100 watts tube sufficient?

[brianrost]

I used to gig with 20 watt and 50 watt tube amps in the past. But they were driving very efficient large 15" cabs which rolled off below 100 hZ but with lots of low mids. In other words, common bass amp rigs for the 1960s.

My 20 watter was only good for small bars, but it held it's own against drummers although I had the volume, bass and treble knobs all at 3:00 and it was definitely grinding and compressed. No dirt pedals needed

For me a V4B is loud enough for any bar gig with reasonable stage volume. No good for metal probably (unless you have at least an 8-10 or two 4-12s), and not clean. Fine for classic rock, country, blues, though. Big outdoor stages with no PA support? Then a V4B will be struggling.

 

[Raw N Low]

I have a 70's V4 (not the V4B) and with a 412 cab, can be heard and sound good. Every once in awhile I'll use a EBS classic 90 (90 watts) into a one or two Baer 112 cabs.

Cab efficiency and mid control is critical for definition not volume. Then again it really depends on the venue your playing at. I can make those rigs work for 90% of the bars I play at.

 

[LiquidMidnight]

Everybody's situation is different. I could make a 100 watt tube amp running clean work with PA support. Without PA support, I most likely wouldn't be successful if I want to keep it studio clean, even with a relatively efficient or large cabinet. And that's not because I play stupid loud. I find that getting a suitable, solid low-end base (no pun intended) eats up a fair amount of headroom that isn't going to go a long way with a 100 watt amp, regardless if it's tube or SS.

 

[Wisebass]

se an Ampeg V4B or a similar wattage tube amp, how are you getting along in your gigs?

Hi noelpaz

To answer that question? I get along fine! Always fine!

The V4B is on my top 2 list!

Easy EQ, very good "non coloured" clean sound and "ampegish" tube overdrive.

Do you have to mic it

This question can cause a war on TB!

IMO yes, but only when your cab has a big influence on your sound.

When you use a full range cab, you can be better off with a speaker level DI (DI after power tubes )

Stage volume for you and the band?

Loud? Well, let' s say loud enough with a wall of cabs! You need to push some air!
It' s not an SVT! (Which would be louder!)

Do you use it for power tube distortion and the stage volume is miced or controlled by the sound guys?

I am more of a clean player. I also play the upright.

When you are not into loud, hard and heavy and "super clean", 100 watt tube power can be enough!

You can get overdrive at low level!!! And if you want more clean headroom?

Get a cheap 10000000000000000000000 Wattt Class D Power amp to be louder! ( and a wall of cabs )



may the bass be with you

Wise(b)ass

 

[BogeyBass]

Used 50 watt and 100 watt bassmans
No problem. Tube head and a classic 1x15 is magic tone

Some guys complain they are too clean.

Sounds like the gigs you are doing and if a B15 worked for you. A V4B on a matching 2x12 would cover the gig. Either way a Mic or DI just stage volume.

With a sweet EV or a JBL dam right there is a Mic on it.

 

[hennessybass]

'77 Bassman 100 and a Berg CN212 was my main rig for many years.

The cab is a big piece of the puzzle when going with a lower tube amp. And your bands volume. And the design of the amp. Some break up early, and some stay clean.

 

[RissKippery]

I recently practiced with a 3 piece, borrowing a V4B with 2 Ampeg 410s and I was easily drowned out by the guitarist who was using a Marshall JMP full stack. We were playing Sabbath-y stuff. He didn't seem to be playing at an unreasonable volume. The V4B sounds really good when it's cranked up all the way, but didn't have the volume I needed to keep up.

 

[moogieotter]

In my world a 100W tube amp would be of no use at all!

Please describe this world. Thanks.

 

[higain617]

I ran a Music Man HD150 with a 2x15 for years. It could get pretty loud while staying clean (if wanted).

 

[Jim Carr]

Thanks for the reply folks. I do have Class D amps but there are V4B users correct? Are you guys gigging with it and if you are do you use something else for stage volume.

For the 1000 watt suggestion, where is your master volume at? At 1 or 2 or closer to max.

I play a lot of gigs. Psychobilly, Gospel, Reggae, Jazz. I use upright, active 5-string, passive 4.string, and drive a variety of 112, 212. 115, and 215 fearful cabs. Sometimes in PA, often not. The answer to "where is your master volume at?" is, "I set it where it needs to be." What else could the answer be?

 

[Jim Carr]

In my world a 100W tube amp would be of no use at all!

haha.

 

[coreyfyfe]

guitarist who was using a Marshall JMP full stack. We were playing Sabbath-y stuff. He didn't seem to be playing at an unreasonable volume.

I think you and I have different definitions of unreasonable volume. If a V4 through an 8x10 wasn't enough the marshall was probably loud. I've not heard many JMP full stacks played quietly, especially the 100 watt heads. But as has been said many a time, it works for some, not for everyone.

 

[LT131]

I used a V4B with a 2x15 cabinet for many years
Great tone but not enough clean headroom (for me) with 2 loud gtrs and drums
Great with softer music

This was my deal also. Great sound, not enough ponies. I fought it for a couple of years. It had to go and I do not regret it one bit other than what it would be worth now.

100 watts is a 100 watts and when it gets pushed, regardless of your cab/speakers, it won't keep up with a couple of well-armed guitarists and a frisky drummer.

 

[Korladis]

Depends how loud your band is, what places you play, how dirty you like your bass sounds, and most importantly, how loud your cab is.

I've used a 180 watt head primarily since 2010. I could probably get by just fine with a V4B. But I have a really loud cab and I like a lot of drive from my amp.

I would say a V4B would probably be sufficient for a typical bar band if you put it through a loud cab.

 

[kbakerde]

I've said it many times. I've played exactly 0 shows where a 100w tube amp and a 2x12 has not been sufficient. Anywhere I've played that might require more than that has full PA support. Most of the time I'm running a 100W about half volume and I'm asked to turn down.

 

[Korladis]

I've said it many times. I've played exactly 0 shows where a 100w tube amp and a 2x12 has not been sufficient. Anywhere I've played that might require more than that has full PA support. Most of the time I'm running a 100W about half volume and I'm asked to turn down.

I've even seen V4s used for doom metal. Usually through 810 cabs. They sound overdriven, but good.

 

[kbakerde]

I've even seen V4s used for doom metal. Usually through 810 cabs. They sound overdriven, but good.

And I'll admit that may be part of it. I never play fully clean. I usually have an always on OD anyway.

 

[logdrum]

Thanks for all the replies. I really like the Demeter pre and pairing it with a tube power amp is a treat as opposed to using it in the FX loop of the Mesas. The Peavey has 8 EL-84s but the ones in these amp are Sylvania Grey plates and they clip smoother than big tubes. But Peavey is definitely milking these power tubes and getting 12.5 watts out of one EL-84

I made some tube guitar amps in the last 5 years, nothing original just following schematics

My vision of a dream bass amp is a 2 channel pre, one SVT inspired and one studio type/Demeter and a bypassable class A tube power section. Then it has a D class re-amper/amp that can take the either power tube output or the pre-amplifier output. Switchable input impedance on the studio channel to accommodate piezo inputs. Tube driven FX loop. Jensen driven DI

So you a 15 watt tube output and a 500 + watt output from the 2 class D amp modules that can be run bridged or bi-amped for guys still doing crossover. Maybe someone already made it.

 

[Ric Vice]

Well not hifi clean. I used a B15 flip top before in the 90's.

As did I, but I’m an upright player and doubler.

 

[RissKippery]

I think you and I have different definitions of unreasonable volume. If a V4 through an 8x10 wasn't enough the marshall was probably loud. I've not heard many JMP full stacks played quietly, especially the 100 watt heads. But as has been said many a time, it works for some, not for everyone.

It was a smaller practice space. Typically if it's too loud in a smaller space it starts to hurt the ears. But you're correct, "too loud" is defined differently by many.