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Where do I go from here?

A

aarono

Feb 14, 2006
202
0
Minnesota
#1
Guys I'm stuck in my current spot with bass playing.

Let me explain a little.

- I go to practices once a week and my bass instructor insists on ramming a thousand arpeggios down my throat. While I can see how they would help me remember note posistions, I don't see them as that useful.

- I play in a band, but they play punk while I want to play hard rock.

- I look at instruction books such as "Learn how to Play Funk" or "The Essential Jaco Pastorious", but I usually get bored within 10 minutes.

I was thinking maybe I should find or create a new band that fits my musical liking. Because right now I have no drive and I have no clue what I should study to improve my bass playing.
 
#2
Some people want to learn their instruments inside and out. They play lots of arpeggios and scales in the beginning stages, and continue practicing them and learning new ones throughout their careers. They strive to know everything they can so they can do anything they might be asked to do.

Other people want to bash out a few notes in a band with their friends at keg parties on the weekends, or write simple songs that aren't too challenging. Nothing wrong with that.

You sound like you're in the latter category. You're rejecting info that can make you improve as a player and trying to decide what you need to learn instead of letting your teacher do his job. If that's your thing, that's your thing. But you can either suck it up and learn things that bore you in order to improve, or you can stay at the level you're at now. You can't do both.
 
#3
You say you like Hard Rock. The learn some songs that have a mix of other genres. Chillis, RATM for a bit of funk etc.
How about trying some prog stuff like Dreamtheater, hard rosking but difficult bass lines. Billy Sheehan Mr Big stuff for some Rock and Roll virtuosoness.
I tried going down the Jazz route just to improve but it didnt work, I'm just not into it, and it tells in the playing.
 
#4
You definitely need something to relight the fire under you to get you motivated again. That could be from listening to some new music or bass player. Probably check out a style of music you don't normally listen to.

As for your lessons arpeggios are very important tool especially for a bass player. The bulk of what bass players play are chord tones, knowing where they are and seeing the neck in chord tones is a good thing. Soloing nailing chord tones especially the 3rd's and 7th's really shows control of the instrument. Walking bass is all about chord tones and using approach notes to chord tones, also in soloing. Knowng your appeggios as inversions of chord and being able to play them up and down the neck is great exercise, because that means no matter where you find yourself on the neck you can spot chord tones for the chord being played. I like to stress to my students when learning scales learn the related arpeggio so you know where the chord tones are within the scale. Even for pentatonics or Blues scale do the same. Say for a G7 and a G7 Blues scale. By knowing the G7 arpeggio you now have an extra note to use that you will hear lots of great players use, but other focus on the pent' so much they forget about. Last real important know your your arppeggios/chord tones if you screw up and hit a bad note, follow it with chord tone and people will think you were just getting outside. Like Chick Corea said its not what you play outside, it how you come back in. Well you come back in with chord tone that say I'm in control. Take the basslines you know already and figure out where the chord tones are in the bassline, now see what arpeggios they relate too.

Maybe seeing the value of arpeggios might help you want to get them down under your fingers. Seeing the neck in chord tones allows you do anything you want.

Go check some new music you will get the fire burning again.
 
#5
+1 on the dojo of cool. I want to use this answer as an excuse to say: Thank you DocBop! I always find your answers very helpful, and you always seem to have a good and serious answer to everything. Thanks for contributing.
 
#6
Ok heres another thing. I read what you posted about G7, extra notes here, blah blah blah. I'm not saying that to be rude but it goes in one ear and out the other. I've had my teacher tried explaining why certain things happen in music theory but they never stick in my brain.
 
#7
OK then, I was right. You're not interested in learning anything past bashing out a few tunes. That's OK though. But don't expect to make any great strides in improving your playing.
 
#8
I would have to disagree with that last poster.

The fact is, there ARE bass players who play great basslines and did not learn/do not know a lot of musical theory. YOu could get better without learning any. It would be tougher though in many respects.

So the fact that you are bored with what your teacher is teaching does not mean you are doomed to never improve. Maybe you need a different teacher, or DVDs, or or books, etc.
 
#9
aarono said:
Guys I'm stuck in my current spot with bass playing.

Let me explain a little.

- I go to practices once a week and my bass instructor insists on ramming a thousand arpeggios down my throat. While I can see how they would help me remember note posistions, I don't see them as that useful.

- I play in a band, but they play punk while I want to play hard rock.

- I look at instruction books such as "Learn how to Play Funk" or "The Essential Jaco Pastorious", but I usually get bored within 10 minutes.

I was thinking maybe I should find or create a new band that fits my musical liking. Because right now I have no drive and I have no clue what I should study to improve my bass playing.
Click to expand...

I get bored with books too. Unless there's a really cool lick I want to cop out of it. If your band is boring, quit and find another. What really gets me motivated is taking a song from a band I think is hot, then learning what tuning it's in, then every day playing that bastage until I learn it by ear. Don't go on to bassmasta or ultimate guitar, I guarantee 90% of those tabs are not right.
 
#12
Cristo said:
I would have to disagree with that last poster.

The fact is, there ARE bass players who play great basslines and did not learn/do not know a lot of musical theory. YOu could get better without learning any. It would be tougher though in many respects.

So the fact that you are bored with what your teacher is teaching does not mean you are doomed to never improve. Maybe you need a different teacher, or DVDs, or or books, etc.
Click to expand...
The fact that there are bassists out there who can play well without knowing how to read music doesn't mean you can. There are millionaires and billionaires that never graduated high school, too, but that's no guarantee you're going to be one if you quit. Players who develop a level of excellence without knowing how to read music or knowing something about theory are the exception, not the norm.
 
#14
Cristo said:
The fact is, there ARE bass players who play great basslines and did not learn/do not know a lot of musical theory. YOu could get better without learning any. It would be tougher though in many respects.
Click to expand...

There are many great players of different instruments that can't read and really can't explain why they are playing something but they have great ears. I went to NT and there were a couple of players there that really couldn't read. One was a great piano player and he could burn at jazz. He didn't stay long b/c he couldn't read and the school wanted him to take the time to learn how. Another was a guy that would fill glass of water in the cafeteria and play tunes on them. He had perfect pitch (if there really is such a thing) and he didn't stay either b/c he couldn't read. So, if you've got those incredible ears and can hear everything and be able to play it back immediately then continue doing what you're doing. If not, then take the time and try to learn why certain chord progressions work and why some don't (or not always).

Many of these great players that you're talking about can read music and do understand theory but they don't admit to it. When I was younger, one of my friends was really into the Plasmatics. When I was in town and they were playing locally, I would get to hang out with them after shows. The bass player actually knew a lot of theory and could rattle off the notes of scales (we used to have a little contest while we were hanging out and partying).
 
#15
Freddels said:
There are many great players of different instruments that can't read and really can't explain why they are playing something but they have great ears. I went to NT and there were a couple of players there that really couldn't read. One was a great piano player and he could burn at jazz. He didn't stay long b/c he couldn't read and the school wanted him to take the time to learn how. Another was a guy that would fill glass of water in the cafeteria and play tunes on them. He had perfect pitch (if there really is such a thing) and he didn't stay either b/c he couldn't read. So, if you've got those incredible ears and can hear everything and be able to play it back immediately then continue doing what you're doing. If not, then take the time and try to learn why certain chord progressions work and why some don't (or not always).

Many of these great players that you're talking about can read music and do understand theory but they don't admit to it. When I was younger, one of my friends was really into the Plasmatics. When I was in town and they were playing locally, I would get to hang out with them after shows. The bass player actually knew a lot of theory and could rattle off the notes of scales (we used to have a little contest while we were hanging out and partying).
Click to expand...

+1

Having great ears is one of the most valuable skills for a musician. And what happens with great ear players they probably more time trying to come up with ways to catergorize and label for their own use music. Studying theory isn't rules you have to live by it is a way to communitate, a way to document ideas, also saving time by learning what those before you took time to figure out, so you don't have to reinvent the wheel yourself. Last studying theory can be a great source of new ideas. You read about some musical theory topic, that is only the beginning now is time to make music with it. Then use it as a launching point for your own ideas. If you just look at it as rules or limitations you are missing the point.

I also hear ya about guys you know theory and don't admit it because it hosed them at auditions and "Street Cred". I went to two music school and worked at one for years. Students would graduate and proud of what they did put it on their resumes or would tell people when interviewing for gigs. They thought it would help, but phone didn't ring much especially for Rock gigs. They remove it from their resumes and phone starts ringing.

What is sad is guys with great ear who decide to go to music school to learn to sightread and some theory. They usually end up quitting. They get frustration because they can play circles around most the other students, but in class they are like total beginners and their egos can't handle that. They forget most those other students started learning reading and theory from the beginning so it comes easy to them and they are at school to get their playing up to where the ear player is at. The ear players that do stick it out are usually the best players at graduation time, and now have skills that will make having long career in music possible. Without the skills you are limiting how long of your music career will last. How many players who weren't stars in their 20's and making a living playing Rock now that they are 50? The more skills you have the more things you can do to pay the bills the older you get.
 
#16
Freddels said:
When I was younger, one of my friends was really into the Plasmatics. When I was in town and they were playing locally, I would get to hang out with them after shows. The bass player actually knew a lot of theory and could rattle off the notes of scales (we used to have a little contest while we were hanging out and partying).
Click to expand...

I forget that guys' name but he's still a professional musician. He does soundtracks (and I'm sure many other projects too).
 
#19
Sounds like you need some ear/"soul" training. Music theory gets discussed a lot when it comes to instruction, but the other half of playing music is being able to bring your imagination to life. Make a list of favorite songs and then sit down and learn every single lick of the bassline to each of them. Make a point of learning songs that sound very different. Memorizing hundreds of those little licks will add to your general playing ability. THen, when you want to pick up some more theory, you'll realize that you've been playing those arpeggios all along, just didn't know what they were.
 
#20
It sounds to me like this is more of an interest issue than a theory vs no theory issue.

I'm guessing you're still really young, probably a teen?

If playing bass is not interesting you right now, than put the thing down. Walk away, go pick up a (GASP!) six string and mess around with that for a while.

Or

Tell your friends you aren't intersted in playing punk and you want to try other stuff. If they say "cool" than pick your favorite non-punk song and learn it. If they say "screw you" than say, "Have fun finding another bass player".

If the books require a maturity and level of patience you aren't ready for, then try DVDs.

In the end, as long as you play you will get better, maybe slowly, maybe quickly, depending on some of the things mentioned above, but if no aspect of the instrument intrigues you right now than walk away and come back when something does.
 

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