Why are Ampeg SVTs so popular?

[DJ Bebop]

I think my 70's 810 cab sensitivity plays close to this 100dB number of the 810E. My 212 cab provides a sensitivity of 99dB on paper and, in real practice there is little audible difference in perceived loudness of my 810 vers 212.
Interestingly at big loudness wars (randomly I had to fight versus these "stupid" Marshall stacks you know) the 810 stands way better in the mix than my 212. This was of course an very interesting experiene cause (on paper) the 212 (ported) cab provides more of low end than the sealed 810.



Here you are with a cab simulation of 215 3015LF vers a 810 B810 modelling.
System input power equals 800 Watt for each system
View attachment 3195395


The following pic demonstrates the meaning of "displacement" respectively the amount of "moved air volume" versus SPL.

View attachment 3195415

It can be seen that for 800 watt input power at about 500 Hz the cone displacement stays rather small (0.15mm) while the generated SPL at 500 Hz is still high. At the lowish side of the spectrum the cone displacement rises up to noticeable higher numbers but, while the sealed cab shows a steady increase of displacement the ported cab drivers are supported by the Helmholtz resonator which helps to improve radiation impedance of the cab system at the lows.
It can be clearly seen that there is no way to interpret lots of "moved air volume" directly into plenty of SPL. Both cabs move plenty of air volume in the range of 70..100Hz but, generated SPL does NOT show any proportionality with cone displacemnt.

Great workup!

My understanding is the significance of displacement is not efficiency, rather it relates to mechanical power handling. Efficiency and power handling together determine max SPL.

Per your graphs it looks like the 810E would be a few dB louder above about 120Hz, and a pair of 3015LFs would be louder below about 120Hz. Neither design exceeds Xmax when fed 800W, so displacement is not a factor unless more power is applied. It's does appear that 800W puts both designs pretty much at their displacement limit.

Losses from the 1515/66 crossover would also be a factor, so the fEARful should actually require more than 800 watts to achieve the performance in the graphs.

It seems clear you prefer to tone of the 810E . Although I have never played a fEARful, I am sure I would prefer the 1515/66...I have owned an Ampeg 810 and it is not my cup of tea.

vive la difference

To me, for me, it's about how it sounds at your back.

The science and specs while valid, mean nothing as far as where you stand and use the equipment.

You don't stand in the audience, you are not playing a fEarful, Bareface or, whatever against or with an Ampeg 8x10 at the same time. 8x10's at your back is just more cone area then 2x15's 2x6's no matter how loud because your back is right against it and that loud volume is combining 20 ft. out in front of you

 

[Wasnex]

To me, for me, it's about how it sounds at your back.

The science and specs while valid, mean nothing as far as where you stand and use the equipment.

You don't stand in the audience, you are not playing a fEarful, Bareface or, whatever against or with an Ampeg 8x10 at the same time. 8x10's at your back is just more cone area then 2x15's 2x6's no matter how loud because your back is right against it and that loud volume is combining 20 ft. out in front of you

Ultimately it comes down to user preference and how you use your gear. I have owned, used, and understand what it is you like about the 810E. It just doesn't float my boat, but I totally get what an awesome speaker it is.

 

[DJ Bebop]

Ultimately it comes down to user preference and how you use your gear. I have owned, used, and understand what it is you like about the 810E. It just doesn't float my boat, but I totally get what an awesome speaker it is.

Oh, I don't care for them myself either, I just get why others like them. However I never miss a chance to play though them when it comes my way
Myself, I m a goofy speaker user. Current rig is a stereo power amp with 31 band EQ and crossover into 1x18 sub for lows, Aguilar 1x12 for mid and highs. Goofiness at its highest but still portable
Why? 'Cause it was sitting around the house :\

 

[DJ Bebop]

Ultimately it comes down to user preference and how you use your gear. I have owned, used, and understand what it is you like about the 810E. It just doesn't float my boat, but I totally get what an awesome speaker it is.

Just like the fact that I own a 64 B-15n for that sound but I also use a model of it more than
I take the actual amp out on gigs. Yet I don't think the model is better but, it is more convincing than a SVT model

 

[Wasnex]

Current rig is a stereo power amp with 31 band EQ and crossover into 1x18 sub for lows, Aguilar 1x12 for mid and highs.

I am sure I could get a sound I like from your rig .

 

[DJ Bebop]

I am sure I could get a sound I like from your rig .

It's a pretty clean rig but, I can crap it up with fx and modeling stuff real quick

 

[DJ Bebop]

It's a pretty clean rig but, I can crap it up with fx and modeling stuff real quick

...it still doesn't have the same presence in the room as an 810E, just a 1x18, and a 1x12.
The tones I can get though...

 

[Leo was right]

...it still doesn't have the same presence in the room as an 810E, just a 1x18, and a 1x12.
The tones I can get though...

I love your profile picture.

 

[DJ Bebop]

I love your profile picture.

Thanks! It's from this one if you didn't know, kind of a classic.

Jimi Hendrix on bass, Buddy Miles on drums, Johnny Winter on guitar Feb '69 at The Scene.
I added the names, for the young people among us

 

[DougalPye]

I have an SVT CL that I used to play through an 810. There really is no substitute for the amount of cone area they provide, and the presence is rally unmatched. In the right hands, tonally, that much volume makes a lot of sense: the bass needs more volume and more wattage by its very nature - the instrument often needs to be felt as much as heard- as long as it still fits in dynamically and tonally.

Having said that, I did get rid of my 8x10 in exchange for a 4x10 and a 1x15. I thought it sounded good and using the two cabs made it easier to transport and more versatile. It wasn’t the same as the 8x10 tho. I still miss the sound sometimes, but the cab (which I had bought used at a GC I the days when you could really haggle with them) was sold to a friend of mine, who sold it to some one else etc, went on to have a good life on the road.

 

[DJ Bebop]

I have an SVT CL that I used to play through an 810. There really is no substitute for the amount of cone area they provide, and the presence is rally unmatched. In the right hands, tonally, that much volume makes a lot of sense: the bass needs more volume and more wattage by its very nature - the instrument often needs to be felt as much as heard- as long as it still fits in dynamically and tonally.

Having said that, I did get rid of my 8x10 in exchange for a 4x10 and a 1x15. I thought it sounded good and using the two cabs made it easier to transport and more versatile. It wasn’t the same as the 8x10 tho. I still miss the sound sometimes, but the cab (which I had bought used at a GC I the days when you could really haggle with them) was sold to a friend of mine, who sold it to some one else etc, went on to have a good life on the road.

Question, why the 4x10 1x15, wouldn't 2 4x10's get more of the 8x10 thang?

 

[Bad azz tone]

Question, why the 4x10 1x15, wouldn't 2 4x10's get more of the 8x10 thang?

For me,it's 2- 4x10 HLF's(early HLN's). 1cab or 2 they sound killer and easy to transport. Powered by an SVT VR.

 

[DJ Bebop]

Thanks! It's from this one if you didn't know, kind of a classic.
View attachment 3202523
Jimi Hendrix on bass, Buddy Miles on drums, Johnny Winter on guitar Feb '69 at The Scene.
I added the names, for the young people among us

What trips me out about this picture is, that jazz bass looks like a strat in Jimi' s hand's

 

[lowendrv]

What trips me out about this picture is, that jazz bass looks like a strat in Jimi' s hand's

Tommy Shannon owns that bass now .
Link Removed

 

[DJ Bebop]

Tommy Shannon owns that bass now .
Link Removed

That was Tommy's bass then, he was letting Jimi use it

 

[DougalPye]

Question, why the 4x10 1x15, wouldn't 2 4x10's get more of the 8x10 thang?

Yes 2 4x10s would get more of an 8x10 thing (although some swear by the necessity of the 8x10 enclosure)
but I picked up a 4x10 and I had a 1x15 already. Rather cheesy from a purists perspective but lucky for me I’m not a purist.

 

[Ringhammer]

I used a GK-800RB with an 810e and GK210 and used the crossover, driving the lows thought the 810 and the highs through the 210, and was very happy with that tone for many years back in the ‘90’s, that is until I picked up a SVT-II (non pro) and just used the 810. Well the GK is a great amp, but I never looked back.
I recently picked up a ‘72 SVT and then a ‘69 and converted the ‘69 back to use 6146 tubes. Now these two are my favorites. I also have a V4B and had Fliptops build me a sealed 4x10. Not crazy about the V4B, but the SVT’s all sound pretty damn good through that little 4x10 too.

 

[Bad azz tone]

I used a GK-800RB with an 810e and GK210 and used the crossover, driving the lows thought the 810 and the highs through the 210, and was very happy with that tone for many years back in the ‘90’s, that is until I picked up a SVT-II (non pro) and just used the 810. Well the GK is a great amp, but I never looked back.
I recently picked up a ‘72 SVT and then a ‘69 and converted the ‘69 back to use 6146 tubes. Now these two are my favorites. I also have a V4B and had Fliptops build me a sealed 4x10. Not crazy about the V4B, but the SVT’s all sound pretty damn good through that little 4x10 too.

I love my SVT through my 4x10 hlf,with my 5 string the hlf's reproduce the lows of the B string very well thanks to the ports. 1cab sounds great for most rooms,but 2cabs are plain bad azz!

 

[Nevada Pete]

I love my SVT through my 4x10 hlf,with my 5 string the hlf's reproduce the lows of the B string very well thanks to the ports. 1cab sounds great for most rooms,but 2cabs are plain bad azz!

Holy cow!

 

[Cory rich40]

I have to say there is just 'something' about a SVT - especially combined with a fridge. I played one once and saved my dollars to get one. Eventually downsized the fridge to the 2x12av cab - my drummer still wishes I had the 8x10 (as do I, but my back does not). I play Modern Country and most of the country guys use a SVT as well. To me.... it is what a bass amp should sound like.

If you can never afford a SVT, don't try one.... because the first taste is free, and then the cost goes up

I just purchased the SVT vr. No way I will fit the 810 in the back of my car. Will the ampeg AV212 be able to pull it off and still sound awesome? Will that 212 at least sound better than the HLF heritage 410. I’m mostly playing in a small church. Not my only amp, but I would like to use it from time to time without blowing the walls off the church!