definitely very, very different in terms of tone, feel, build, etc. However, which is right for an individual player is a highly personal choice...one that no amount of reading or discussing on TB will ever be able to determine. The reality is that only a lot of playing in a variety of situations can ever really answer whether or not an instrument truly speaks to you.
Kindest regards,
Jason
The question is far more one of scale, attention to detail and the amount of highly skilled labor spent on each instrument. We have made less than 3,800 instruments over our 29 year history. We pride ourselves on having an incredible amount of hand work involved with each instrument. That's part of our company's soul. We believe that this is where the art happens. The ability to feel each piece of wood and to do the final shaping entirely by hand lends itself to an artisan, hand-built product. Whether or not the initial shaping was to be done using a jig and a router or on a CNC is immaterial...it is the level of skill involved with the final shaping and detail work that is of huge importance.
Our instruments are built by musicians that are incredibly passionate about what they do. We are perfectionists and although we do not get it right 100% of the time, we certainly try to and when we fail we will go out of our way to make it right.
None of this is to say anything about Warwick. I am not personally familiar with the Company and have only played a few of their instruments over the years. They are definitely very, very different in terms of tone, feel, build, etc. However, which is right for an individual player is a highly personal choice...one that no amount of reading or discussing on TB will ever be able to determine. The reality is that only a lot of playing in a variety of situations can ever really answer whether or not an instrument truly speaks to you.
Kindest regards,
Jason
Just Thumpin'
Commercial User
- Mar 7, 2008
- 4,534
- 1,664
- Disclosures
- Manager and Partner, Fodera Guitars (10/14/09 - 12/16/19)
True
The way I see it is this. Comparing Warwick to Fodera is like comparing a Mercedes to a Fisker Karma (the Fodera). Two very different vehicles.
Doesn`t seem a fair comparison.
I still own a Warwick Streamer and owned several in the past.
I gotta say that although they are quality instruments, I`ve found different flaws in many of them (say 10%-15%).
- Weak truss rods in older models
- Inadequate gluing in some necks and bodies (Ovangkol Thumb BO and Warwick Thumb NT)
- Unreliable Just a nut II (fell apart)
I truly like some of them but IMO Fodera plays in a higher league.
I still own a Warwick Streamer and owned several in the past.
I gotta say that although they are quality instruments, I`ve found different flaws in many of them (say 10%-15%).
- Weak truss rods in older models
- Inadequate gluing in some necks and bodies (Ovangkol Thumb BO and Warwick Thumb NT)
- Unreliable Just a nut II (fell apart)
I truly like some of them but IMO Fodera plays in a higher league.
And here is my question then about Warwick : What makes them so expensive? I mean, almost 12.000 bucks for the Robert Trujillo signature model.. I can understand the chrome finish makes it expensive, but 12.000? You can buy a Fodera from that money, which IS handmade...
