Double Bass Yamahiko Double Bass Pickup

[TroyK]

Troy, you’re overthinking it. ...

Well...yeah...that's kind of my thing. The good news is that I can solder and I did order the proper 50V film caps in both 3300pF and 4700pF.

Is it just a matter of soldering one of each of the contact wires from the cap to each of these points?

... It’s impossible to mess up - you’ll be fine.

Thanks! I'm handy, but honestly don't understand electricity or electrical circuits at all. I wire plugs, switches, and fixtures in my house and follow instructions reasonably well, because I know that it can hurt me, but generally regard it as dark magic.

I also get that this is passive, so it can't hurt me, but I would like to have confidence that I did it correctly, so that I know I'm testing an accurate outcome.

 

[JBarz]

Well...yeah...that's kind of my thing. The good news is that I can solder and I did order the proper 50V film caps in both 3300pF and 4700pF.

Is it just a matter of soldering one of each of the contact wires from the cap to each of these points?

View attachment 7340663




Thanks! I'm handy, but honestly don't understand electricity or electrical circuits at all. I wire plugs, switches, and fixtures in my house and follow instructions reasonably well, because I know that it can hurt me, but generally regard it as dark magic.

I also get that this is passive, so it can't hurt me, but I would like to have confidence that I did it correctly, so that I know I'm testing an

Ok, dig : it’s very simple. You’ve got two wires, one of them is the positive, the other the ground. The ground is grounded out on the case, so it doesn’t matter where you tap in(but it’s easiest to use the existing solder joint where the cable ties in)…. the isolated little glob of solder to the right of the arrow pointing down is where you want to tap into the positive. Keep that lead from touching the side of the case and you’ll be gravy.

 

[TroyK]

... Keep that lead from touching the side of the case and you’ll be gravy.

Will do and will report back.

 

[JBarz]

 

[Chris Fitzgerald]

Troy, you’re overthinking it. It’s impossible to mess up - you’ll be fine.

I could totally mess that up. LOL

 

[DoubleMIDI]

I would take some stripped off isolation from a wire that fits the capacitor connectors or some shrink tube to isolate the capacitor wires up to the point where they should get soldered. That reduces the risk of a short circuit if the hot wire touches the case or the other capacitor wire when closing the plug or stressing by the cable close to the plug.

Shortening the capacitor wires is also a good idea, but not too short as you might need to bend them to get the capacitor in a position to be able to close the plug.

 

[TroyK]

Those are good tips, thank you @DoubleMIDI

The caps were not easy to source, but they were cheap, so I bought a few of each with some different spreads for those wires. I'll work it a few different ways to connect them securely while keeping exposed wires isolated.

 

[Matt Power]

Those are good tips, thank you @DoubleMIDI

The caps were not easy to source, but they were cheap, so I bought a few of each with some different spreads for those wires. I'll work it a few different ways to connect them securely while keeping exposed wires isolated.

Hi Troy! If you find a good cap that works for you, I will gladly buy the twin/spare of it! Please pm me and let me know! Thanks!

 

[TroyK]

Hi Troy! If you find a good cap that works for you, I will gladly buy the twin/spare of it! Please pm me and let me know! Thanks!

It'll set you back about $0.80!

Let me get through my experiment and I'll share the results. If I have a spare afterwards, happy to hook you up. It might make more sense for me to just share a link to my source, though. I bought different values so that I could see what works best and with which of my amps. Your amps are going to be different than mine, so my pre-test hypothesis is that it's probably best for you to do the same.

 

[Matt Power]

It'll set you back about $0.80!

Let me get through my experiment and I'll share the results. If I have a spare afterwards, happy to hook you up. It might make more sense for me to just share a link to my source, though. I bought different values so that I could see what works best and with which of my amps. Your amps are going to be different than mine, so my pre-test hypothesis is that it's probably best for you to do the same.

80 cents? Man...do you do Klarna in 3 installments?

Thank you my man! Using a Clarus SL, Serial number 127! Kinda early one.

 

[TroyK]

One of my heads is a Clarus SL as well and despite the 4 band eq and hpf, I have do some some extreme eq'ing to get a good sound out of it. I've been using a Tech21 Q\Strip into the effects return and it's much better that way, but still requires quite a bit of eq to the room.

I'm hoping that with the right cap installed, I will be able to go straight to the head. Really no reason why that shouldn't work.

Will report back, of course.

 

[Endlesssolo]

I tried the 4.7nf, the 3.3nf, and the 2.2nf capacitors in old guitar cables. The easiest way to solder them in was to cut the old plug off one end of the cable and just solder a new switch craft plug in place with the capacitor. I did have to radically shorten the leads on the caps, but I was able to get them in there. And I am no genius when it comes to soldering (or anything else for that matter!).

All of the capacitor values got rid of the clipping on E string that was a problem for me with the Yamahiko going straight into a Clarus head. BTW, it also clipped straight into a WW head and a fishman preamp. And I’m a fairly light player, using a pretty low tension set up. I don’t understand why it doesn’t clip for everyone that tries to plug this pickup straight into an amp or preamp.

The 2.2nf cap lowered the output the least and seemed to affect the tone the least as well. All the cap values filtered out upper mids which I was happy about, but to preserve as much of the sound of the un-filtered pickup, I would suggest trying the 2.2nf value first.

I’ve been using the 2.2nf modded cord for a few months, maybe about 20 gigs, and I’m happy with it. I now want to put a 2.2nf cap in the output jack so I can use any cord. One kind of strange thing that might just be in my mind; it seems like the output gets a little lower towards the latter part of some gigs. The cord end with the capacitor does get a little warm. But it could very well be other players getting louder as the gig goes on; we’ve all been there before, lol.

One edit; when soldering, I found the best way to deal with the long leads is to solder the cap in place where you want it, up tight near the actual cap, with the ends of the leads sticking out the other side, then clip the excess, which in my case was most of the lead.

 

[TroyK]

3300Pf installed.

I don't hear frequencies like some of you guys do. I can't say "you need a boost a little bit at 1.7kHz" and know what I'm talking about, but I've been starting to understand which bands are responsible for certain sounds and remove them with reductive eq.

Direct to my Clarus head, to get the Yamahiko sounding like I wanted, I had to turn the Hi-Mid all the way down and twiddle some other stuff. I had better luck putting my Q\Strip in front of it, finding the worst frequencies and then cutting them (and they going to the effects return). It wasn't as dramatic that way, but it still felt heavy handed. I also started noticing that with a lot of eq the tone was less natural, more processed sounding.

The Yamahiko is "hot" as we've discussed, but I was mostly able to deal with that. What I didn't like was that it sounded "stringy" or "gaanky" or "brittle" or something opposite of warm and full. It also made me very dependent on the Q\Strip because I really didn't like it direct into any amp.

This cap made an immediate, noticeable, positive difference. Direct to the Clarus, really happy with that Hi-Mid band rolled back just a bit. Using the Q\Strip, looks like about 900Hz rolled off about 1/4 of the way. It's late, so I won't get to experiment with it too much more tonight, but I'll keep going into various amps, with and without the Q\Strip. I don't feel like it's working against me now, though. I didn't notice a drop off in output, but I listen for it. Not a big deal, though.

One issue with my install, there is a plastic sleeve that I can pull up over what you see, but it's tight, then I can screw the metal shield over it and it's a super clean install, but the cable doesn't work when I do. Silent. My testing was done with the shield down. Obviously, I'm going to have to do something different. I'll figure it out. I was otherwise happy with my install. Macro picture of the solder isn't beautiful, but it's discrete. If I could get the shield over it, it would be protected from damage too.

 

[lowfreqgeek]

View attachment 7344730

3300Pf installed.

I don't hear frequencies like some of you guys do. I can't say "you need a boost a little bit at 1.7kHz" and know what I'm talking about, but I've been starting to understand which bands are responsible for certain sounds and remove them with reductive eq.

Direct to my Clarus head, to get the Yamahiko sounding like I wanted, I had to turn the Hi-Mid all the way down and twiddle some other stuff. I had better luck putting my Q\Strip in front of it, finding the worst frequencies and then cutting them (and they going to the effects return). It wasn't as dramatic that way, but it still felt heavy handed. I also started noticing that with a lot of eq the tone was less natural, more processed sounding.

The Yamahiko is "hot" as we've discussed, but I was mostly able to deal with that. What I didn't like was that it sounded "stringy" or "gaanky" or "brittle" or something opposite of warm and full. It also made me very dependent on the Q\Strip because I really didn't like it direct into any amp.

This cap made an immediate, noticeable, positive difference. Direct to the Clarus, really happy with that Hi-Mid band rolled back just a bit. Using the Q\Strip, looks like about 900Hz rolled off about 1/4 of the way. It's late, so I won't get to experiment with it too much more tonight, but I'll keep going into various amps, with and without the Q\Strip. I don't feel like it's working against me now, though. I didn't notice a drop off in output, but I listen for it. Not a big deal, though.

One issue with my install, there is a plastic sleeve that I can pull up over what you see, but it's tight, then I can screw the metal shield over it and it's a super clean install, but the cable doesn't work when I do. Silent. My testing was done with the shield down. Obviously, I'm going to have to do something different. I'll figure it out. I was otherwise happy with my install. Macro picture of the solder isn't beautiful, but it's discrete. If I could get the shield over it, it would be protected from damage too.

I'm glad the cap made an improvement in the tone for you.

Here's a few pointers on the soldering, if I may. The little protrusion of solder on the outside of the center lug is shorting to the barrel when you put it on, creating a short to ground as the solder nub pokes through the plastic. See if you can smooth that out. From the looks of it, you probably don't have enough heat or didn't give enough time for the iron to heat up the solder lugs, causing the solder to cool off in a blob rather than flow. It's not too bad, and does take some practice, but I think you'll have better results with more heat and/or a little more time if you can't adjust the heat. Some good liquid flux would also help, if you have any. You can also push the lug down some to help create more room for the plastic sleeve, but that nub has to come off either way.

Don't get too discouraged about it. Soldering is a skill and takes a little practice to do right. You're on your way!

 

[TroyK]

Thank you for that. I've soldered for a long time, but only do it once every few years and my work lacks precision.

I'll work on cleaning it up and report back on the results and how I like the cap.

 

[Endlesssolo]

View attachment 7344730

3300Pf installed.

I don't hear frequencies like some of you guys do. I can't say "you need a boost a little bit at 1.7kHz" and know what I'm talking about, but I've been starting to understand which bands are responsible for certain sounds and remove them with reductive eq.

Direct to my Clarus head, to get the Yamahiko sounding like I wanted, I had to turn the Hi-Mid all the way down and twiddle some other stuff. I had better luck putting my Q\Strip in front of it, finding the worst frequencies and then cutting them (and they going to the effects return). It wasn't as dramatic that way, but it still felt heavy handed. I also started noticing that with a lot of eq the tone was less natural, more processed sounding.

The Yamahiko is "hot" as we've discussed, but I was mostly able to deal with that. What I didn't like was that it sounded "stringy" or "gaanky" or "brittle" or something opposite of warm and full. It also made me very dependent on the Q\Strip because I really didn't like it direct into any amp.

This cap made an immediate, noticeable, positive difference. Direct to the Clarus, really happy with that Hi-Mid band rolled back just a bit. Using the Q\Strip, looks like about 900Hz rolled off about 1/4 of the way. It's late, so I won't get to experiment with it too much more tonight, but I'll keep going into various amps, with and without the Q\Strip. I don't feel like it's working against me now, though. I didn't notice a drop off in output, but I listen for it. Not a big deal, though.

One issue with my install, there is a plastic sleeve that I can pull up over what you see, but it's tight, then I can screw the metal shield over it and it's a super clean install, but the cable doesn't work when I do. Silent. My testing was done with the shield down. Obviously, I'm going to have to do something different. I'll figure it out. I was otherwise happy with my install. Macro picture of the solder isn't beautiful, but it's discrete. If I could get the shield over it, it would be protected from damage too.

I’ve been doing a little reading about capacitors and while i’m still a little confused about why this works the way it does in this mod, I do have a basic understanding. The capacitor is a high pass filter; it blocks low frequencies but allows highs to pass through. Since we are installing the capacitor across the terminals, we are allowing those highs to go through the capacitor directly to ground, while the lows get blocked moving through the capacitor and as a result continue through the circuit into your amp. This explains why the mod results in less upper midrange sound on the pickup.

But, the main reason for the mod is to cut output, which I assume it does by lowering the total voltage getting through the cord as a result of cutting highs. This is where it gets confusing to me. The distortion on the yamahiko in my case is worst on the low E. I would think that cutting the lowest frequencies would be more effective at lowering the total voltage.

In terms of the capacitor value, the lower the value, the less effect it has because it’s cutting highs at a higher frequency. I assume that the only reason this mod works as well as it does (affecting volume primarily as opposed to tone) is because the high cut on these low value caps is high enough so that losing those frequencies doesn’t change the basic character of the sound of the double bass.

I don’t know if any of this is helpful to this discussion. What I notice in your photo is that your solder joints look cold, and I’m pretty sure what lowfreqgeek said about the solder shorting to ground is exactly right. You might try cutting off the plug and starting with a new plug so you can get everything physically connected, then make sure your iron is really hot, with the tip nice and clean and tightly connected.

One other thing, are you sure that’s a film capacitor? I don’t know much about this, but the film caps I bought look different than that. Apparently the film capacitors have better audio characteristics for this application.

 

[Francois Blais]

Liquid flux is for acid core soldering.
That's not what you want to use!
You want resin core soldering, and there's already resin flux into the core.
You also want to use only a little solder, there's too much in the picture, and it looks like cold soldering.
Get someone with proper soldering technique if you're not used to.

 

[lowfreqgeek]

Liquid flux is for acid core soldering.
That's not what you want to use!
You want resin core soldering, and there's already resin flux into the core.
You also want to use only a little solder, there's too much in the picture, and it looks like cold soldering.
Get someone with proper soldering technique if you're not used to.

There are MANY forms and formulations of liquid flux for both leaded and lead-free circuit applications. I should have been more clear, and you're right that some fluxes are for acid core soldering for plumbing applications, in both liquid and paste form. I'm not suggesting that an acid flux be used.

Assuming that regular lead solder is being used, you can use a resin flux to flow the existing solder so as to not add more solder to the joint. It can usually be purchased from an electronic components supplier. Just be careful to use a flux that is formulated for the type of solder being used.

I still do some old-fashioned resin-core lead soldering on older boards, but most of my soldering work is lead-free SMT components on PCBs, usually under a microscope. I have different solder and flux formulation for different purposes, which also requires an assortment of solder tips and tools so as to not contaminate. I'm no stranger to soldering.

 

[JBarz]

Direct to my Clarus head, to get the Yamahiko sounding like I wanted, I had to turn the Hi-Mid all the way down and twiddle some other stuff

I struggle with wanting all my knobs to point to 12 o’clock, but in all fairness - turning them is what they’re there for.

I don’t like the sound of my Yamahiko direct into my AI except at very low volumes for the same reason, but you’re right - turning the mids all the way down gives a very useable tone!

I used to use a Sushibox Slampegg + low gain tube with the highs and lows boosted as a preamp for the same effect. These days I use a Tonedexter 2.

Think of the the output of the Yamahiko is like a raw slate of granite — I think it’s ok to chip away at it, even dramatically, to get your desired tone ‘sculpture’ … with other pickups I’ve used I’ve had to have a more ‘additive’ approach to get the high end to match the low (struggling with this with my EUB right now, actually) and find that a much trickier problem to solve.

Regarding the solder — yeah, you can clean that up. Having a high quality soldering iron solves like 90% of the problems you might encounter getting it to flow the way you want, but in general “less is more”.

Curious about that different style cap you’ve got.

 

[DoubleMIDI]

The piezo acts as a voltage source in series with a capacitor (no, you cannot separate them) and the additional capacitor in series to ground reduces the voltage at the point between the two capacitors because of the capacitor divider.
It probably also raises the output impedance, so a high input impedance of the (pre-)amp should help.