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Why does wood affect bass tone?

#61
Vakmere said:
Well then why spend over $4500 for an MTD, Ken Smith, or Fodera (Sadowsky included) when you can buy their electronics package and (if they will fit with little modification) place them in your bass and have a very similar sound to the high enders? I did this to a Fender USA 5 (installed all Sadowsky stuff) and I have to say it was a very much improved Sadowsky like sound regardless of the alder body wood of the Fender. :eyebrow: And Yes, I did own a Sadowsky NYC 5'er for a spell (w/humbuckers) and the sound was very very close. Impressive for that matter....
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In some cases you are paying for pretty wood, gold hardware, very nice woodworking and carving, pretty finishes, the name, etc. Nothing wrong with that. But as you have found, there are other ways....
 
#62
Grate1 said:
Forget bass for a minute. If you were to go to a music store, pick up a shiny new fender 6 string guitar with a maple neck, and play it. Then play one with a rosewood fretboard. With everything else but the fretboard the same, you will hear a difference. There’s a clear difference even acoustically.
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Because they're different guitars. "Everything but the fretboard the same" doesn't exist.
 
#63
powerbass said:
Not only does the wood species effect tone but the amount of humidity in the wood, and the exposure to vibrations too. Check this out from http://www.leedsguitar.com/pages/tips.html "Musicians have said that the sound of an instrument gets better the more you play it, and we have found a basis for that,"

"There is research to indicate that the molecular bonds of wood actually break because of vibration and that this what affects the tonal qualities. So I think there may be more to it than moisture bonding."
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Really interesting stuff. I'm not surprised by it but at the same time I don't know much of that will apply to an electric instrument. Their research was specific to violins and the sounding board is well documented in its effects. What's not conclusive (to me, at the very least) is the effect of this in, say, an electric bass/guitar to the extent that is often proposed by its advocates.

Anyone currently employing this method, though? I'd be really interested in an experiment.

(2) cuts of ash
(2) cuts of maple for the neck
(2) sets of jazz pickups (from a brand noted for its consistency)
(2) sets of medium frets
(2) bone nuts
(2) sets of strings

etc. etc. You get the point, right?

Then a parts bass of the same.


1) Then vibrate one set of woods from the first group in 80% humidity for a week.
2) Have someone well skilled in the craft make both basses in the first group and assemble the third.
3) Have all basses recorded direct using a "transparent" method.
4) Put up a blinded poll.
 
#66
alexbib said:
I'm a physicist and we had a talk at the department about stringed instruments some time ago. Was quite interesting.

In an electric instrument, if you ignore the accoustic sound the instrument makes and look only at what comes out of the amp, I think the way the wood affects the sound is by its dampening effect on the strings. It dampens certain frequencies preferentially, which changes the tone.
Personally, I would evaluate that this effect is fairly small and affects the tone much less than the actual strings and electronics used. After all, these are the parts that actually generate the sound.

Also, as was pointed out, the pickups themselves vibrate with respect to the strings since they are attached to the body. However, since the vibration amplitude of the pickups is small compared to that of the strings, this effect is even smaller. I would be surprised if you could detect this effect by ear.
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good points... that is what i am trying to say... the effect of wood is only noticeable if bad wood is used... then this damping factors are so immense that a bass doesn't play great, has no or little sustain, lots of dead spots... not to mentioned neck warping and those sort of problems...

the construction and quality of it is more important than types of wood.. as long as it is all good wood!!! ;)
 
#67
fuNKmaster83 said:
good points... that is what i am trying to say... the effect of wood is only noticeable if bad wood is used... then this damping factors are so immense that a bass doesn't play great, has no or little sustain, lots of dead spots... not to mentioned neck warping and those sort of problems...

the construction and quality of it is more important than types of wood.. as long as it is all good wood!!! ;)
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I'm not sure I can come up with the technical explanation, but I'll tell you that after playing bass for 20+ years with many different basses coming and going through my stable - there is no doubt in my mind that somehow the wood affects the tone in a meaningful way.

If you take the extreme position here, it would say that you could drop a Musicman bridge, pickup and pre-amp package into say.. a P-Bass, and put the P-Bass pickup and bridge into the Musicman - and in effect the basses would be swapped. The Music Man would now sound exactly like a P Bass and the P Bass would now sound exactly as a Music Man.

Except lots of folks have tried mods like that and it doesn't work. You end up with a frankenbass that doesn't sound like either of the original 2 (it may sound great, but its a new sound).
 
#69
Hoover said:
When I get wood it pushes the bass body up, changing the angle of the strings relative to my plucking hand. So the wood is indirectly affecting my playing technique, and it is this different playing technique that actually affects bass tone. That's why I had to stop gigging at strip clubs.
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I do believe this wins.

Regardless, this thread delivered.
 
#70
While I personally tend to believe that wood affects the tone of an electric bass or guitar, there are those who do not. I know a man named Chip Todd(google him) who lives near me. He worked for Peavey & the Fender Custom Shop making basses & guitars, for many years. Most, if not all of the PV T-40's were made in his shop. Anyway, he's always bringing different axes to my gig for us to try. One night he came in with a guitar that used a Coleman fuel can for the body. He said " This is my answer to the whole "tone wood" theory." My guitarist plugged it in & it sounded just like a Les Paul(no kidding). I do know that the wood affects the tone when the instrument is unplugged or is an acoustic. How that translates across magnetic pups I'm not sure. Chip Todd, with over 30yrs experience in making basses & guitars for two of the giants in the industry, says it's all BS.
 
#73
It's complicated but ... well, here's why:
complexequations.gif
 
#74
Different woods enhance and/or attenuate different parts of the overtone series produced by a vibrating string. Even if you use "good wood" that's been dried and so forth, different species of wood will vary in density, oil content, and grain structure, all of which affect the way the wood vibrates when it's used as part of the system that is a stringed instrument.

I've been fortunate enough to own two STR basses that had the same electronic configuration when used in passive mode. One was made from walnut and mahogany with a rosewood neck and ebony fingerboard, and the other was made from ash and ebony with a maple neck and ebony fingerboard. The mahogany/rosewood bass had much less treble and a thick, almost dull tone, while the ash/maple bass had much more treble and a more balanced, brighter, ringing tone. The electronics, hardware, and strings were consistent-what else could have caused the difference in tone?

I've observed the same sort of difference when comparing my lightweight, highly resonant basswood Fender to various heavy, dense ash Fenders. My bass has less treble and more fundamental, whereas the ash basses have the same brighter, more "ringing" tone. It's likely that the light, resonant body on my bass is attenuating some of the treble content, since it's soaking up more of the energy produced by the strings.

Wood is only one part of the system that is an electric bass, but in my experience, it definitely has an effect on the tone.
 
#75
82Daion said:
I've been fortunate enough to own two STR basses that had the same electronic configuration when used in passive mode. One was made from walnut and mahogany with a rosewood neck and ebony fingerboard, and the other was made from ash and ebony with a maple neck and ebony fingerboard. The mahogany/rosewood bass had much less treble and a thick, almost dull tone, while the ash/maple bass had much more treble and a more balanced, brighter, ringing tone. The electronics, hardware, and strings were consistent-what else could have caused the difference in tone?
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Just to keep this fair I'm gonna throw out the possibility that perhaps you hear the difference in tone because you can hear more HF content from your bass acoustically. I assume you've gigged loud with both enough for that factor not to come into it though.
 
#77
SwamiRob said:
Just to keep this fair I'm gonna throw out the possibility that perhaps you hear the difference in tone because you can hear more HF content from your bass acoustically. I assume you've gigged loud with both enough for that factor not to come into it though.
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I gigged both of them, and what I heard live wasn't any different than what I heard at home. I actually sent the mahogany/rosewood bass back to the Low End because it was so dark-sounding, while the ash/maple bass was my main bass for almost 6 months. Had I not made the decision to go fretless full-time, I'd still have it.

The mahogany/rosewood bass sounded pretty dark and mellow no matter what (if anything) it was plugged into. ;)
 

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