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Why are so many 1x12" cabs "horizontal" instead of "vertical"?

Fender32

Fender32

Jun 23, 2005
4,945
581
West Sussex, England
#1
Given that a lot of bassists (especially DB'ists) use exclusively 1x12" cabs, why are most of these cabs horizontally aligned? Is it simply for stacking compatiblity with other, wider and taller cabs, or are there sonic advantages to having the cabs closer to the ground? Am I missing something obvious here?

I have a pair of vertically stacking Markbass 121H's (see below), but even those have been re-designed by MB recently in a "sideways" format :hmm: .

So, how do you guys stack your 1 x 12"s?

I'm "between bands" now (as of three weeks ago), so I have nowhere to experiment with laying the cabs on their sides and trying to hear a difference (my neighbours aren't that forgiving ;) ).

So, what are your thoughts?

My rig:
143-4327_IMG.jpg


Other peoples' rigs:
EBSNeo112x2.jpg

EpifaniUL112x2.jpg

Bergs.jpg
 
#3
Why does it matter? I can see stacking 2x10s vertically but with a 1x12 you aren't really gaining anything by stacking two of them horizontally versus vertically. That extra few inches from the floor isn't going to make a difference aside from having your amp's controls closer to you.
 
#4
msquared said:
Why does it matter? I can see stacking 2x10s vertically but with a 1x12 you aren't really gaining anything by stacking two of them horizontally versus vertically. That extra few inches from the floor isn't going to make a difference aside from having your amp's controls closer to you.
Click to expand...

Indeed, that was my question :smug: !

I suppose I was wondering if the alignment of the bass cones and the HF drivers might play a part in "balancing out" the sound, if they were directly above/below one another :hmm: !?

Look at the pictures above and imagine the sound waves being produced from each one. Could stacking them vertically so the you have a "tower" that goes Bass/Treble/Bass/Treble, sound less powerful and focused than a tower that goes, Bass & Treble/Bass & Treble?

I'm thinking far too deep into this, aren't I?

:p
 
#8
Most who I know who use 2x12 stack them one on top of the other. That gives you the 'line array' type thing going, and eliminates the 'comb filtering' thing when you position speakers 'horizonally' (i.e., both on the ground).

However, you can only get so much volume out of one or two little 112's, and some who are trying to get more ooomph and volume out of their small 112 stacks place both on the ground 'side by side', resulting if 'floor coupling' which can, in some situations, increase the apparant low end coming out of the small cabs.
 
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#9
erm... its a more solid foot print and thats it.... bass is omnidirectional and as such will couple regardless.
even the difference in energy transmission to the ground is negligably different in both positions.
the only 2 points worth really considering as a factor are the location of the horn/tweeter and the location of the port/scoop
 
#10
The optimal arrangement is a pure vertical stack. This reduces comb filtering (hot spots and drop-outs) to a minimum. For higher frequencies the vertical alignment operates as a line array. The result is less loudness drop at far distances, for those frequencies affected by the array dimension.

Commercial manufacturers have to operate within a price point, and that means cost containment. The baffle board layout is arranged to fit all the drivers on the board, not for optimal engineering. Another point is this market would not be very receptive to vertical arrays because they don't "look right". Visual conformity is a huge factor in commercial bass cabs.

For example, an optimal 4x10 or 4x12 layout would have all four drivers stacked vertically. For portability, I'd do it as a pair of 2x cabs. Those needing tweeters can do an array of piezos with mouths cut at the flare, and joined into a single vertical tweeter array that runs the height of each cabinet. These would mate with the box on top of it, forming a continuous line array of tweeters.
 
#11
comp filtering of the woofers would be negligable unless painfully close to the drivers, any phase/comb filtering problems whilst listening that close would be far outweighed by the pain of proximity. the biggest problem is getting the tweeter to align with your ear, and the resonant frequency of the cabinet. a vertical array is better in a long room, a horizontal array is better in a wide room, (from a punterz point of view). from a stage point of view, it completley depends on the throw of the drivers in relation to the throw of the ports (front/rear ports) but mostly how loud does your drummer clatter his brass, and your proximity to him! lolz
 
#12
oh yeah, and the stage your rig stands on, eg hollow stage = resonant frequency. you can take it to the nth degree, (air humidity, ceiling construction blah blah) at the end of the day you really just dont want your tweeter firing at your shoes!!!
 
#13
From an engineering standpoint the higher the tweeter the better. High frequencies are very directional and the further off-axis from your ears the tweeter is the harder to hear it. But in the vast majority of cases engineering is trumped by cosmetics. No manufacturer wants to lose sales because "most players place their heads on top of the cab, it prevents the typical head from hanging over the sides.".

OTOH, a manufacturer of both heads and cabs, like Markbass, can take advantage of cosmetic concerns and use a high narrow cab and decidely unconservative graphic treatment to drive sales of a comparably sized, and colored, head.
 
#14
billfitzmaurice said:
From an engineering standpoint the higher the tweeter the better. High frequencies are very directional and the further off-axis from your ears the tweeter is the harder to hear it. But in the vast majority of cases engineering is trumped by cosmetics. No manufacturer wants to lose sales because "most players place their heads on top of the cab, it prevents the typical head from hanging over the sides.".

OTOH, a manufacturer of both heads and cabs, like Markbass, can take advantage of cosmetic concerns and use a high narrow cab and decidely unconservative graphic treatment to drive sales of a comparably sized, and colored, head.
Click to expand...

OK, I think I get the message ;) - just leave them stacked vertically and enjoy the benefits of an ear level HF driver (no "tweeter" in my cabs).

Thanks a lot for all of your replies folks. I knew that I'd find some very knowledgable people here to clear this up for me.

Now all I need to do is to get back into another band, so that I can actually try and put this to the test :D .

:bassist:
 
#16
Speaking of stacking, in the seventies the Advent Loudspeaker was a highly regarded hi-fi speaker. Some high end audio shops took to demoing "stacked" Advents, where they would stack a second pair on top of the first pair. The top speaker would be turned upside down putting the two tweeters in the middle, with the woofers at top and bottom.... Incredible sound!

I wonder how that would sound with bass cabs?
 
#17
I just wanna chime in my opinion, take it or leave it. I found that when I placed my 12's in their ends as opposed to stacked normally (mine is the MB/Berg rig pictured), it was nice having the tweeter a bit closer to my ear, things were a bit more snappy. But the whole rig just sounded hollow and lacking in some crucial frequency or something.

I'm not an expert on cabinet properties or anything, but having them stacked the way they are in the picture just seems to fill everything out, it's a super full sounding rig, but on their ends it definitely lacked.
 
#18
lbwdog said:
Speaking of stacking, in the seventies the Advent Loudspeaker was a highly regarded hi-fi speaker. Some high end audio shops took to demoing "stacked" Advents, where they would stack a second pair on top of the first pair. The top speaker would be turned upside down putting the two tweeters in the middle, with the woofers at top and bottom....
Click to expand...
That's called a WTTW alignment, and served as the model for what is commonly referred to as the D'Appolito MTM alignment in hi-fi. It will work with bass cabs but only if the tweeter is either centered or if a pair of cabs are mirror-imaged so that the tweeters are on the same vertical plane.
 

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