I have Eden Amp Types. One is powered by mosfets, a hybrid-tube preamp-power amp, a 300 watt all tube amp, and a WTDI which I have used with several different different non-Eden amps. To me, they all sound very warm.
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What exactly is "tube warmth"?
- Thread starter mr_musica
- Start date
John Deacon always had a warm sound to my ears. Dave Ellefson has a harsher cold sound to me. Just my way of thinking about it.
And weight. Warmth must be very heavy.
This one is pretty easy to explain in scientific detail...
Turn on your tube amp and wait for about 30-45 seconds. Hold the palm of your hand up and facing the power section tubes, roughly 4-6 inches away.
Feel that?...tube warmth!!
Turn on your tube amp and wait for about 30-45 seconds. Hold the palm of your hand up and facing the power section tubes, roughly 4-6 inches away.
Feel that?...tube warmth!!
Countless articles and discussions have been had about this subject and it becomes very subjective.
The Elusive "Tube Warmth" Mystique - inSync
What’s the Warmth in Tube Amps? – PS Audio
https://musicproductionnerds.com/how-does-a-tube-amp
The Elusive "Tube Warmth" Mystique - inSync
What’s the Warmth in Tube Amps? – PS Audio
https://musicproductionnerds.com/how-does-a-tube-amp
I know it when I hear it. If I kick on my Bug Caster pedal, the effect is immediate, even with the gain zeroed. It's also apparent when going through my SSDI pre. That said, that kind of warmth is available in other ways.
Solid state and tube amps act differently when you start getting into distortion. Different harmonics come into play depending on which type of amp. Many people find that the harmonics created by tubes to be more pleasing. Thus associated with a warm or comfy feeling.
Harmonic distortion, rolled off highs, tube compression, & a lifetime of cork sniffing.
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Perhaps ironically, many tube amps are voiced rather bright. Run them through a full-range, flat-response (FRFR) cab and you get a lot of gank, glass, or air depending on how the upper-mids and highs are contoured. So, IMHO a big part of tube warmth is often due to the speaker filtering out the highs.
An exception to this is the Ampeg SVT. The tend to be fairly flat with a gentle broad-band boost in the low mids. So they can sound fairly warm even through a FRFR cab.
Many players tend to speak of tubey goodness, like it's a singular easy to understand quality. It's not, tubey goodness is actually made up of several different qualities that can be defined and discussed separately. If you try a bunch of different models of tube amps, you will find that each has a unique personality that is made up of a different mix of these qualities. So you can sort of organize amps into different "tone universes", like Fender, Ampeg, Marshall, Hiwatt, Vox, etc.
I learned to play through a blackface Fender Twin loaded with JBL E120s, so I associate a fairly bright sound with the term "tubey." Fenders tend to produce lot's of air and glass. Hiwatts are also bright, but they tend produce more gank in the upper mids. You can't make a Fender sound like a Hiwatt, and you can't make a Hiwatt sound like a Fender. You can't make either sound like an SVT, and vice versa. Which is best depends on what you want.
The other thing is people seem to assume is that all tube amps sound great pushed into distortion, but in my experience, there is a continuum: Some sound great pushed deep into distortion and others sound pretty awful.
My suggestion is try to identify and understand as many of the qualities that lead to a perceived tubey quality as possible.
Also, I suggest not worrying too much about whether an amp is tube or solid-state. Play a bunch of amps and pick the ones you like, regardless of topology. You may find that you strongly prefer one type or the other. Or you may find that your preferences change depending on how you feel and the type of music you are playing.
An exception to this is the Ampeg SVT. The tend to be fairly flat with a gentle broad-band boost in the low mids. So they can sound fairly warm even through a FRFR cab.
Many players tend to speak of tubey goodness, like it's a singular easy to understand quality. It's not, tubey goodness is actually made up of several different qualities that can be defined and discussed separately. If you try a bunch of different models of tube amps, you will find that each has a unique personality that is made up of a different mix of these qualities. So you can sort of organize amps into different "tone universes", like Fender, Ampeg, Marshall, Hiwatt, Vox, etc.
I learned to play through a blackface Fender Twin loaded with JBL E120s, so I associate a fairly bright sound with the term "tubey." Fenders tend to produce lot's of air and glass. Hiwatts are also bright, but they tend produce more gank in the upper mids. You can't make a Fender sound like a Hiwatt, and you can't make a Hiwatt sound like a Fender. You can't make either sound like an SVT, and vice versa. Which is best depends on what you want.
The other thing is people seem to assume is that all tube amps sound great pushed into distortion, but in my experience, there is a continuum: Some sound great pushed deep into distortion and others sound pretty awful.
My suggestion is try to identify and understand as many of the qualities that lead to a perceived tubey quality as possible.
Also, I suggest not worrying too much about whether an amp is tube or solid-state. Play a bunch of amps and pick the ones you like, regardless of topology. You may find that you strongly prefer one type or the other. Or you may find that your preferences change depending on how you feel and the type of music you are playing.
It's a nebulous term that means whatever the person hearing the sound wants it to be.
I've been designing linear electronics both tube and SS (I'm an EE) and I've had a hundred different people describe as many different sounds to me, and often they tell me the sound they think they're hearing based upon the gear their eyes are seeing.
To me that means multiple things. For one tube amps often appear to have more low end, or a different feeling low end. Meaning tubes react differently to the attack of the strings and sort of absorb some of it (at least that's what I believe it sort of does). Also I feel like all the classic tube amps have a way tamer top end. You sort of lose a lot of the clarity that you might get from an average class d amp.
I think this whole topic is a little difficult, because class d amps that try to emulate a sort of tube Tone are quite common. And that is a very desirable tone. Tech21 is well known for creating such a tone without actually using tubes, as are many others. And they appear to be very close, if not undistinguishable.
I do have the suspicion that this whole thing kind of comes down to the specific amps design. Tube amps are probably just often designed to be warm sounding, while class d amps appear to often be voiced more clear. Or maybe it even comes down to the speakers that are designed to be used in conjunction to these specific amps
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- Feb 12, 2006
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- Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
The size and weight feed into the visual perception of "tubey" and "low end capabilities" as well.
Arkham Oracle into a Mesa WD800 gets me the warmth and tube compression I desire. And for more icing in the EQ department I also use a Barber Linden after the Oracle, not that it's needed but I dig variety. Warmth...yes. Two tubes working for me with the best of EQ and everything else these 3 pieces of art offer. Mesa cabs and any of my basses sound the way I always imagined bass should sound. Completely done chasing tone. I have no idea if I answered your question but I started babbling just cuz I'm so friggin happy.
End of page 1 and I'm confused.
Warm to me means a lack of highs. A mellow sound with emphasis on lows. Adding harmonics will add high frequency components that will brighten the sound and add clarity. How can more distortion produce warmth? If anything it would add punch or clarity.
Maybe page 2 will help. I'll keep reading.
Warm to me means a lack of highs. A mellow sound with emphasis on lows. Adding harmonics will add high frequency components that will brighten the sound and add clarity. How can more distortion produce warmth? If anything it would add punch or clarity.
Maybe page 2 will help. I'll keep reading.
Tube vs. solid-state is akin to Brooklyn pizza vs. Chicago deep dish.
Just... buy and enjoy what you like and ignore all the clichés and baseless stereotypes people cling to. It's all a matter of personal preference.
Just... buy and enjoy what you like and ignore all the clichés and baseless stereotypes people cling to. It's all a matter of personal preference.
Reading all these answers got me wondering if "warmth" is "thiccness"...
It can be if you want it to be. All of these descriptors are subjective. It's like listening to sounds you hear to understand what colors someone else is thinking of.Reading all these answers got me wondering if "warmth" is "thiccness"...
It is distortion, but very mild, which as mentioned produces some pleasing additional harmonic information in the signal and some very subtle compression (as you hit the string harder not all of that is converted into extra volume - some causes additional distortion instead). Harmonic distortion generally sounds good to most ears.
