Why even have a "list" price?

[Unrepresented]

I NEVER ignore the part about the retailer wanting profit!! No profit, no business. Bad.

But you kinda did again...

The retailer's goal is profit.

The customer's goal is product at the lowest possible market price.

Now, admittedly there are complications when there are competing products which may fit the customer's needs more or less effectively, but the basic adversarial relationship remains between the two parties.

Your salesman is employed by the retailer, therefore bias towards meeting the retailers demands will take priority.

You've offered a particular situation where the goals of the customer and the goals of the retailer can become more aligned through the salesperson when the retailer will focus on retaining customers through reputation and customer service, however it is still in the retailer's interest to give the appearance of this relationship while violating it at any time they believe they can get away with it, since, realistically, sales is a credence service. As customers we don't know what the profit margin for the retailer is, and we don't know whether a recommendation really did fit our needs better, short of purchasing all alternative products.

Again, the idealized situation of customer service as a motivator is decreasing in validity as the internet increases the availability for customers to research prices and reviews online. Customer retention is no longer a viable goal for many retailers to expect.

 

[Pilgrim]

But you kinda did again...

You've offered a particular situation where the goals of the customer and the goals of the retailer can become more aligned through the salesperson when the retailer will focus on retaining customers through reputation and customer service, however it is still in the retailer's interest to give the appearance of this relationship while violating it at any time they believe they can get away with it, since, realistically, sales is a credence service. As customers we don't know what the profit margin for the retailer is, and we don't know whether a recommendation really did fit our needs better, short of purchasing all alternative products.

Again, the idealized situation of customer service as a motivator is decreasing in validity as the internet increases the availability for customers to research prices and reviews online. Customer retention is no longer a viable goal for many retailers to expect.

I am realistic and I understand what you're saying. However, you seem to share the not-unusual assumption that every salesman will "violate" the relationship whenever possible. That's a common assumption, and I know why.

But that's not the case when I sell, it does not have to be, and I don't necessarily assume that it is the case when I am involved in a sales transaction. As an ex-salesman, I watch the salesperson's behavior and try to determine how they're approaching the transaction. I govern my responses accordingly.

The sales world isn't all "used cars". I know salespeople selling services like DVD duplication and professional electronics, and I'd call them and take their word on a recommendation even they're 1000 miles away. They're pros and I know how they operate. It's great to know people like that!

And yes, I buy ONLY used cars. As a former car salesman, I really appreciate working with a good salesman at a couple of the local family-owned dealerships. I don't appreciate the folks I've run into at some other places....but I can handle either type.

 

[Unrepresented]

I am realistic and I understand what you're saying. However, you seem to share the not-unusual assumption that every salesman will "violate" the relationship whenever possible. That's a common assumption, and I know why.

But that's not the case when I sell, it does not have to be, and I don't necessarily assume that it is the case when I am involved in a sales transaction. As an ex-salesman, I watch the salesperson's behavior and try to determine how they're approaching the transaction. I govern my responses accordingly.

The violation doesn't have to be as strong as the word implies. It could be as simple as favoritism of specific customers. The remaining customers would be getting a violation by not being given the same discount, service, etc.

Giving "Customer A" a better price because they are a loyal customer, means that you're overcharging (violating) the relationship between the retailer and "Customer B" who's shopping for services for the first time at your location.

 

[Stanley Design]

Pilgrim, I think you've got a wee bit o' wool over the eyes there, as nobody is agreeing with you. I for one am a great salesman, and have people call me up from provinces over, all the time. But I haven't worked as a salesman for years, because I couldn't get hired, because I sold the products that were best for the customer and not the products that were best for the store.

Such as two bass combos, one that just came in and is a new model, versus one that's been sitting there for 5 years without a price reduction. Some kid comes in and can't decide between the two, even if the new one is the obvious better solution for him, it is basically the job of the salesperson in a nutshell to do whatever it takes to convince him that it's the wrong choice and to buy the old one, so that the owner can clear out old inventory and get in newer products. If you tell the kid to go for the newer product and the owner/manager catches you, you will be fired or at least get a warning very quickly.

The job of the salesperson is not to provide the best matching product, it's to provide the product that you can make fit, that the owner needs to clear out and it's your job to convince the customer that it is absolutely 100% the best choice he could have made. At that point, the kid leaves happy, your boss is happy, and you still have a job.

If a salesperson was hired by the customer, they would look out for the customers best interest, but unfortunately they are hired by the store and they look out for the stores best interest and therefor their job. Sometimes you get a break where you can truly help both out peacefully, but not nearly often enough for me to stick with it.

 

[Pilgrim]

You make good points, Todd. It's clear that you know what you're doing with sales. And you raised a good example.

Guess I'll just be happy with my approach. I did not sell customers the wrong product unless they absolutely insisted on buying it - and even then, I did so reluctantly. There are times when someone comes in and wants a truck when they need a family car, or vice versa....but even if it's a bad fit, if they fall in love with a vehicle then as a salesperson I needed to go ahead and provide what they wanted.

Even so, there are exceptions...at least in my book. Here's a story...

Back in 1979 when I was selling cars, I had a lady come in with four kids. She was looking for an economical station wagon. She was looking at the Vega wagon...which had only four seats.

Driver + 4 kids = 5 seats needed and 5 seat belts needed. No way around it. The Vega didn't work.

So I discussed her needs, pointed out the space issue, and did my darndest to interest her in a 6-cylinder Malibu wagon with a 3-speed. It was not much bigger, the gas mileage was nearly identical, there was more room and most importantly, enough seats to carry her and the kids safely. Of all the vehicles we carried, I know for a fact that it was the best fit to her needs; maybe not to her WANTS, but it fit her needs the best. (And would have been a more durable vehicle.)

She didn't end up buying from us, but that was OK with me. If someone was going to sell her a car that would require one of her kids to ride with no seat belt, it was ABSOLUTELY NOT going to be me. I'd much rather have not had those kids' safety on my conscience, which they would have been if I'd sold her a Vega wagon.

When I spoke to the sales manager about the customer, he agreed I had done the right thing.

So I'll let it drop now.